Worst body job ever

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I dont know how anyone can expect a perfect paint job for that price. Nice driver yes, Perfectly straight with no dents including jams. No way.

I just spent 10 days getting my car prepped for paint. I'll spend another day and a half in the booth painting and a day or 2 cutting/buffing and applying the tail stripe. So with no metal being replaced figure 2 weeks for a nice driver quality paint job. Thats 112hrs of work and Its nice but not perfect.


The sign on our wall states $65hr for labor. That $7280 not including meterials.

The paint for mty car is $600 a gallon, Plus at least a gallon of clear at $150

$500 in primer and $100 for other stuff, Filler, Finishing putty, sand paper (not cheap at $100 a roll) . That $1300 for meterials.

Thats $8500, No metal replacement. Not perfect and the car was a bare shell when I rolled it in to the shop.
 
Without getting into what I think about the bodywork/amount paid situation, Snake has already asked to pull this thread, and is clearly uncomfortable with it. I would have commented on it, but by the time I ran across it, Snake had already requested that it be pulled, so I held my tongue. Cant speak for anyone else, but I know there are times in my life where I wished after the fact that I had just kept my mouth shut. Just my suggestion, maybe we should let this one die a quiet death.
 
AdamR said:
I dont know how anyone can expect a perfect paint job for that price. Nice driver yes, Perfectly straight with no dents including jams. No way.

I just spent 10 days getting my car prepped for paint. I'll spend another day and a half in the booth painting and a day or 2 cutting/buffing and applying the tail stripe. So with no metal being replaced figure 2 weeks for a nice driver quality paint job. Thats 112hrs of work and Its nice but not perfect.


The sign on our wall states $65hr for labor. That $7280 not including meterials.

The paint for mty car is $600 a gallon, Plus at least a gallon of clear at $150

$500 in primer and $100 for other stuff, Filler, Finishing putty, sand paper (not cheap at $100 a roll) . That $1300 for meterials.

Thats $8500, No metal replacement. Not perfect and the car was a bare shell when I rolled it in to the shop.
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Ok you sucked me in on this thread. So your telling me for 3800.00 you can only expect a Macco or Econo auto body type paint job? And that 8500.00 will get you a " nice but not perfect job"? I'm not going to take sides on the argument but I would venture to say that if anyone took their car to any shop and was quoted 3800.00 for the job and was also told "now for 3800.00
you understand it will have dust or dirt in the paint and I might overlook a dent here and there" and you then say UM OK, lets do it. I think in most cases the customer has in their mind what to expect and what it is going to look like, and he may be a little unrealistic in what he expects. On the other hand $3800.00 is more than chump change. If I can't do the proper job for 3800.00 I feel it would be my duty to tell the customer "LOOK THERE IS NO WAY I CAN GIVE YOU WHAT YOU WANT FOR THAT PRICE" Now if he went to the shop and said "What will it cost me to have this car refinished with all the body work included?"And he is quoted $3800.00 than yes he has the right to expect a nice job free from dirt in the paint. I have in the past under priced a job and had to "eat the lose". now understand their is alway 3 sides to a story,your side,his side and the truth somewhere in the middle! Bottom line HAVE A WRITTEN AGREEMENT WITH WHAT WORK IS TO BE COMPLETED AT A FIXED PRICE. In most cases with any type of labor work, the problem comes down to poor communication.
 
I wasn't going to comment but can't hold my tongue (or fingers on the keys). I have been following this thread since it started. First a job worth doing (no matter what is charged for it) is worth doing right. Second 65 to 90 dollars an hour? (excluding big name custom shops and artisan panel beaters) You've got to be kidding, it's body work it's a learned skill. Those prices are not overhead cost either, it's what the market will bear, and greed.

Material charges for a repaint/repair are bad enough and seriously inflated by the industry. Do you really think a car manufacturer pays that much for paint, primer and supplies? No it's about 25% of what a shop is charged and charges.

Most of these shops pay some new employee 9, 10 bucks an hour for most of the grunt work. Just because there's people out there with too many dollars and not enough cents. And an insurance industry that helps hike up prices doesn't mean that someone that wants to do work on the side (and no doubt made a lot more than they would being paid a wage way below what is billed at someone else’s shop) should expect someone to pay for and except second class work. It makes no difference what so ever if it’s a 6 figure collector car or someone’s daily driver.

Piss poor work says a lot about a person either they have no pride in what they do or they don't know the job well enough to charge anything for it.

A true honest craftsman will take a loss rather than deliver a job that's not right.
Anyone who knows anything about business knows that is how you build a business and keep loyal customers.

Anyone who doesn't conduct themselves in that fashion when they charge anything for work done is just in it for a fast buck doesn't care about the customer and does a disservice to all the people who do honest quality work no matter what their trade is.

Anyone who doesn’t understand this shouldn’t be in business and should be working for someone who does and assures the work is done right.

Now this is my Opinion, one that is based on years of having my own business. Part of my business is cutting gemstones, as far as my hourly charge it doesn’t matter if it’s a diamond I'm cutting or a piece of glass for costume jewelry it gets the same care, attention and hourly rate. If it takes longer then my estimate, or if I have to replace a stone, that’s my problem not the customers.

Because at the end of the day it makes no difference if it’s a Mopar ,a wedding ring, or a kids sandbox each means just as much to the person who has entrusted you with it.
 
i am doing all my own body work and my brother in law will be showing and teaching me how to mix and paint it. for his help and time i gave him a 79 fire bird body (roller shell). so i will only have myself to hate.
 
SGBARRACUDA hit it right on the nose! If you're the "Pro" and you underbid a job, you still need to complete the job to professional standards even if you take a loss. That's the meaning of calling yourself a "Pro". If you can't/won't deliver a product that makes the customer happy Within the Customers Budget, then politely decline the job. I'm sure, as a Pro, this "Ain't Your First Rodeo" . Sad thing is with a little more communication ( and maybe a bit more $$) all might have been happy from the beginning. Silver Lining? Good lesson for us all on Communication, Honesty, Respect, Pride
 
sumbitmopar said:
SGBARRACUDA hit it right on the nose! If you're the "Pro" and you underbid a job, you still need to complete the job to professional standards even if you take a loss. That's the meaning of calling yourself a "Pro". If you can't/won't deliver a product that makes the customer happy Within the Customers Budget, then politely decline the job. I'm sure, as a Pro, this "Ain't Your First Rodeo" . Sad thing is with a little more communication ( and maybe a bit more $$) all might have been happy from the beginning. Silver Lining? Good lesson for us all on Communication, Honesty, Respect, Pride
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I will say that I have to agree with SGBarracuda,Beastie340 and Sumbitmopar here. As business men we need to honor our word and work. It is not about the moneys. I have seen people say you get what you pay for. That aint right, You should get what you were prommised. If he wants to clear his name from this mess all he has to do is fix what the customer wants and make him happy. At this point it is about the customer and not the greed. It is better to have 10 good customers than one upset at you. One upset will make more damage to your business than anything else. For those who have busineses look at this post and you will see why it is important to do the right thing.
God Bless, hope everything gets resolved.
 
Theres a reason som pay $10,000-$15,000 for a paint job. perfectly straight panels take time, especially on a car like a Dart that has 3 body lines per panel and are very flat.

Im not saying he has no right to get upset. What Im saying is you need to be very clear with the shop you are considering what you want and what you have to spend. The shop needs to be very clear with what you can expect for X amount of dollars.

And yes by all mean get it in writing.

On the subject of meterails. Yes, shops usually pay less for meterials, that part of the way we make our money. Just like a roofing contrator gets shingles for less then you would get them at Home depot.

But cheaper is not free. I paid $150 a gallon for primer and activator and $600 for 3 liters of paint. My cost. We get meterials cheaper because we buy in volume. If you want to spend $8000 on a mixing rack, you can get the same break on paint a body shop will.

I take pride in my work, I love restoring old cars but its dirty, dangerous work (yes dangerous)that most cant understand why it cost what it does.
 
Thank you very much.Update he is at least is going to come and get the dust out and overspray off he is very pissed about but.
 
Snake said:
Thank you very much.Update he is at least is going to come and get the dust out and overspray off he is very pissed about but.
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Good news....overspray is usually just a lazy work ethic
 
he does not paint, he had a painter come in to do it. there was not much overspray on the car. This Car Should Have Had Quarters And Fenders, Don Refused To Go The Extra, To Fix It Right. There Is Only So Much You Can Do To A Warped Panel. All Body Guys Know This. What Still No Pics Of The Car. And Now 5 Pages?
 
A friend of mine started a body shop right out of tech school with a loan from his father. For 6 years he worked his *** off doing restorations for people, working on rusty pieces of crap and turning them into beautiful cars. He always bid competitively and always followed through regardless of the time involved, the only goal being to make the customer happy. During that period I don't think he made over $3.00 per hour on a job.

After not too long his schedule filled up and he had a waiting list due to building an excellent reputation for quality and reasonable prices. He trained a talented crew to his standards and raised his rates to the point where he now makes a very comfortable living, and people are more than willing to pay the higher rates because they absolutely know that he will do a top notch job. Just like any other business in the service industry, reputation is EVERYTHING.
 
Ok everyone said that look and gave me a price that those quarters were fine even him the guy who did the body work said he could get it stright it wasent untill after the car was painted that he said it should be requartered.Once the car is buff out I will post pics cant do it now cant see what i am talking about because its dull from OVER SPRAY on it.That one piller pic tells a little.
 
AdamR said:
Theres a reason som pay $10,000-$15,000 for a paint job. perfectly straight panels take time, especially on a car like a Dart that has 3 body lines per panel and are very flat.

Im not saying he has no right to get upset. What Im saying is you need to be very clear with the shop you are considering what you want and what you have to spend. The shop needs to be very clear with what you can expect for X amount of dollars.

And yes by all mean get it in writing.

On the subject of meterails. Yes, shops usually pay less for meterials, that part of the way we make our money. Just like a roofing contrator gets shingles for less then you would get them at Home depot.

But cheaper is not free. I paid $150 a gallon for primer and activator and $600 for 3 liters of paint. My cost. We get meterials cheaper because we buy in volume. If you want to spend $8000 on a mixing rack, you can get the same break on paint a body shop will.

I take pride in my work, I love restoring old cars but its dirty, dangerous work (yes dangerous)that most cant understand why it cost what it does.
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All my professional life I have wondered how body shops got away with "well sir, what kind of a job do you want?" I too am self employed, not in body work or paint but construction general contracting. If one of my customers came to me for a quote on replacing a roof on their house and I said "well sir, what kind of job do you want?" One that is half asked or a good quality job that will keep your family dry. How long do you think I would be in business? Or better yet, if someone had a old crappy house they were going to move to another lot and asked for a new foundation. If the customer found that the foundation was inferior, out of square and just a plain bad job, and my response was, "well you are putting a house that needs a lot of work on it like new quarter panels, (oh I mean wall panels)" does that have anything to do with my poor quality basement? Trades people are trades people, be it body shops, house builders, plumbers, mechanics or what have you. The world would be a better place if all of us quoted the job for a job done right and with pride.
 
true but like adam said it takes a lot of time to make these cars perfect. Time = Money. There are a lot of people that don't want to spend the +$15K to do the paint and body but they want perfection. How does that work?

Same thing with roofs, a metal roof might coast a lot more then a shingle roof but both get the job accomplished.

Which one is going to last longer?
Same as body work
Which one can I afford?
 
As a former body and paint guy, I used to do a lot of side work, And it never failed, the guy who wanted to pay the least, always complained the most. ( No offense) You go out of your way to save someone some money and do the job within their budget or so they could pocket some insurance money and they were never happy. So I stopped doing customer cars years ago, and only do my own stuff. The biggest thing is the cost of materials are crazy. I two-toned my Magnum R/T two years ago and it cost me a $1000 in materials alone (that's only painting 1/2 the car, with zero body work). I'm not picking sides, but unfortunately a good quality paint job is an expensive undertaking.
 
AMEN.
If I paid $3,800 and got CRAP, I'd be pretty pissed. Hell, for $200-$300 I could go to Maaco and be equally dissatisfied, and still have $3,500 left.
Whatever happened to integrity?
 
Guys I was KNOT trying to cheap out.Around here you can get great body and paint for less than 4 grand i have in the past,sure it was knot perfect but GOOD, some charge more,it all comes down to how much they pay there guys and all business exspences.Big shop big price get it.When I send my cars out its strip to a shell.They do not have anything to tape or remove there is a huge saving right there.
 
Snake said:
Guys I was KNOT trying to cheap out.Around here you can get great body and paint for less than 4 grand i have in the past,sure it was knot perfect but GOOD, some charge more,it all comes down to how much they pay there guys and all business exspences.Big shop big price get it.When I send my cars out its strip to a shell.They do not have anything to tape or remove there is a huge saving right there.
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Although you can't see the job real well, but the car on my avatar done last year, cost $ 4400. You can actually shave in front of it.
 
res1vw21 said:
true but like adam said it takes a lot of time to make these cars perfect. Time = Money. There are a lot of people that don't want to spend the +$15K to do the paint and body but they want perfection. How does that work?

Same thing with roofs, a metal roof might coast a lot more then a shingle roof but both get the job accomplished.

Which one is going to last longer?
Same as body work
Which one can I afford?
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Thank You For Clearing This Up Guys. He's Not Pissed About Fixing The Over spray But That The Painter Got Some On The Car. Just Too Clear This Up. What Confuses Me Is Some Of You Guys Are Judging This Job Without Seeing It. How Can You Do This Before Don Puts Up Some Pics. Just Wait Then See For Yourself.
 
Wow, I'm new to all this. This site has been real positive to me up till now. No one should judge anyway even with the pics. This hole thing is dark and negative being dwelled on. It's up to a judge to judge and they arn't always right anyway. Besides pics don't mean chite, ie Photoshop, I used to be a printer before layoff, I know. Besides every one of us has negative things to go through with these cars. If it was easy everyone would be driving these cars. See my cracked 67 windshield thread in trim section. Hell I have been paying a national insurance company for full coverage (Our family drives are Darts FULL TIME) Now they don't want to fork over the check to fix. They want me to pay and they will pay me back. I'm BROKE, LAYED OFF, UNEMPLOYED, NO DENARO, but they want me to keep paying them premiums AND pay for my repairs first also. I got two good hands for them with fingers straight up!
So Please RELEASE THE NEGATIVE BAD VIBES. We are here to help each other and in business and life that means COMPROMISE!
Done sorry, (vented)
 
FYI, as a professional restorer, I will state a few facts.

Whether its a body/paint guy or a restorer, you lose many hours in doing the job. It's just how it goes. I just finished a 66 charger and have about 500ish hours in the build of the car. I only charged for about 200 hours, at $90/hour. Why? Time =money. For $3800 around here, you don't get much.

My car alone was $7k and it's not perfect. VERY NICE but not perfect. That includes me disassembling/reassembling the entire car, and stripping the engine bay, and welding up holes. I will say that I can even tear up a $20k job. I will find imperfections on any car.

If you wanted what you wanted, you should have had it ALL in writing and discuss it in entirety before you agreed. I give a check list to my paint/body guy every time a car goes to him and he knows how picky I am. We just did a quick spray and body fix on a 68 charger for $3k. Not even a whole job. That included fixing previous bodywork.

Yet to justify this thread at all, please post pics. Then all who care to comment shall let their opinions be known.
 
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