RPM air Gap problems?

I'd swear there was a thread on FABO a few weeks back, where a guy posted a pic of a mismatched intake gasket and Eddie air gap intake ports -

Just can't remember which thread - it was just before the BJR holocaust.....

My Edelbrock six pack intake was way off when the machine shop went to port it. Since they removed so much material from the ports it didn`t really matter, but if that wasn`t the case it would`ve made a terrible match to the heads. Edelbrock has some quality control issues and they need to rework the casting of that manifold because it was at least an eighth of an inch off at the ports.

JoeDust451 said:

As i see it, for the price most Eddy stuff is, & being " made in the USA" as we all want, then it should be damn near "dead on perfect" period!! I would love to buy american, & i do for the most part, but were folding up all over, don't point fingers at people not buying american, it ain't all about US buying it, its about greedy people wanting to make a quick buck, & theres plenty in this country,its a crying shame, but its the facts, & US americans like bargains too, & if you opened your eyes to the truth of whats happening & been happening for along time, are own people are selling us short by highering foreigners that take our jobs here on our soil, & looking for cheaper labor over seas, do you really think there coming over here & demanding we higher them, or force us to sell off companies too them, don't think so, its US, not them, we need to "stop it", but i doubt that will happen with all the greed floating around, but thats human nature, & the plus of haveing that freedom as some would say, i would vow to "allways" buy american if the price fits the quality of how its made.

Sorry if i sound blunt & don't hold a blind eye or sugar coat anything, i have "freedom of speech" so i'm just speaking the truth as i see it (& i'm not alone), Do i think its fare for us to pay higher prices or top dallor for american stuff, yes i do if its made right the 1st. time, but when theres flaws, then its not right, & we all know there flaws in Edelbrock stuff, there carbs/heads/intakes, so the way i see it, they should cut US a break & say, Hey, its not perfect, so we won't stick it to ya, we are human too, i can go on & on.

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so you used eddie products and seen these problems first hand right? i'm sure your using quality gaskets right? not El Cheapo Autozone or whatev ones. fitment issues with eddies usually boil down to what was done to the engine PRIOR. UNLESS you measured the deck on the heads, and the deck hieght on the block you have noway of knowing for sure. on one occasion i had a problem with and eddie intake. brought it back to the store where i got it from.. no refund. contacted edelbrock. they said ship it with proof of purchase. I did. bout 3 weeks later got my NEW eddie manifold.. along with stickers, & gaskets (which was nice becouse I ate the shipping. no biggie). thats what your paying for... TRY doing that with a crosswind! Mr. ChongShortDong will laugh at you. anyways.. rant off.. i did notice you own a BIG BLOCK.. let me guess, you bought some made in CHINA 440source heads too?

A-BOMB360 said:

so you used eddie products and seen these problems first hand right? i'm sure your using quality gaskets right? not El Cheapo Autozone or whatev ones. fitment issues with eddies usually boil down to what was done to the engine PRIOR. UNLESS you measured the deck on the heads, and the deck hieght on the block you have noway of knowing for sure. on one occasion i had a problem with and eddie intake. brought it back to the store where i got it from.. no refund. contacted edelbrock. they said ship it with proof of purchase. I did. bout 3 weeks later got my NEW eddie manifold.. along with stickers, & gaskets (which was nice becouse I ate the shipping. no biggie). thats what your paying for... TRY doing that with a crosswind! Mr. ChongShortDong will laugh at you. anyways.. rant off.. i did notice you own a BIG BLOCK.. let me guess, you bought some made in CHINA 440source heads too?

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I'm not going to argue with you, i can tell by your post your intellagent level.

nutter thing you gotta consider is the core shift on stock LA heads. also, when edelbrock spec out those RPM intakes.. did the spec it off an original LA head, or there PERFORMER or PERFORMER RPM head. i would guess the latter. NOT saying every intake is perfect.. far from. but your trying to justify the crosswind purely on the cost factor. sometimes that arguement works.. sometimes not.

A-BOMB360 said:

nutter thing you gotta consider is the core shift on stock LA heads. also, when edelbrock spec out those RPM intakes.. did the spec it off an original LA head, or there PERFORMER or PERFORMER RPM head. i would guess the latter. NOT saying every intake is perfect.. far from. but your trying to justify the crosswind purely on the cost factor. sometimes that arguement works.. sometimes not.

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Ok, now were talking, your right, they most likely based it off there heads, & yes, you have to take in consideration of core shift, but some have had problems with the Eddy intake with the eddy heads, so how do you explain that? now, as for the cost factor of the crosswind, i'm happy with it & how it fits, but i'm running "new" heads, so there you go, i won't argue that the Crosswind will perform "as good" as the Eddy, but it was shown to me how the eddy intake had that gasket allignment problem, that has nothing to do with "ANY" head, i myself have had it to, but i ignored it, wasn't happy about it, but let it & installed it.

this is truely the 1st. time i've bought China stuff, yes, i've built several BBs, & some SBs, & they "ALL" had genuine mopar parts for the most part & everything else american made, i'm happy with my Crosswind purchase & "ready too run" Wysco dizzy. I was just justifing my thoughts of the Crosswind as i don't see it as a total POS like some claim, the ones that call it this & have never used it have "NO" reason to knock it period, but the ones that have purchased it & then knock it, why did they/you buy it in the 1st. place & pass on a USA product, to save $$$, but i'm sure a few buy it for testing purposes, but i haven't seen any Dyno #s for a back too back comparison.

And i bought this intake 1 time, it bolted up nice, no leaks, but did you listen to what you said, you had to send your Eddy back for repairs & had to eat the shipping too boot lol.

JoeDust451 said:

but did you listen to what you said, you had to send your Eddy back for repairs & had to eat the shipping too boot lol.

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yes i did LOL. like i said.. nothings perfect. but at least I got a cool sticker and some gaskets lol.

Hey:

I didn't use cork gaskets (not sure where that came from). I used Edelbrock gaskets. They are similar in construction to the Fel Pro, but I find the port match on the heads is a lot closer. The edelbrock stuff seems to resist crushing a little better.

My method for checking was to line the gasket up on the head, torque the intake to spec, etch the protruding part of the gasket with an awl, remove intake, and then line up the intake with the awl marks on the gasket. In this way I am sure that I'm seeing where the ports on the gasket really are when the thing is bolted together. I can't see how your method (as described) would give any real indication of what is going on when its all together, and there's not anywhere near enough adjustability in the position of the intake to correct the fact that the ports aren't in the right place.

As for my experience, I can't see how that Pro Products POS could line up with any mopar head correctly.

JoeDust451 said:

I just lined up the gaskets on the heads & checked the allignment, then i layed them over on that side of the intake & checked there, it looked pretty good, now how well you center the intake on the head is another story when you button it up lol. On my BBs, i check the upper & underside F&R of the runners with a feeler gauge, but thats hard to do on the SB intake.

I can't speak for the Iron Ram heads (i'm running RHSs), even though the runners seem alittle smaller on the crosswind, the allignment wasn't bad, now i also noticed in your article on this intake you were useing a cork gasket like an LA one, my Magnum gaskets were alot different then the ones you posted, i bought the felpro magnum head set FEL HS9898PT1 & those intake gaskets were nice, had a film coating & rings around the ports, not just a flat peice of cork, did you slot a set of LA intake gaskets to fit the Magnum heads?

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JoeDust451 said:

I checked my Crosswind before install, the alignment was very good on the RHS heads, the overall construction vs. price for this intake is well worth it IMO, i've had issues with the SB Eddy RPM in the past, it wasen't perfect, i saved around 125.00, that bought my summit headers & dinner, so i'm happy.

Bill, those are some nice #s from the magnum, what all is done to it, what heads? Was that with a stock short block?

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Joe, thanks for the kind words!!!

The only part in the short block that is not BONE stock, is the cam (Hughes,) and it's a very mild grind (214/218 @ .050"-lift; .525" lift; 114-degree, lobe separation. Oh; I do have a M-P windage tray. Not sure if that helps or hurts power production. I have a close friend who runs a 351-Cleveland-powered, 1973 Mustang in H/SA, and he installed a windage tray and it cost him fifteen-thousandths!!! He removed it and the .015 came back; go figure...:read2:

The heads are almost-stock cast iron, OEM Magnum with these mods: 3-angle valve job, and a minimal amount of knocking the rough edges off the bowls under the valve heads. No gasket-matching, nor any porting of any kind. No cracks, so far, that I know of (knock on wood!!!)

The carb is a $900.00 (!) Carb Shop-modified blow-thru Holley double pumper (4150/750 cfm) on top of a (Chinese Ripoff) Professional Products "Air Gap" clone.

Ten pounds of boost from a V-1, S-Trim Vortech changed my chassis Dyno numbers from 260 to 445, BUT I made two other significant changes between the two tests:
1. Changed intake manifolds... removed an M-1 dual-plane hi-rise, that was WATER HEATED, and installed the Professsional Products "Air Gap" copy...

and

2. replaced my early 340 exhaust manifolds with a new set of TTI headers.

I already had the rest of the H-pipe TTI 2.5" system in place for the first test.

I also had an MSD Boostmaster ingition module (retards the spark, 1, 2, or, 3-degrees for every pound of boost the manifold "sees," (up to 15 crank degrees of retard) with a dash-control knob that gives you in-cockpit control of which retard you choose.)

I also installed a SnowPerformance "BoostCooler," (Stage I) meth/water injector in lieu of an intercooler, running pure alky in it, with it set to come on at 3 psi. of boost.

Now, if I can just keep this thing from detonating, it may live to see a lot of Bow Ties in the rear view mirror... LOL!

Plan B involves a second Vortech (which I already have,) with a Y section of discharge tubing, blowing through the same carb, AND a 4" crank, with some forged, 8:1 pistons.

Plan B is a daydream.... but COULD happen, someday....

Too much grunt for a 70-year old man???

Probably... but I refuse to grow up!!!! LOL!:cheers:

I don't know how accurate these online computers are, but the Wallace computer says this ol' tub improved from 13.35 @ 102, unblown, to 11.75 @ 118, blown. Those numbers are predication 1/8th-mile times to 1/4-mile figures; we don't have a quarter-mile strip around here.

That was with 8" slicks on a cold day, running a 3.55 gear and some very worn 8" Drag Radials (unblown), but, I have a 4.10 gear installed, and some new M-T 9" X 28" slicks (bias-ply "real" drag slicks...)

Talk's cheap; we'll see...

Oh, and the unblown tests were run on pump gas; the blown tests were run using Av gas.

PS: Here's the dyno sheet, and a time slip from a 1,000-ft strip, at sea level.
Race weight, 3,600 pounds (incl. driver)

Thats great Bill, that 7.5 1/8 is around 11.7-11.8 1/4 mile, i just had the exhaust installed on mine, can't waite to get the power to the ground, the way this magnum feels is amazing, even with the 2.76 gear & pretty much no traction its a blast, feels better then any LA combo i put together with just bolt-ons, i'm glad i went with a magnum this time.