Kevlar, Ceramic brakes. ???

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fishy68

fishy68

Tyr Fryr's Inc.
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I'd like to improve the braking of my 68 Cuda that has non-power disc's up front (from a 74 Dart) and the stock 10x1.75 drums out back although I don't want to install a booster. I've seen Kevlar and Ceramic brakes listed for it on E-bay. Has anyone had any experience with them? I know Kevlar is used on bands in racing transmissions and has a higher co-efficient of holding power.

I've also heard the ceramic pads are supposed to have more holding power but I put a set on my Dakota and if there was a difference it sure wasn't much but that could be because it is power brakes and harder to tell the difference.

The braking isn't really that bad going down the road but when I load up the converter I can't get the full stall out of it because no matter how hard I stomp the brake pedal it won't hold it back.

Here's the Kevlar ones I'm looking at.

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&ih=013&sspagename=STRK%3AMEWA%3AIT&viewitem=&item=230107454552&rd=1,1
 
a guy i trust at a local auto shop,, tells me,, using ceramic pads on a set or rotors not designed for them,,the rotors seem to be cracking for some reason,, i dont remember what all he told me,, but i have 2002 dodge ram,,i wanted to ry them on,, he told me,, those rotors cast a small fortune,, i would nt chance it,, just passing it along,,ask a brake mechanic,, not a no it al at a parts store,,,hope this helps,,,
i have a 66 cuda,, manual disc/read drum brake set up,stock 76 dart calipers,rotors, was useing a stock master for that car also and it worked great,,,now i have a mopar performance master cylinder 15/16 bore,,manual,, this car stops beter at 100 mph then any abs brake car,,
 
Thanks for the info fstfish. I have had the ceramic pads on my 02 Dakota for about 15,000 miles now and I just looked at the rotors about a month ago and they don't look like their hurt any. It would surprise me if the original pads were ceramic. Maybe I got lucky and my rotors are designed to handle them.

Which master cyl. did you have on your Cuda before switching? Was it the single resovoir or a dual one?

Yeah I know better than to ask the monkey's at the local parts stores. Once in awhile you can find one that actually knows what he's doing but most don't know shinola from, well you know!!
 
orignally i used a auto store rebuilt daul master for 76 dart,, worked great,,,switched to the mopar perfomance when i re painted the car,,if you choose to do that,,make sure you use the 15/16 bore from mopar,,also you will need the 4 to 2 bolt mounting adapter. and the adjustable push rod,, and that will have to be shortened,,,but the cast iron daul master,, works great,,rewquires no...adapting,,,, bolts in,, and is way cheaper then the mopar perofrmance master,,
 
Yeah I have the cast iron dual master. The one with a larger back resovoir and smaller front resovoir. It does work fine for normal braking. It just don't want to hold the car good enough to load up the converter properly.

Thanks again fstfish. BTW: That's sure one sharp ride. I assume the dark ones yours. The Hemi under glass car sure is a blast to see going down the track.
 
You don't need special rotors for ceramic pads, I put them on my '99 Ram and loved'em. No rotor damage at all ( and those were the original rotors W/ 100K on them). The first chance I get I'm putting them on my '05... It doesn't need brakes but the dust is killing me. The '05 only has 18K on it. Another myth about ceramic pads is that they wear out rotors faster....false they don't. When you start getting into the more agressive pads (Ex. Kevlar) you will see more rotor wear due to the agressive nature of the material. If you realy want better braking that is dependable you want to go with:
Option A = Power brakes, ceramic pads, drilled and sloted rotors ( they disipate the heat faster, eliminate " gassing", stay cooler for longer life and less chance of warpage).
Option B = Bigger brakes, Larger rotors (drilled and or sloted would be prefered), bigger calipers ( four or six piston, kits can be had through Willwood, Bear, SSBC, Ect., Etc.), and a good set of pads.
How fast do you want to stop and how much are you willing to change on your car? On my '68 I'm putting factory disc brakes on the front with the stock 10" drums out back, non power, "If" I go with anything better I'm only willing to change to drilled and sloted rotors. I'm also not planing on doing alot of agressive driving with it.... got to have some fun but i'm not going to treat it like it's a new car and can be replaced any time.
 
Your question Intrigues me. I think everyone here is dodging your initial concern. If you are trying to find a brake to hold back your car to the adevtised stall speed of the converter you are looking for the wrong brake. What you need is a tranny brake and a 2 step limiter. Those advertised stalls are as a flash not an increasing amount of torque load being brought up against the brakes. I don't think any combo will do what your looking for, you just need to realize the limits of your holding RPM, and know that if its pushing car there then you are not getting any flash of the converter.
 
9secSmallBlock said:
Your question Intrigues me. I think everyone here is dodging your initial concern. If you are trying to find a brake to hold back your car to the adevtised stall speed of the converter you are looking for the wrong brake. What you need is a tranny brake and a 2 step limiter. Those advertised stalls are as a flash not an increasing amount of torque load being brought up against the brakes. I don't think any combo will do what your looking for, you just need to realize the limits of your holding RPM, and know that if its pushing car there then you are not getting any flash of the converter.
Click to expand...

I wasn't expecting just a pad and shoe change would hold the car back to the advertised stall. I may not have a 9 second car but I'm pretty familiar with how converters are rated. I agree that a trans brake and a 2 step would solve the problem of the stall issue but I'm on a low budget and don't race often enough to warrant that. As I look at my original post I can see where you construed it to think I was saying the brakes should hold it back to the advertised stall. That's not what I meant.

I'm just looking for SOME improved braking without installing a booster (don't want to loose the space). That's why I asked if anyone had used the type of pads and shoes I mentioned and if they did how did they like them. Maybe that's why everyone is "dodging my initial concern". Because that's not what I meant and they didn't read it that way.
 
At what kind of RPM are you starting to push with the current combo? I'll give you a for example. Last season I had my primary trans go bad and borrowed a non transbrake trans to compete the rest of the weekend. While doing this I had to footbrake car cause the trans was not set up to run brake. I had turned my 2 step down to 3000 rpm and had to absolutely kill the brake pedal to hold it back. Brakes are aeroquip 2 piston fronts with drilled rotors and the large dana 60 shoes in the rear. The converter is also an 8" 5500 stall dynamic. I was not trying to be insulting when I posted I just think IMO no brake system is gonna hold back much more than 2500 rpm with most street driven converters.
 
I have to stand on the brake pedal to hold it at 2200-2300 so if yours barely held it at 3000 and you have a 5500 converter and great brakes like that maybe I am expecting too much. Thanks for the input.

Just curious. What do you normally run your 2 step at and how much time did you loose running the foot brake trans. compared to the trans. brake?
 
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