the only 12 point bolts i have ever seen that seemed factory was my 69 dart came with 12 point steering box to K frame bolts. they took a 9/16 12 point socket if i recall ...i replaced them with the 6 point bolts.
not sure what that was all about.
tool consideration
- Thread starter Princess Valiant
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the only 12 point bolts i have ever seen that seemed factory was my 69 dart came with 12 point steering box to K frame bolts. they took a 9/16 12 point socket if i recall ...i replaced them with the 6 point bolts.
not sure what that was all about.
If you order the replacement connecting rods, they come with 12 point bolt heads, then buy the proper 12 point socket to torque them.
What I don't like about those rods is they don't have the "oil squirt holes" in them like the stock ones. they claim that you don't need them, but without any test data, I don't buy it. :finga:
My philosophy is you can never have too much oiling. If the stock rods had squirt holes, then the replacements should also. :wack:
I would like to see a durability test with the squirt holes vs without and have the bores measured for wear afterwards. When I build an engine, I want durability and reliability.... :burnout:
The reason that they do this is to save money by eliminating a drilling operation, and the small drills used to drill the holes have a tendency to break which increases the tooling cost for machining the rods. I don't like it when cost reductions may limit the longevity of my engine...
rotest:
They probably did that because the "standard hex head" for that bolt would have caused a clearance issue. So they can use a 12 point head and reduce the bolt head size for extra clearance, especially for something with that much torque.
dont forget the rear main seal retainer on a BB....not sure why they did it in 12 point ...that has confused and been a show stopper to many when its greasy and you cant see exactly what it is :laughing:
This is a learning thread for me. I didn't know Mopar used any 12 points.
I'm a small block guy. Not familiar with the bottom end of a big block, but I bet that was another clearance issue. Notice how the bolt head is almost the same size as the shaft of the bolt. The standard hex head would have been much bigger than the shaft, especially for something with that much torque.
thats the only one i ever found on a big block ....
i did this thread awhile back bcoz i really like bolts ...i have not had the time to take a small block apart and do part two and so on
http://www.forabodiesonly.com/mopar/showthread.php?t=215718
Rani's right, they did use them on the steering boxes.
I haven't done any big blocks in over 20 years. The last one I did was a Hemi for my dad's 69 Roadrunner convertible back in 94-95 ish. My memory is not that good anymore. Like a hard drive, I had to clear out some old memories to make room for new ones, as it was getting full and it can only hold so much...
Rani, do you have a tap and die kit?
I recommend getting one because it is good to chase any used threads that you use to clean them up. I always chase the bolts with a die and the holes with a tap before reassembling it. It prevents dirt and contaminates from getting caught in the threads and then binding before properly seating. You get much better clamp loads for the specified torque and less problems with contaminates binding the parts before they are properly fastened.
I found a local Ace Hardware that carries a tap and die kit for english threads up to 1/2 inch. They also carry seperate ones in 9/16", 5/8", and 3/4" which is used for suspension components. Not all Ace hardware stores carry them. I have about 6-7 of them around me and only one carries the kit and he's like 30 minutes away from me. I only use the Hanson/Irwin kits. I had a Craftsman kit when I started, but their taps were junk. I broke 3-4 of them when chasing the threads for an oil pan and had to install 4 heli coils to fix them - on the same engine! I rarely, if ever, break a Hanson/Irwin tap. It takes a little "finesse" to get the feel for them so you don't break them when getting to the bottom of the hole, but it makes putting things together much easier and trouble free. It also makes it easier if you have to do a repair later. They come apart and go together much easier.
I see from your thread referenced above that you know to measure the outside diameter of the thread and the pitch (threads per inch) and then the length of the bolt from under the bolt head to the end of the bolt.
For example: If you have a thread that is 5/16" diameter, and 18 threads per inch and is 2" from under the head to the tip of the bolt, that would be called a 5/16 x 18 x 2" bolt.
A bolt that is 3/8" diameter with 16 threads per inch that is 3" long would be called a 3/8 x 16 x 3" bolt.
Go into a hardware store and ask for a bolt like that, and I bet the guy will almost fall over and be impressed that you know that much about threads. They would never guess that you would know that much about threads and bolts by looking at you.
I recommend getting one because it is good to chase any used threads that you use to clean them up. I always chase the bolts with a die and the holes with a tap before reassembling it. It prevents dirt and contaminates from getting caught in the threads and then binding before properly seating. You get much better clamp loads for the specified torque and less problems with contaminates binding the parts before they are properly fastened.
I found a local Ace Hardware that carries a tap and die kit for english threads up to 1/2 inch. They also carry seperate ones in 9/16", 5/8", and 3/4" which is used for suspension components. Not all Ace hardware stores carry them. I have about 6-7 of them around me and only one carries the kit and he's like 30 minutes away from me. I only use the Hanson/Irwin kits. I had a Craftsman kit when I started, but their taps were junk. I broke 3-4 of them when chasing the threads for an oil pan and had to install 4 heli coils to fix them - on the same engine! I rarely, if ever, break a Hanson/Irwin tap. It takes a little "finesse" to get the feel for them so you don't break them when getting to the bottom of the hole, but it makes putting things together much easier and trouble free. It also makes it easier if you have to do a repair later. They come apart and go together much easier.
I see from your thread referenced above that you know to measure the outside diameter of the thread and the pitch (threads per inch) and then the length of the bolt from under the bolt head to the end of the bolt.
For example: If you have a thread that is 5/16" diameter, and 18 threads per inch and is 2" from under the head to the tip of the bolt, that would be called a 5/16 x 18 x 2" bolt.
A bolt that is 3/8" diameter with 16 threads per inch that is 3" long would be called a 3/8 x 16 x 3" bolt.
Go into a hardware store and ask for a bolt like that, and I bet the guy will almost fall over and be impressed that you know that much about threads. They would never guess that you would know that much about threads and bolts by looking at you.
yes i do have a tap and die set ...its craftsman ....everything with me is sears LoL
im learning ....the first time i attempted that thread it was not so nice and i learned with the help of a few FABO guys .......i got a bolt mearsure index from Mr. Steve (4speedragtop) ....so im learning a lot with the help of FABO too. :headbang:
Let me interject a moment. It is best to use a rethreader to clean threads and not a tap. Most of the broken taps that come to my truck are from rethreading. Most of those taps are broken with a sad story attached about getting the broken piece out. Thanks, tmm
http://www.mactools.com/shoponline/product/tabid/120/p-320457-48-pc-rethreading-kit.aspx
http://www.mactools.com/shoponline/product/tabid/120/p-320457-48-pc-rethreading-kit.aspx
Oklacarcollecto
Life is an experiment
Now I have found something else I need to buy...
No offense Mike, but some of those don't reach deep enough for some of the thread holes we need to retap.
If you know what you are doing with a tap and have a good quality one (not Craftsman - sorry Rani), they will work fine. I've been doing this for over 30 years and haven't broken very many (if any) since I switched to Hanson/Irwin taps & dies.
Finesse not force is my motto. Mac has sold Hanson/Irwin for decades. Yes the taps are a bit longer. Proper tool for the job. Rusty holes are the worst. Rusty metal must be harder than the tap. tmm
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