Fixed cooling fans for a 340

[Kenflo]

Been doing some research on cooling fans lately and I am curious about the Mopar fixed fans. In particular these 3 part numbers:
2863 213, 2863 224, 2863 226
The parts book says 213 is specifically for a 68 340 and 383. My question is would the 224 and 226 also work? They all appear to be 18” diameter. Anyone with real world experience on which of the 3 would provide the most cooling? I have a 68 340 with 22” rad and shroud.
Thanks!

 

[ch1ll]

Depends on the pitch. The 213 is 1.75. Clutch type fans are 2.25 and 2.5 pitch. The higher pitched fans with clutches were implemented with driven assesories in mind like air conditioning.

Not sure what pitch the 224 or 226 are or what model/engined cars they were used on.

You can find 213 fans for sale here from time to time, there was one for sale within the last few weeks. Sometimes you get a good one and sometimes they are bent. For that reason I only like paying $35-40 for one.

 

[Kenflo]

the pitch on the 224 is 2” & 226 not sure as I’m still trying to find the spec.
So would more pitch mean greater cooling effect?

 

[junkyardhero]

the pitch on the 224 is 2” & 226 not sure as I’m still trying to find the spec.
So would more pitch mean greater cooling effect?

pitch only means that it has the potential to move more air.

it'll also be louder.

 

[dano]

Out of curiosity, why are you looking for the maximum cooling affect from just the fan? Is there a particular issue or situation you are trying avoid or cure?

 

[Kenflo]

Out of curiosity, why are you looking for the maximum cooling affect from just the fan? Is there a particular issue or situation you are trying avoid or cure?

Not necessarily looking for max cooling effect from just the fan, more of a max cooling effect for the entire system especially while idling during a show or cruise. Currently I have the MP 5 blade with Hayden clutch which is fine for all driving conditions except it gets pretty hot during extended idle and cruising during shows. It’s mostly a show car so I am hoping to get more air at slow speeds.

 

[jbc426]

Not necessarily looking for max cooling effect from just the fan, more of a max cooling effect for the entire system especially while idling during a show or cruise. Currently I have the MP 5 blade with Hayden clutch which is fine for all driving conditions except it gets pretty hot during extended idle and cruising during shows. It’s mostly a show car so I am hoping to get more air at slow speeds.

What's the current distance from the fan to the radiator? Same question for the Hayden clutch?

How clean is your radiator, and how many rows is it?

What temperature is your thermostat?

 

[krazykuda]

How many fins on the fans???

I prefer 7 blade fans as they will move more air....

Also get one that matches the diameter of the shroud...

 

[Kenflo]

What's the current distance from the fan to the radiator? Same question for the Hayden clutch?

How clean is your radiator, and how many rows is it?

What temperature is your thermostat?

Radiator is brand new 3 row brass/copper
Clutch to rad is close like 1/2”
Fan blade to rad is 1”
Shroud is the wizard cooling aluminum

 

[dano]

Not necessarily looking for max cooling effect from just the fan, more of a max cooling effect for the entire system especially while idling during a show or cruise. Currently I have the MP 5 blade with Hayden clutch which is fine for all driving conditions except it gets pretty hot during extended idle and cruising during shows. It’s mostly a show car so I am hoping to get more air at slow speeds.

Thanks. This situation could be cured with adjusting the tune. Advancing the timing and/or adding more fuel at idle can really help.

Case in point, my dads 440 in his Coronet. Cruising down the free way it would slowly creep up in temp. Punch it and it would cool down. Idle would slowly creep up too. He added 2 more deg to initial timing and kicked and enriched the idle a little and a time and got it to go away.

 

[Kenflo]

How many fins on the fans???

I prefer 7 blade fans as they will move more air....

Also get one that matches the diameter of the shroud...

All of the fans 213, 224, 226 are fixed 7 blade fans

 

[ch1ll]

the pitch on the 224 is 2” & 226 not sure as I’m still trying to find the spec.
So would more pitch mean greater cooling effect?

More the pitch, more air it moves and more horsepower it sucks up.

You have to think of it like a boat propeller, the distance it moves through the water in one revolution. That is what the pitch is.

 

[junkyardhero]

that thing should be running cooler than a cucumber in the back of the fridge. you've got all the right parts.

what's the t-stat? what waterpump? what's the diameter of the waterpump pulley? and the crank pulley-- is the waterpump underdriven or overdriven?

when you say it's getting hot, what's the metric? dash gauge? aftermarket gauge? have you confirmed temps with an IR gun?

 

[Kenflo]

Thanks. This situation could be cured with adjusting the tune. Advancing the timing and/or adding more fuel at idle can really help.

Case in point, my dads 440 in his Coronet. Cruising down the free way it would slowly creep up in temp. Punch it and it would cool down. Idle would slowly creep up too. He added 2 more deg to initial timing and kicked and enriched the idle a little and a time and got it to go

that thing should be running cooler than a cucumber in the back of the fridge. you've got all the right parts.

what's the t-stat? what waterpump? what's the diameter of the waterpump pulley? and the crank pulley-- is the waterpump underdriven or overdriven?

when you say it's getting hot, what's the metric? dash gauge? aftermarket gauge? have you confirmed temps with an IR gun?

Getting hot only when cruising like when driving walking speed. Gauges are aftermarket and I can read temp with the sniper efi touch screen as well.
Thermostat is 180, water pump is the high volume Milodon, pulleys recently changed to a 1:2 ratio overdriven. Driving around normally runs great between say 170-190, when cruising slowly for like 20 or so mins it will creep up to 210-220 and will puke a bit into the recovery tank

 

[dano]

Getting hot only when cruising like when driving walking speed. Gauges are aftermarket and I can read temp with the sniper efi touch screen as well.
Thermostat is 180, water pump is the high volume Milodon, pulleys recently changed to a 1:2 ratio overdriven. Driving around normally runs great between say 170-190, when cruising slowly for like 20 or so mins it will creep up to 210-220 and will puke a bit into the recovery tank

I have a Sniper as well. Whats your cruise AFR and Total advance?

 

[Wvbuzzmaster]

I’m going to throw in my personal experience. My 1972 Duster has a factory 22” HD radiator (the standard radiator for slant 6 with air conditioning or a 340) and has been swapped to a 340 from a slant 6 before I bought it. It was cooling fine with a fixed 7 blade fan, but I was not impressed. On a 80 degree day in the direct sun it would not overheat, but it would not drop back down to 180 very fast until it got in some shade. As I researched the fan specs, what I found is it was utilizing a 7 blade 17” fan with 1.5” pitch, factory correct for slant 6 with air conditioning. So somehow the car had gone from its factory slant 6 with AC configuration to a 318, and then to a 340 all before I bought it and everyone kept the slant 6 fan… lol. The factory correct fan for a 340 is a 215 clutch fan with specs of 7 blade 18” with 2.25” pitch, also known as factory Hemi fan… so overpriced. However, I found that the GM 772 fan is reproduced and costs about $130, bolts to the same fan clutch a 215 would, and has the same specs of 7 blade 18” with 2.25” pitch. The bonus is the ends of the blades have the turned up ends which supposedly makes them cool better than straight blades. Anyway, I bolted a GM 772 fan onto my 340 and on a 90 degree day in the direct sun with spirited driving, it maintains 180 and gets back there quickly as needed, such as on restart after heat soaking. You have a shroud and your fan relationship appears correct, you just need more pitch. I would recommend trying the GM 772 fan first, I am very satisfied with mine.

 

[Kenflo]

I have a Sniper as well. Whats your cruise AFR and Total advance?

Cruise AFR is 13.5, sniper is not controlling timing though. Total timing is 32 degrees and with the MSD set up I’m using the initial timing is 14 & total timing is 18 and this is where it seems to run the best, I have not messed with the tune yet as I just finally bought a laptop so need to do some learning myself on that part

 

[nutz]

so what is the stock fan for my 69 340 build

 

[Wvbuzzmaster]

Stock 340 fan is the 215 clutch fan, same as 426 Hemi. 7 blade 18” with 2.25” pitch.

If you don’t care about factory correct, just factory specs the GM 772 fan is what I used on my Duster 340. A link to the reproduction fan I purchased and have been running over a year no issue.

Camaro Chevelle 69 70 Nova Impala 772 Engine Fan 7-Blade dated C69 3947772 | eBay

 

[nutz]

trying to be all factory correct thanks

 

[Kenflo]

Stock 340 fan is the 215 clutch fan, same as 426 Hemi. 7 blade 18” with 2.25” pitch.

If you don’t care about factory correct, just factory specs the GM 772 fan is what I used on my Duster 340. A link to the reproduction fan I purchased and have been running over a year no issue.

Camaro Chevelle 69 70 Nova Impala 772 Engine Fan 7-Blade dated C69

I’m going to throw in my personal experience. My 1972 Duster has a factory 22” HD radiator (the standard radiator for slant 6 with air conditioning or a 340) and has been swapped to a 340 from a slant 6 before I bought it. It was cooling fine with a fixed 7 blade fan, but I was not impressed. On a 80 degree day in the direct sun it would not overheat, but it would not drop back down to 180 very fast until it got in some shade. As I researched the fan specs, what I found is it was utilizing a 7 blade 17” fan with 1.5” pitch, factory correct for slant 6 with air conditioning. So somehow the car had gone from its factory slant 6 with AC configuration to a 318, and then to a 340 all before I bought it and everyone kept the slant 6 fan… lol. The factory correct fan for a 340 is a 215 clutch fan with specs of 7 blade 18” with 2.25” pitch, also known as factory Hemi fan… so overpriced. However, I found that the GM 772 fan is reproduced and costs about $130, bolts to the same fan clutch a 215 would, and has the same specs of 7 blade 18” with 2.25” pitch. The bonus is the ends of the blades have the turned up ends which supposedly makes them cool better than straight blades. Anyway, I bolted a GM 772 fan onto my 340 and on a 90 degree day in the direct sun with spirited driving, it maintains 180 and gets back there quickly as needed, such as on restart after heat soaking. You have a shroud and your fan relationship appears correct, you just need more pitch. I would recommend trying the GM 772 fan first, I am very satisfied with mine.

With this particular set up your using, how close to the rad is the clutch and how close are the fan blades at the closest point? My current set up is pretty close with the clutch 1/2” and fan blades just under 1”

 

[junkyardhero]

Getting hot only when cruising like when driving walking speed. Gauges are aftermarket and I can read temp with the sniper efi touch screen as well.
Thermostat is 180, water pump is the high volume Milodon, pulleys recently changed to a 1:2 ratio overdriven. Driving around normally runs great between say 170-190, when cruising slowly for like 20 or so mins it will creep up to 210-220 and will puke a bit into the recovery tank

is the t-stat high flow? if not, that alone might be the one component to change.

otherwise, it may be a situation where you're chasing a few degrees here and there: 5~7 on the fan, another 5 on the tune, 5 on the t-stat, etc. etc.

 

[AJ/FormS]

Is your Hayden clutch Thermostatically controlled? or just a viscous coupling?
*****************************
I went to the Ford Dealer and got me a HD T-clutch off an early 2000s Pick-up truck, that was still CW driven same as my Mopar 367.
I run that with my big 7-blader, that I pulled off my old '75 Dart 318/auto with A/C. Yeah the one with the angled tips.
I run a 195 stat, and the fan cuts in/out to keep the coolant at 205 to 207, no matter how I drive it.
From the driver's seat, I never hear the fan, lol.

With my dash-mounted dial-back timing module, I can run Idle-timing anywhere between 5 and 20 degrees, depending on desired groundspeed with a manual-trans. Five degrees gets me 4mph@550rpm in gear, for parading.
But,
I also run up to 22* in the Vcan, depending on the throttle-opening. By 2000rpm/14mph, that typically is 44* of cruise-timing.
And I should mention, that my 11/1, alloy-headed, 367HO will happily idle at 5* in gear and parading at 4 mph, for as long as I want it to. To achieve that, my hypereutectic pistons were installed a lil loose, and the top ring gaps adjusted looser than the KB specs. That made all the difference; and is hands down, the best thing I ever did for my formerly tight and hot-running engine. Nothing worked until I filed those rings. Afterwards, I couldn't hardly get her warmed up!

Best of luck to you.
In 2004, that 367 went 93 in the Eighth.
Engine now has over 100,000miles on her and still going strong.

 

[66fs]

Getting hot only when cruising like when driving walking speed. Gauges are aftermarket and I can read temp with the sniper efi touch screen as well.
Thermostat is 180, water pump is the high volume Milodon, pulleys recently changed to a 1:2 ratio overdriven. Driving around normally runs great between say 170-190, when cruising slowly for like 20 or so mins it will creep up to 210-220 and will puke a bit into the recovery tank

I had a 360 pickup I could not keep cool at idle. I tried everything, but nothing helped. Finally I put a factory flex fan on and that did the trick. It would idle all day long, without a shroud and keep it's cool.

 

[Kenflo]

is the t-stat high flow? if not, that alone might be the one component to change.

otherwise, it may be a situation where you're chasing a few degrees here and there: 5~7 on the fan, another 5 on the tune, 5 on the t-stat, etc. etc.

Yes indeed the t-stat is a high flow