Correct Oil Filter for SB

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bwhitejr

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I have a 360 with the 90 deg angle adapter installed. And was wondering if I have the correct oil filter installed. I am experiencing low oil pressure and wonder if it could be caused by the wrong oil filter. It currently has a Wix 51515.

Also is there a way to determine if you have adequate oil pressure on lifter galleys?

bwhitejr
 
Unless the filter is defective and is restricting oil flow the filter won't have anything to do with oil pressure.

If you are using the stock gauge to measure your oil pressure I would verify the pressure with another guage. Factory instrumentation is notoriously in accurate.
 
That's actually a Ford filter but will work fine. They use the same thread and gasket size so their interchangable. I use it because it's longer and holds more oil. Your oil sending unit that screws in the top of the block under the dist. comes right off the lifter galley so what it says there is what is at the lifters.

What is your oil pressure? Also what's the condition of the engine? New, a few miles, or a ton of miles.
 
It is a freshly rebuilt '78 block 1 hr running total. When it starts it has 35-40 lbs of oil pressure. When it warms up at idle it has 5-10lbs (hard to be exact 0-100 psi scale). When revved it gets ups to 25-30lbs when warm. I am going to use a machanical gauge and check it this weekend. The electric sender is new and is hooked up to an external oil pressure gauge.

I was curious about the lifter galley on the driver side of the engine. It looks like it is in series with the front crank bearing. So that the pressure measured on the passenger side, may not be the pressure on the driver side lifter galley.

bwhitejr
 
bwhitejr said:
It is a freshly rebuilt '78 block 1 hr running total. When it starts it has 35-40 lbs of oil pressure. When it warms up at idle it has 5-10lbs (hard to be exact 0-100 psi scale). When revved it gets ups to 25-30lbs when warm. I am going to use a machanical gauge and check it this weekend. The electric sender is new and is hooked up to an external oil pressure gauge.

I was curious about the lifter galley on the driver side of the engine. It looks like it is in series with the front crank bearing. So that the pressure measured on the passenger side, may not be the pressure on the driver side lifter galley.

bwhitejr
Click to expand...

Thats really low oil pressure.
1 time In the early days I didn't clean a block & crank, basically had lots of metal shavings go through the block but when I took it apart the main bearing had a valley dug through them, but I still had good oil pressure cold= 65-75psi but when getting of the freeway or hard driving [oil hot] the pressure would drop to 18-20psi.

So it sounds like a loose galley plug or bad oil pump.
 
There are 2 at each side of the lifter galley in the back, you can get to them with manifold off or motor out going through the back of the motor where there are 2 access plugs to take out to get to the 2 galley plugs.
There are also plugs behind the oil filter under the plate or 90* adapter.
There is a pressed plug right under the oil pump hopefully they installed the new one or in a lot of cases left it alone all together.
There are also 2 pressed in plugs behind the cam thrust plate and that I've seen before where they left them out and it bled of lots of oil pressure.

But there have been some crappy built pumps so it seems lately,
[bad clearances] I have had 1 seize up so far but at the same time 100's that were fine.
 
I stopped by at lunch to my mechanic he said the problem could be that with the HV pump and a stock oil pan, all the oil gets pumped to the top of the engine. So it will start up with good oil pressure but soon drop down to very low, because there is no oil in the pan. He suggested a deep oil pan to go with the HV oil pump. I guess a check of this theory would be to start it up, wait till the oil pressure drops, check the oil level, wait 15 minutes, then start it again. If we have good oil pressure again then that could be the cause.

Anyone have similar experiences? Does this sound right? Anyone ever heard of it happening?

bwhitejr
 
The plug on the drivers side at the back of the engine for the lifter galley is just an access plug, the one on the passenger side seals the galley. The actual plug that seals the galley on the drivers side is in the block. Pull the distributor and look down in the block to the drivers side toward the front and you should see the plug. If its loose or was never installed there will be little or no oil getting to the lifters on the drivers side. Unfortunately if its loose or missing the engine will need to come out of the car to tighten.

The HV pump can empty a stock pan but it should be happening at idle. A more correct fix would be to put a standard volume pump in, there is really no reason to me using an HV pump unless you are going to be running in excess of 6000 rpm all the time.
 
wix's oil filter had a problem with rubber gasket under the base where it scerws on something off set with holes and or being crimped to tight but really only became a problem with the use of a filter magnet that wraps a round the filter the debri collects around the magnet and the gasket and won't let oil flow correct I been told this by 2 of my parts rep's
 
340sFastback said:
Not likely the HV pump is causing this problem.
Click to expand...

I agree 100%

The HV pump is most likely the only reason why you have pressure at all being you have leakage somewhere. A stock pump might not have been able to keep up with the leakage.


Chuck
 
Since it's an electric gauge I'd definetly check it with a known good mechanical gauge first. I've seen allot of problems with electric senders not reading right. Sometimes due to being mismatched with the gauge. I used to believe that a hv pump can empty a stock pan at high rpm's but have since changed my mind due to an article written by Mopar performance back in the late 70's where they tested the flow of a stock volume pump vs. a high volume pump and found that with the stock pickup the hv pump could flow no more than the stock vol pump cause the pickup was a restriction.

Your cold pressure is really low for a hv pump. It sure sounds like an internal plug was left out. The one on the left rear oil galley seems to get missed allot. You can pull the dist. and look down through the hole to see if it's in there like DSC said. I believe you could put it in just by taking off the intake though but I'm not positive. Been awhile since I looked at one.
 
Like Fishy said. Really low for a Hv pump. My 72 318 runs cold in the 75 to 80 range and hot lowest at 40 lbs. The filter i use on the 318 is a Fram PH43. Not a mechanic but i would definitley shut it down till resolved. I'll be watching and learning. Keep us posted. Good luck.
 
Get a good mechanical gauge, pull the distributor and distributor drive gear, and use a priming rod to turn the oil pump while you diagnose the problem.
 
Do you have all the gaskets installed on the 90 degree filter adapter? There should be three. You can check the pressed in plug by putting a wire down through the oil gauge sending unit hole and measuring it. It should be about 7 inches long, if my memory is right. I'm sure someone here knows what that number should be. That plug gets left out alot if the machinest is not a Mopar guy.
 
Spent the weekend working on the 360 and collected some numbers. First of all replaced the 90 deg adapter with the stock setup and a PH43 filter. Installed a mechanical gauge and confirmed it reads the same as the electrical gauge.

Here are the numbers:

Inital start up: 12 lbs
Idle: 12-17 lbs
Instantaneous Rev: 35 lbs
Idle after Rev: 12-15 lbs
2000 RPM: 35 lbs maintanied
3500 RPM: 45 lbs maintained

bwhitejr
 
I know it sounds low but they say 10lbs for every 1000rpms is enough. That said I had a 340 that did the same thing and it scared the crap out of me.
 
bwhitejr said:
Spent the weekend working on the 360 and collected some numbers. First of all replaced the 90 deg adapter with the stock setup and a PH43 filter. Installed a mechanical gauge and confirmed it reads the same as the electrical gauge.

Here are the numbers:

Inital start up: 12 lbs
Idle: 12-17 lbs
Instantaneous Rev: 35 lbs
Idle after Rev: 12-15 lbs
2000 RPM: 35 lbs maintanied
3500 RPM: 45 lbs maintained

bwhitejr
Click to expand...

A agree with Adam of the old rule that you do only need 10 lbs per 1k rpm but knowing mopars usually run 60+ lbs. with a HV pump and new engine like you have it sure sounds like something is wrong.

BTW: a response to an earlier concern of yours about how the reading may be different from the left to the right side of the lifter galley. I'ts possible but unlikely. Actually where your sending unit screws into the block under the dist. is plumbed straight down to where the oil filter output goes back into the block so your really reading right off the oil filter.

I go back to checking for missing plugs. The one on the left lifter galley under the intake like we mentioned earlier and the one straight down from the oil sending unit. To check for that one you can remove the sender and stick a coat hanger down the hole. It should only go down 6-7/8 to 7". Any more than that and that plug is missing.
 
Thanks for all the responses.

My son checked to see if the one at 7" from the distributor shaft was in place and it was.

If it turns out that the plugs we can get to are all in place. What would be the next most likely cause for relatively low oil pressure? Worn lifter bores? Is there any chance that the thing will get better oil pressure as it breaks in. The engine comes to temperature fairly quickly, so there may be some breaking in to go yet.

bwhitejr
 
Not sure if this is relevant, but I had a friend with a 426 stroker had low pressure after the dyno, and found small crack in the pick up tube.
 
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