cam choice review..

[Icetech]

Why not try an STX20 from Racer Brown? He sent me one for my 4'x4.060" small block. 12:1 CNC heads with 2.08 intake on a 107 lsa.

$300 267/.570 with 1.6 rockers. The nose has ALOT of dwell...

Or: https://www.jegs.com/i/COMP-Cams/249/20-760-9/10002/-1?srsltid=AfmBOorMddQCxscesNIwOZ9JzPLQKjJmTPNgsqCEkLNrtfoYBXq8Iv6

Damn.. forgot bout racer brown.. was looking at cam companies today and they slipped my mind...

BTW.. anyone have a idea bout lifters? i know .800 or bigger wheel... the Bams he recommends are the steel sleeved badass ones.. but i can't choke down the $1400...

 

[dusterbing the peace]

yeah, i don't do any highway driving, it's literally 6 miles too and from work, just something to beat on

See what Jones would/might change with your revised rpm range. I think his lobes are designed better and you’ll have more area under the curve to play with.

 

[Icetech]

See what Jones would/might change with your revised rpm range. I think his lobes are designed better and you’ll have more area under the curve to play with.

yeah... hate to bug the guy but.. prolly will the 700 for the cam doesn't bug me as much as the lifters.. i just hate spending money

 

[dusterbing the peace]

yeah... hate to bug the guy but.. prolly will the 700 for the cam doesn't bug me as much as the lifters.. i just hate spending money

I can’t see you needing the steel sleeve version…FWIW, I went with the standard version (with offset seats because of my offset rockers). Would save ~$400 (which I think you know)

 

[SSG_Karg]

I really don’t mind that cam Jones recommended. I’m sure it would scream, if that’s what you’re after.

For comparison purposes, my 10.7-1cr W2-headed 422” stroker runs this cam :
https://www.howardscams.com/mechani...-273-340-360-2800-6800-howards-cams-712113-08

And these lifters:
3316SB SMALL BLOCK CHRYSLER

Only have one summer on it but so far, I love it. It's 95% street car with a dual plane intake and full length exhaust. Will melt the tires at will and pulls hard all the way to the 6500 rpm rev limiter.

Went 11.9x off the trailer without any kind of tuning.

 

[mopowers]

Doing some simple math I personally think for a nicely mannered street engine that is _way_ to much cam. Like was said if you care about numbers at 6700 RPM then great but with that compression and that cam it _really_ needs more like what PRH said about at 12:1 is way better to keep low RPM torque. That cam and 10:1 is only about 120 PSI cranking pressure. You are leaving at least 20-40 ft-lbs on the table at the RPM ranges you will be at 95% of the time on the street. With 10:1 and a nice 110 LSA (108 is better with poor flowing cast heads, good flowing heads typically are better with a larger LSA per Vizards tests and my modeling with Performance Trends), with a 235/240'ish@.050... you will get more in the 170 PSI cranking pressure that will keep the torque up at low RPM but give up peak HP at drag racing RPM. It is a balance. For me that original would be way to much cam for a nice street engine. Also if you have power brakes they will be about useless. The simple math says something like 7 inches of vacuum at idle.

My 2 cents take it for what it is worth.

How are you getting 120 psi cranking pressure with the combo? This is what Wallace shows for a 10.1:1 408 with an intake valve seat closing angle of 76* - which is what Jones' cam lobe profile chart shows for that intake lobe.

 

[Icetech]

I really don’t mind that cam Jones recommended. I’m sure it would scream, if that’s what you’re after.

For comparison purposes, my 10.7-1cr W2-headed 422” stroker runs this cam :
https://www.howardscams.com/mechani...-273-340-360-2800-6800-howards-cams-712113-08

And these lifters:
3316SB SMALL BLOCK CHRYSLER

Only have one summer on it but so far, I love it. It's 95% street car with a dual plane intake and full length exhaust. Will melt the tires at will and pulls hard all the way to the 6500 rpm rev limiter.

Went 11.9x off the trailer without any kind of tuning.

Good looking car, i am going to have him respec with a lower RPM.. was silly to go that high to start with..

 

[Illahe]

Damn.. forgot bout racer brown.. was looking at cam companies today and they slipped my mind...

BTW.. anyone have a idea bout lifters? i know .800 or bigger wheel... the Bams he recommends are the steel sleeved badass ones.. but i can't choke down the $1400...

Call Kevin at Schneider cams. They are shirttail cousins to Crower. Last time I spoke with him, he had access to roller lifters, if that's the route your going.

I have been very happy with the SFT patterns that they have sent me as well.

 

[Icetech]

Call Kevin at Schneider cams. They are shirttail cousins to Crower. Last time I spoke with him, he had access to roller lifters, if that's the route your going.

I have been very happy with the SFT patterns that they have sent me as well.

yeah, i looked at schneiders page today, they list poly and magnum, no LA or SFT or Solid roller cams.. they do list lifters with inboard bars though, wondering if they are comps or bam.. i don't think anyone else makes inboard ones

 

[Illahe]

yeah, i looked at schneiders page today, they list poly and magnum, no LA or SFT or Solid roller cams.. they do list lifters with inboard bars though, wondering if they are comps or bam.. i don't think anyone else makes inboard ones

Here:Schneider Racing Cams

They took the page down last year. They have a treasure trove of SFT patterns!

 

[Icetech]

Here:Schneider Racing Cams

They took the page down last year. They have a treasure trove of SFT patterns!

ahh.. i couldn't find it from their main page.... i really should do SFT.. but then i would always wish i had done roller

 

[Illahe]

ahh.. i couldn't find it from their main page.... i really should do SFT.. but then i would always wish i had done roller

I get it. Call Kevin and ask him what Solid Roller he recommends. Las time I spoke with him he had an LA roller cam core.

 

[Jim Kueneman]

How are you getting 120 psi cranking pressure with the combo? This is what Wallace shows for a 10.1:1 408 with an intake valve seat closing angle of 76* - which is what Jones' cam lobe profile chart shows for that intake lobe.

View attachment 1716511471

Long story but I don't have access to Performance Trends right now so I am using a but more crude method.... it give a range of 25 PSI so I picked the lowest it gave. It still think if all Icetech wants to do is drive it less than 10 miles a day for a daily driver that cam will get very old very fast IMHO.

Jim

 

[Icetech]

K.. emailing jones.. doing some research first on lifters.. interesting read here, guy makes a good case for needle bearings vs. Bushed.. at this point if i have to spend $400 more for bushed.. it is what it is, i will forget the money soon enough. Growing up broke makes it hard to let go of money in my old age

Make The Case: Bushed Lifters VS. Needle-Bearing Lifters

Even though both styles have been around for some time, the debate over these two lifter designs remains a hot-button topic in motorsports today. While many racers already have their minds made up, our advocates note that what makes one option superior to the other often comes down to the...

www.performanceracing.com

 

[Earlie A]

K.. emailing jones.. doing some research first on lifters.. interesting read here, guy makes a good case for needle bearings vs. Bushed.. at this point if i have to spend $400 more for bushed.. it is what it is, i will forget the money soon enough. Growing up broke makes it hard to let go of money in my old age

http://[URL]https://www.performance...case-bushed-lifters-vs-needle-bearing-lifters

[/URL]

Good read. Thanks. We are using the DLC bushed BAM lifters in the Ritter dyno mule motor. Also setting up a pair of TF heads with PAC 1238X and/or 1237X springs. These springs are 1.28 OD vs the 1.545 OD of a standard TF spring. These little springs are impressive.

 

[Icetech]

Good read. Thanks. We are using the DLC bushed BAM lifters in the Ritter dyno mule motor. Also setting up a pair of TF heads with PAC 1238X and/or 1237X springs. These springs are 1.28 OD vs the 1.545 OD of a standard TF spring. These little springs are impressive.

View attachment 1716511568

View attachment 1716511569

Wow those are skinny, i am curious how making them with less diameter changes fatigue values.. I have never done much with heads other than assembly/lapping valves and such.. i need to learn about which retainers/locks and all of that as i go.

 

[Earlie A]

Wow those are skinny, i am curious how making them with less diameter changes fatigue values.. I have never done much with heads other than assembly/lapping valves and such.. i need to learn about which retainers/locks and all of that as i go.

I don't know the answer to the fatigue question, but the smaller spring is a lot less mass to control. Will allow for a much smaller retainer as well. Spring technology has apparently come a long way recently. I'm hoping to try both sets of springs on the motor up to 7000 rpm and see if the 1237X is enough to control the valvetrain. The 1238X is more in line with normal solid roller recommendations.

 

[Icetech]

I don't know the answer to the fatigue question, but the smaller spring is a lot less mass to control. Will allow for a much smaller retainer as well. Spring technology has apparently come a long way recently. I'm hoping to try both sets of springs on the motor up to 7000 rpm and see if the 1237X is enough to control the valvetrain. The 1238X is more in line with normal solid roller recommendations.

Have you weighed them compared to a 1.55 or other spring?

 

[Icetech]

Ok... gonna bite the bullet and get the bushed bams... i had 1 motor get destroyed by comp rollers coming apart once already, having a bushed lifter give me a warning and just wipe a lifter/cam sounds much better in the long run.

I am putting stupid money into a motor that will make the same power as a 440 with cam/headers

 

[SixPaksRule]

I will give one cent...another overcammed street driven stoker engine.

 

[Earlie A]

Have you weighed them compared to a 1.55 or other spring?

TF 157g
1238X 89.3g
1237X 93.4g

 

[Icetech]

I will give one cent...another overcammed street driven stoker engine.

I am having the cam respeced for lower rpm and should be a bit nicer..

 

[Icetech]

ugh.. that hurts... gonna be like $2800 for valve train ****.. i hate spending money Paid off my house about 6 months ago.. so it's not that big of a deal.. Just burned into my soul to not waste it.. and this car is nothing but a money pit

 

[Earlie A]

What rocker?

 

[Icetech]

What rocker?

using the mancini HS ones.. 1.5rr