Sounds big enough to piss off libtards lol and do 10's to me.
How does a solid roller cam act vs solid flat tappet
- Thread starter MOPARMAGA
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Sounds big enough to piss off libtards lol and do 10's to me.
I would stay with the solid for your application. 1800$ for a small HP gain is only worth it if you are trying to squeeze every last HP out of a combo.
For what its worth, I somewhat recently switched from a small solid roller (248/254 duration @ 0.05) to a Hughes solid (264-268 duration @ 0.05) with edm lifters on my small block 408. I made the switch because I would have to upgrade my rockers if I wanted a bigger roller cam, but I could go bigger if I went with a solid cam (lower spring pressure). The roller cam motor was 10.8:1 compression, the solid cam motor is 13:1, everything else is the same. In similar air, the car went from 10.7's (roller) to 10.3's (solid).
For what its worth, I somewhat recently switched from a small solid roller (248/254 duration @ 0.05) to a Hughes solid (264-268 duration @ 0.05) with edm lifters on my small block 408. I made the switch because I would have to upgrade my rockers if I wanted a bigger roller cam, but I could go bigger if I went with a solid cam (lower spring pressure). The roller cam motor was 10.8:1 compression, the solid cam motor is 13:1, everything else is the same. In similar air, the car went from 10.7's (roller) to 10.3's (solid).
Wow, okay I am convinced. I'll stick with my solid edm lifter howards cam. Cool thing I found out is Howard builds all of Hughes cams for them. If you had my cam 260-264 in a 471 BB would you aim for the 11.5:1 or 11.0:1, I'm thinking the higher side would serve everything better. Hughes told me I could get away with pump 93 @ 12.5:1
I don't have 93, I got 92 but we have trick in the next town over
mini
Small Bore Long Stroke
Wow 12.5 on pump 93... Maybe I should look at a different piston. I'm at 9.5 currently. Hmm
Now, I don't know how he figures that, because my dcr figures with 11.4:1 & that cam would be 180 cranking psi. But they firmly believe 200psi is what an aluminum head engine is supposed to be. I can't say I agree or disagree
B3422w5
Well-Known Member
I have that Howards solid 260/264 cam in my 10 to 1( maybe) stock stroke 360. Mine is on a 106, its mighty choppy, love it. They have a 108 version as well. Both big and smallblock.
On an 11 to 1 470, its certainly nothing radical.
On an 11 to 1 470, its certainly nothing radical.
Nice, I think I'll just run what I got for now. Howards said there 259-267 &.640 lift would work well with my set up. Maybe when it's just a race car ill go solid roller, more cubes 512 & step up to tf270s, but a bigger cam too obviously
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Mines on 108, I'm going to try a shorter cometic gasket .030 & get to 11.4 cr. Don't want a dog & Yeah, that's what I was aiming for (not radical) but noticeable & pleasing to my ears, what stall do you run?
B3422w5
Well-Known Member
5k.... its a street strip deal. On the 106 cam( in at102) it Has a very narrow power band . I shift at 6-6200 and flashing at 5, it lives in that area going down the track the whole time. Its raspy on the street, but through Kook’s shootout mufflers the sound is attention getting lol.... sounds like a super stocker
Its actually too much for a low compression 360, but Howards had it on the shelf when others had nothing remotely close to what i needed.
But on a 470 inch motor thats 11+ compression it isnt “ big” at all
Cool, I was recommended to get a 4k, that seems pretty hi for any chance to street drive it. When you're driving on the street does it ever completely lock up at lower rpm? Sounding like a super sticker... Oh yeah buddy
yellow rose
Overnight Sensation
If the converter is built right, a 5k converter will drive very well. A junk 3k converter is a junk converter no matter what.
B3422w5
Well-Known Member
truer words have never been spoken.
A good 8 inch convertor will work better than a 10 inch convertor on the street almost always.
Lots of guys seem to equate an 8 inch with not being efficient , but i would say a “ tight” 8 inch is probably the cats meow for a healthy street strip deal, regards driveability, manners, and benefit at the track
Had several 3200, 3800 etc, 10 inchers years ago. Would never remotely consider owning another, no matter what.
Mine is a bit loose, i had it made that way, and my its my mistake, not PTC. Should probably get it tightened up one step, but thus far haven't bothered. Probably leaving ET on the table. Car didnt pick up after swapping out a 727 for the current 904. I know its in the convertor, but the car works real good repeatability wise. Probably leave it alone and see how it acts behind the stroker i have down the pike, before sending it out. Might work much better behind lots more power
Krooser
Building Chinese Free Engines since 1959...
A .904 flat tappet is very close to a roller in performance compared to a smaller diameter lifter.
My blown Hemi was built for street driving...I didn't over cam it. Iirc it was 240@.050 .525 lift and 113 LSA. We figured it was 600+ HP.
My blown Hemi was built for street driving...I didn't over cam it. Iirc it was 240@.050 .525 lift and 113 LSA. We figured it was 600+ HP.
famous bob
mopar misfit
Be even looser w/ lots more power and torque .
B3422w5
Well-Known Member
yep.... hoping that would be a good thing
mini
Small Bore Long Stroke
First I've heard of real world experience on streetability between an 8 inch and a 10 inch. Thanks for the knowledge
yellow rose
Overnight Sensation
Converter technology is so far advanced for even 15 or so years ago its crazy.
The first converter I ever bought was a B&M Super Holeshot for a street/strip 318. While it worked well for the era, it would be considered scrap today.
I believe Drag Week and such events had a HUGE affect on the development of converter technology.
The 8 inch PTC we used on my buddy’s chevy PU was a Drag Week converter. And it flat works.
Okay so if I was to get a great 4000 rpm converter & I'm making est. 640-650 up
Would that be in the looser category ?
I've heard alot of great stuff about ptc on fabo, thanks again for reaffirming that.
Yeah, too bad a person can't test drive a cars with different converters & power levels to see how they really perform.
Like a shoe store.
Wow, I bet that's a blast. Probably really snappy with that cam. Someday, someday HEMI
Loose vs tight on converters? Well, loosely speaking (pun intended) it works like......
Let’s say your cam and engine come alive @ 3K RPMs and you want to street drive it as a light to light beast. You want the converter to really get the car and things moving a bit above the low end of the power range of the cam and engine combo. The above example would be approximately 3500 rpm. If your goal is a strip only car, you’ll need to know where leak torque is and hopefully a graph or read out from the dyno to send to the converter company. Along with a lot of other car information. But what they will do is stall the converter (loose) at or slightly above peak torque. This may be in the 4500 - 5500 rpm range. This is displacement and combo related. It really varies to much to zero in on this in general description.
Now if your more of the likings of a double duty daily driver, the company will adjust the converter to be tight and start the car rolling earlier with a tighter or earlier stall of lets just say, 2900 - 3100 but not so much that it is a dog or drags the engine down and hurts performance. It will still stall a bit and not be so efficient until later RPMs.
Such a thing was done on my wife’s car. ‘67 Cuda, 360/904/3.55’s & a 26 inch tire, with a intake duration @.050 of 224. The converter is tight 2400 RPMs.
When I was asked why so tight, I told him the wife wanted to drive this a lot and in various conditions ranging from NYC traffic to the islands East end Hwy @ 70-80 mph. It will see a lot of around town traffic and lights. He agreed it makes sense but did recommend more stall for get up and go.
This thing drives and runs great.
(Thank you Pro Torque!)
Let’s say your cam and engine come alive @ 3K RPMs and you want to street drive it as a light to light beast. You want the converter to really get the car and things moving a bit above the low end of the power range of the cam and engine combo. The above example would be approximately 3500 rpm. If your goal is a strip only car, you’ll need to know where leak torque is and hopefully a graph or read out from the dyno to send to the converter company. Along with a lot of other car information. But what they will do is stall the converter (loose) at or slightly above peak torque. This may be in the 4500 - 5500 rpm range. This is displacement and combo related. It really varies to much to zero in on this in general description.
Now if your more of the likings of a double duty daily driver, the company will adjust the converter to be tight and start the car rolling earlier with a tighter or earlier stall of lets just say, 2900 - 3100 but not so much that it is a dog or drags the engine down and hurts performance. It will still stall a bit and not be so efficient until later RPMs.
Such a thing was done on my wife’s car. ‘67 Cuda, 360/904/3.55’s & a 26 inch tire, with a intake duration @.050 of 224. The converter is tight 2400 RPMs.
When I was asked why so tight, I told him the wife wanted to drive this a lot and in various conditions ranging from NYC traffic to the islands East end Hwy @ 70-80 mph. It will see a lot of around town traffic and lights. He agreed it makes sense but did recommend more stall for get up and go.
This thing drives and runs great.
(Thank you Pro Torque!)
And the other thing, since my engine is 471 cubes with a 6.700 rod length & I'll probably stick with the solid f/t 260-264 do you think the added cubes (400 block =71 extra )
would make that duration act smaller ? If so whats a guestimate. 6-8 degrees or so?
That’s the popular belief which is inaccurate but has a basis in the way the engine sounds and reacts because the cam became smaller in a way. A duration @.050 cam like yours in a 361 low deck B engine is a whoopin race cam while in a displacement like yours and larger, it can be an EZ street bound cam.
Look at it with this example.
If you take that 361 CID engine and cam it with a small/medium Hyd. flat tappet of lets say 230@.050, what would be a similar cam to use in something at 500 cubes? You would have to go up in size to meet the requirements. The extra 139 cubes needs to be feed. That 230@.050 is now like a RV cam but will still have its operating rpm band that it lists & possibly a few rpm less. This operating rpm band the engine is in changes with the bore and stroke of the engine. It is also not set in stone how it will act and feel.
The 500 is roughly 39% larger. Your not going to need a cam 39% larger! It’s not a equal or linear growth size that’s needed. Perhaps only 7% more cam or more so probably less would produce a similar feel of how, when and actual feel when your behind the wheel driving.
It is something NOT to worry about. The cam still operates the engine in its rpm band reguardless. I the end, I say you’ll not notice at all.
Look up member Jim Lusk and his 470 build.
Look at it with this example.
If you take that 361 CID engine and cam it with a small/medium Hyd. flat tappet of lets say 230@.050, what would be a similar cam to use in something at 500 cubes? You would have to go up in size to meet the requirements. The extra 139 cubes needs to be feed. That 230@.050 is now like a RV cam but will still have its operating rpm band that it lists & possibly a few rpm less. This operating rpm band the engine is in changes with the bore and stroke of the engine. It is also not set in stone how it will act and feel.
The 500 is roughly 39% larger. Your not going to need a cam 39% larger! It’s not a equal or linear growth size that’s needed. Perhaps only 7% more cam or more so probably less would produce a similar feel of how, when and actual feel when your behind the wheel driving.
It is something NOT to worry about. The cam still operates the engine in its rpm band reguardless. I the end, I say you’ll not notice at all.
Look up member Jim Lusk and his 470 build.
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