Help Needed: Rocker Arm Identification and more

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JoesEdge said:
Oh, gotcha. So you're trying to determine if the valves are all the same length?
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Yes, stem heights. There can be some variance from a valve seat being cut deeper than another.

I have a raw set of 360 heads on the shelf that I pulled and just for giggles I put a straight edge on them and they are all over the place. Some a good 1/8" lower or higher, whichever way you look at it, yikes.
 
RustyRatRod said:
No, trying to determine if the valve stem height is the same. That's how deep the valves sit in their seats.
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Ok, now I think I fully understand. So even all the valves were the same length, depending on where they sit in the seat (farther sunk for instance) then that would determine the height of the spring, right? At least that's how I'm understanding it.

So, let's say the valve stems (or spring heights?) aren't the same? Then what?

Thanks!
 
Shims for the spring pressure, but I prefer getting the valve stem height correct, which requires disassembly, of course. Some people say it's anal to do it, but with a non adjustable factory valve train, it's pretty critical, IMO.
 
Ok, so I had a my son take a little video to illustrate how much "play" some of the rockers have. Of course, because he's a kid he didn't follow my instructions on actually rocking the arms to try to illustrate how much "lash" they have.

Anyway, hopefully this should give you and idea. I keep wondering if this is the noise that I hear when the engine is running. I had wondered if the noise was piston slap or valve train. I guess I'll find out when I get these adjusted right.

[ame]http://youtu.be/_y77YhRjFEo[/ame]
 
dano said:
FYI those look just like the Comp Magnums I have. They are no longer made.

Here is a second set I sold with pictures for reference.

http://www.forabodiesonly.com/mopar/showthread.php?t=229588
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Thanks! So at least now I know they are a good quality brand. I actually found an old Mopar Muscle article that had a picture of them. I was like "they look exactly the same!" I was worried they were sub par rockers. Now I can at least call them up and ask them for adjustment advice.

Here's the photo I found:

http://www.moparmusclemagazine.com/techarticles/engine/mopp_0411_competition_cams/photo_02.html

And yeah, the ones you sold look pretty similar. Cool!
 
JoesEdge said:
Where would those go? Under the shaft bolts?
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no they go along side the rocker body on the actual rocker shaft. they are used to shim the rockers so the roller tip aligns center of the valve head. you want .030 side to side movement between the rockers. take a picture of the under side of the rockers..... i wanna see how much the adjuster is hanging out he bottom of the rocker. i think you have too short of a push rod and the adjusters are way out. you should only have 1-2 threads showing out the bottom of the rocker.

here is what i would do:

pull the entire rocker assembly off the head one side at a time.

make sure the oil holes in the rocker shaft are pointing downward

put a straight edge along the top of the valves and see if they are all at the same height. if they are all over the place then its either sunk valve seats or shitty machine work on the heads.

if they are straight across or pretty dang close then i would buy a set of MATCHING quality rocker arm adjusters and start over. i would get a set of new hold downs and a set of the rocker arm shims and shim the rockers so that they line up center of the valve stem and have .030 of side to side movement between rocker bodies.

then i would adjust your valve lash with the intake off. not knowing your cam sucks but if its a solid mech. lifter i would set lash at .018. most solid cams run between .016 and .021 so that is in the middle.
 

younggun2.0 said:
no they go along side the rocker body on the actual rocker shaft. they are used to shim the rockers so the roller tip aligns center of the valve head. you want .030 side to side movement between the rockers. take a picture of the under side of the rockers..... i wanna see how much the adjuster is hanging out he bottom of the rocker. i think you have too short of a push rod and the adjusters are way out. you should only have 1-2 threads showing out the bottom of the rocker.

here is what i would do:

pull the entire rocker assembly off the head one side at a time.

make sure the oil holes in the rocker shaft are pointing downward

put a straight edge along the top of the valves and see if they are all at the same height. if they are all over the place then its either sunk valve seats or shitty machine work on the heads.

if they are straight across or pretty dang close then i would buy a set of MATCHING quality rocker arm adjusters and start over. i would get a set of new hold downs and a set of the rocker arm shims and shim the rockers so that they line up center of the valve stem and have .030 of side to side movement between rocker bodies.

then i would adjust your valve lash with the intake off. not knowing your cam sucks but if its a solid mech. lifter i would set lash at .018. most solid cams run between .016 and .021 so that is in the middle.
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Thanks for the advice. By the time I get out of work, it's nearly dark so I have my son take pictures. I don't trust him with removing the rocker shaft so that's going to have to wait until Saturday.

So, how do I adjust it if it's not a solid lifter? Let's say there's too much thread showing, I'll need longer pushrods? Would I need to get an adjustable pushrod in order to get the right measurement to order pushrods?
 
JoesEdge said:
Where would those go? Under the shaft bolts?
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by the size of the hole and the fact you are asking about side clearance on the rockers...

I would say they go between the rockers and between the spacers as needed to align the roller over the valve stem.
 
if it is a solid cam....why not measure the lash on an intake and exhaust valve before you tear it apart...lash on cams can vary depending on the manufacturer and especially the design of the ramp...
 
Ok, so I pulled a lifter out over the weekend. So it looks to be solid lifters. So, this may explain why my valve train was so noisy.

I also put a straight edge across the valve tips, and they weren't all even but they didn't seem too far apart. I didn't have a feeler gauge to really measure though.

I'm not crazy about the solid lifter cam assembly for a daily driver so, I'm thinking about swapping it to hydraulic. I prefer something maintenance free. Also, not sure which lifter to get. Standard or anti-pump up.

So I have a few questions:

  1. What tools and gaskets would I need to perform the swap?
  2. Will my rockers work with a hydralic setup?
  3. Will I need new pushrods?

I'm looking at the Comp Camps XE268H cam or something comparable from Lunati (not sure which part number would be comparable). Those two manufacturers seem to be popular here especially that specific cam grind. Lunati did recommend me a cam that must be comparable to Comp Cams 262 grind.

I've attached a couple pics of the lifters.

Thanks!
 

Attachments

Okay, so I just got done placing an order through Mancini Racing for a new camshaft. After reading the good reviews for the XE268H grind from Comp Cams, that's what I decided to go with along with the new hydraulic lifters.

I also learned that my cam lobe lift is around .378 inches. I figured this out by rigging a dial indicator on the push rod and spinning the engine over a few times for accuracy. It hit right about that number each time.

I also learned that I had a double roller timing chain. I decided to reuse it because it's pretty tight with virtually no slack. There's no tensioner and I didn't go with one. Although I did order an oil slinger since one was not present.

Unfortunately, I won't get these parts in time to work on it this weekend. If I ordered through Summit I know it would be here quick, but I wanted to be able to talk to experienced MOPAR people that I can call if I have a question. I guess that's the extra value.

My only worry right now is if my valve springs are too tight for the XE268H camshaft. I don't have a method to check that.

Wish me luck!!
 
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