MSD 6013 - Trap for players -

[Rat Patrol]

Kudos to Swifter for confirming on the dyno what I guessed.....

The MSD 6013 is set up with a MAP graph from "factory" that actually pulls timing out of the RPM curve above 11 PSIa.

Ive been told they set it up like this so that people won't detonate their motors at high RPM/High Manifold pressure/Lean AF.

Its kind of a start up tune "fail safe".

Its easily fixed

- either do as Swifter has done and run "non-MAP" tune.

Or

- Do what I did which was alter the MAP graph so it doesn't drop below Zero and therefore does not pull timing out of the RPM curve.

Either way - if you know of anyone running an MSD 6013......let them know about this issue or get them to ask on this board.

Below are the two timing graphs -

The first is the "factory" tune, notice how the MAP line drops BELOW degrees advance at 11 PSIa

The 2nd is my modified MAP curve - notice I flat lines at Zero so it only adds timing at low pressure where its beneficial.

 

[Abodybomber]

Nice Improvement. Is this working ,off wide bands? Just asking.....

 

[Rat Patrol]

No ..the MSD 6013 reads the factory MAP sensor and sets ignition timing only.

If you want to run EFI you'll need a separate PCM.

 

[Abodybomber]

You went carb? I am impressed.WOW !

 

[hemijoejr]

This becomes a big problem when you have low manifold vacuum with a big cam. I had to shut mine off like Swiffer did because the timing was all over the place!!

 

[Rat Patrol]

This becomes a big problem when you have low manifold vacuum with a big cam. I had to shut mine off like Swiffer did because the timing was all over the place!!

You must have read my mind Joe....I was only thinking 30 minutes ago..what the effect on MAP would be on a motor with a long duration cam...!

 

[Map63Vette]

There's another setting in there that might help with cams and idle. They have a "timing lock" function that will hold base timing at idle regardless of engine vacuum and will allow some variation in RPM without changing it either I believe. I can't remember what it's called off the top of my head as I haven't messed with it in a long time, but the idea was that it if you disabled the lock it would let the timing vary at idle to help try to smooth out the rpm. On a race engine this could get tricky, so it's probably better to disable it. I'm not sure how it does it, but the box seems to have an "idle" mode where it ignores vacuum at idle, so the MAP graph doesnt' have any effect. I'm not sure what constitues an idle condition to MSD as it doesn't appear to be configurable, but if I watch the realtime readouts on my box I know it cuts the vacuum advance at idle at least.

Edit: Just looked up the instructions. The feature I'm thinking of is called "Idle Timing Control". Still not sure how the box determines what idle is though. Guessing it's probably some kind of rpm limit maybe.

 

[hemijoejr]

I turned the idol timing controll off as well.