Hood clearance, big wrench in cog

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mopar head

mopar head

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I recently answered a thread about hood clearance, with rpm air gap intake, with Holley ST. Avenger carb I believe, with 340. I told him mine just cleared, but breather nut was just into insulation, No prob imo. I`ve been recently researching thermoquads and read a good point, that didn`t occur to me, at install. Concerned mostly of clearance of hitting hood. The author warned of drop base air cleaners and choke towers being too close to lid causeing ritch idle due to lack of space and airflow. Well this got the greymatter churning. Sure enough I had to use EDE. drop base,2.5" K+N element, actually 2.25". I checked operation of everything initionaly, and that all choke componets operated freely, They did, BUT, upon closer inspection, I can see when choke blade is fully open, its rubbing lid. I`ve come to the conclusion, this baby could use more air, but I`m at its limits. I have an 1/2" spacer but prefer to keep it for isolation purposes, mainly. Also long duration cam will compound Idle signal. right? I`m open to all input with this grief. I have a spare hood and willing to go to scoop, but like the sleeper look, Would rather keep and try to use and work with what I have. Then try to adjust or modify carb once breather clearance issues are resolved, and maintain streetability. Heck if I had a scoop I`d run a 5" filter if possible. I`d appreciate input and Pics of all you guys 67-8 barracudas with hood scoops of any style, with exception of chev cowl induction, even though I finally got to see one in this forum, Looks pretty good but Id preferr a factory style scoop8-[ Another thing that concernes me about scoop is getting caught in rain:angry7: If anyone`s running a modern fresh air system, can you give a measurement of base to top of hat? thanks
 
Just the regular RPM does not set that high compared to the Air Gap RPM correct?

I have a 67 cuda and always wondered about this. I'm running a Performer right now. I might go with a RPM in the furture another words.

bump to the top
 
I am having the same issue. I went from a high rise to a lower intake, put the drop base air cleaner on and the choke kept getting stuck on the top of the lid. I considered the K&N, but thought it would probably not solve the choke problem and may not even help with airflow so close to the hood.
I ended up with a small air cleaner and removed the base to make it fit- no wing nut, just a nut- I hate it.
I was thinking of a fresh air system, but I would still be dealing with the same 2 inches above the carb, (if that).
Saving for a fiberglass hood so I can put a real air cleaner on it and move some air; but I would also prefer a stock look.

4.JPG
 
The more I think about it, there is more space behind the carb than in front; possibly a fresh air system similar to the 409 Impalas?
 
mullinax95 said:
Just the regular RPM does not set that high compared to the Air Gap RPM correct?

I have a 67 cuda and always wondered about this. I'm running a Performer right now. I might go with a RPM in the furture another words.

bump to the top
Click to expand...
Couldn`t tell you as of now. My current setp runs great @ higher rpms, but suffers ritch idle.

Judge Mills said:
Would the K&N flowtop help?

http://www.jegs.com/i/K&N/599/66-1401/10002/-1
Click to expand...
No, cause lid is at insulation now. Tomorrow I`ll check old hood and see how much extra space I can get without insulation, but if I can gain an inch, I maybe could go with a 3" filter and that lid, and would be a possible fix? Hummm:scratch:
 
matthon said:
The more I think about it, there is more space behind the carb than in front; possibly a fresh air system similar to the 409 Impalas?
Click to expand...
That would be interesting to see, post pic. But I`d prefer not to chevyize car in any way. And would prefer to keep this airgap. awesome intake and carb combo for street. I have no choke linkage problems, being electric choke. One pro for cowl induction, I`d believe motor would fair better if in rain. Plus I rather have a scoop hood, than cut into cowlbox. For reasons that I enjoy having my cowl provided, floor vents. and having black interior and no AC:-D If tapping into cowlbox fumes would surely reek in car, plus heat system needs this fresh air intake. This is a fair weather, year round st.car.
 
Very interesting.

So what you are saying is a Holley choke sits higher in the air-cleaner than a Eddelbrock choke ? And then gets caught on the top of the (drop base) air-cleaner ?

I am going to have to check this out on my Dart. 670 Street Avenger with a 1970 340 air-cleaner.
 
Johnny Dart said:
Very interesting.

So what you are saying is a Holley choke sits higher in the air-cleaner than a Eddelbrock choke ? And then gets caught on the top of the (drop base) air-cleaner ?

I am going to have to check this out on my Dart. 670 Street Avenger with a 1970 340 air-cleaner.
Click to expand...
You might be ok, my breather element is only 2.25" and aftermarket lid doesn`t have much of a peak in center. Lid close to top makes perfectly good sense, it would suffer airflow. secondaries are a lot lower, no problem. I think I have plenty intake "area", Just that lid is too close to choke tower as stated. Do you have a ritch idle That can`t be adjusted out? Follow this thread. Even with more "area" I still may have to resort to drilling air bleeds in throttle plates to lean this Idle circut out. One thing at a time.
 
When it first happened, I could not figure it out- changed the plugs, checked the fuel, pulled the air cleaner and there it was.
Here is a pic of the chevy, not the greatest pic but you can see how the air comes from the cowl. I am no expert on these cars, so my assumption is since what you state makes sense, they must have done something to prevent fumes from entering the interior, (or maybe not?).
I would not want to chevyize my car either, or cut into the cowl, I am just in the same boat and trying to think of an alternative to a new hood.
I was also thinking, like a Thunderbolt/442 setup on a much smaller scale.

1961-chevrolet-impala-ss-409-4.jpg


THUNDERBOLT2.jpg
 
Maybe one of these would be shorter?
nova_uhbig.jpg

This is on Procharger's web site. One of these with a conical clamp-on filter element, maybe? I'm aware that this comes dangerously close to a Ricer look.

Kinda like this:
spe-252_cp.jpg
 
matthon said:
When it first happened, I could not figure it out- changed the plugs, checked the fuel, pulled the air cleaner and there it was.
Here is a pic of the chevy, not the greatest pic but you can see how the air comes from the cowl. I am no expert on these cars, so my assumption is since what you state makes sense, they must have done something to prevent fumes from entering the interior, (or maybe not?).
I would not want to chevyize my car either, or cut into the cowl, I am just in the same boat and trying to think of an alternative to a new hood.
I was also thinking, like a Thunderbolt/442 setup on a much smaller scale.
Click to expand...
Yes I looked at these too. But who knows the dimension from base to top of lid. They look taller than what I have now. Some apps. I seen guys had to remove battery. And I really dont like the look of large hoses in bay, just me.. I `m looking for the most cost effective fix and not sacrifice any performance this carb and intake has given me. The best its ever run:-D. AS stated I have a beater hood, Haven`t priced scoops yet, but I dont know, guess I`ll sleep on it, and maybe more people will chime in with a brilliant idea:-D
 
That might do it for me, if it had an inlet on both sides, might be less of a rice look.
I think I am still leaning towards a new hood and bigger air cleaner, if I can find a cheap hood.
 
fourspeed said:
Maybe one of these would be shorter?
nova_uhbig.jpg

This is on Procharger's web site. One of these with a conical clamp-on filter element, maybe? I'm aware that this comes dangerously close to a Ricer look.

Kinda like this:
spe-252_cp.jpg
Click to expand...
Yea, now if only a member with one of these hats would give me a height measurement. as stated in start of thread. Thanks guys We`ll continue tomorrow I `m out, later
 
i know ford used it, but it's actually a classic hot rod design.... a teardrop hood would solve your issues. also, maybe taking out the heat pad, modifying the hood's frame, and then putting the hood back on would help too. is there a piece of the frame in the way of the cleaner? take a look, might be able to change that.

iirc, the thunderbolts had openings in the back of the teardrop, solving the water issue as long as the car is moving. you could always block them off when you're in the rain too.
 
Thanks to all responders. I removed heat pad and tested for 3" filter, It just clears. Got another high$ k+n filter, drove, and did a proper burnout, no signs of touching hood:cheers:, plugs are burning clean:-D Now I just hope I dont break a motor mount, and my hood paint does`nt get scorched!
 
I too have a 68 barracuda with the air gap on a 360. I thought I was being clever using a K&N fliter top with a 2" element since the top would let enough extra air in right? NOT! At least not if it is snug within 1/2" against the hood!! Also the K&N is a FLAT underside (not domed) and with a 2" element there is less that 1/2" of "air room" around the carb venturi. If it had a normal domed lid would probably work better but would also likely hit the hood.

This is a new build and there is no choke (summer-mobile only) so no issues there, but I was having fits with it starving for air and horrible perfromance under load. After checking usual suspects I happen to take a test run with breather off and OMG :cheers: problem solved... well sort of. Now I need to find an aftermarket setup that has best drop and tallest filter to get some flow. I'll post that in a new thread if no older ones exist.
 
I just bought a cheap drop base air cleaner off of e-bay, it was zinc coated with a filter for $25.
I put a much bigger filter on it and painted it black, and it does not hit the hood and there is room to spare.
I am happy with it, but the more I think about it, the more I want cold air, the under hood temp is very high due to the exhaust manifolds.
Currently my heater fan does not work, and I don't even need it.

DSC04108.JPG
 
matthon said:
I just bought a cheap drop base air cleaner off of e-bay, it was zinc coated with a filter for $25.
Click to expand...

Do you remember what the drop is in inches and is that a 4" element? IT looks like you hve something other than an air gap but could be wrong. Thanks!
 
Something has to give, either ditch the big spacer, or drop to a shorter intake.
Not a damned thing wrong with "Chevyizing" or "ricing" YOUR ride, if the mods make it perform better, or correctly, with the components you want to use.

You can bet the factory didn't care when they engineered one-off pieces to get something to work, why should anyone else?

When I put the 360 magnum in the '68 Dart with all the EFI pieces, the air cleaner just rubbed the hood, but I had an MP aluminum unit, which may have been taller than a stock Magnum one.
It was irritating to see the wrinkle finish all ruined, but not a lot I could do, it was fine with the engine at rest, but it was ruined when the engine twisted in the mounts under load.

Mark.
 
blufie
i have a 68 barracuda wirh a 360/380 crate engine which uses an m-1 manifold.i found i had no clerance with a tall k&n filter but what i did find is that if your using the biscut style motor mount i could adjust the engine a good inch in the slots of the motor mount. lowering the the engine a 1/2 inch if someone could may save some trouble.
terry
 
blufie said:
Do you remember what the drop is in inches and is that a 4" element? IT looks like you hve something other than an air gap but could be wrong. Thanks!
Click to expand...
I think it was advertised as a 2 inch drop, but it is more like 1 1/2.
The element is a 4 inch.
The intake is an air gap, it is a Weiand.
 
matthon said:
The more I think about it, there is more space behind the carb than in front; possibly a fresh air system similar to the 409 Impalas?
Click to expand...

It looks like there is more space to the rear but look at the hood. The air cleaner is real close to the rear cross support of the inner hood frame. If you try to go to the rear you will hit that. I have the same problem with my EFI setup. Between the height of the mainfold and the throttle body the air cleaner hits the hood. When I set up the car I put a scoop on it thinking it would clear but the cross support hits the back of the air cleaner top by about a 1/2 inch. Sucks.
 
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