416 issues - losing patience

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flyfish said:
Holy cow! 900CFM....that sucks!...or doesn't depending on how you look at it, lol. Poor flow, coupled with a shroud that basically blocks all other air flow will surely heat that thing up.

I would suggest a Chevy HHR fan. You can get them new for about 50 bucks (I got mine through Rockauto.com) and they pull somewhere in the neighborhood of 3000+ CFM. This is the fan I have on my car, and it works great...and it fits a 22" radiator perfectly.

After burping your cooling system, that would be my next move.
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how thick is the HHR fan - i only have 3" clearance from my snout to radiator -
 
38 degrees timing sounds pretty stout with pump gas. I run 34 with 9.8 to 1 compression and aluminum heads on 91 octane california gas.

Most aftermarket electric fan setups are not adequate.

If you are running a aluminum 70 up water pump, you will need the Jaguar short fan clutch (Hayden #2765). You might be limited on the diameter of the fan depending on where your upper radiator hose is mounted in relation to the center of the water pump. Looking at your picture, I think at least a 17" fan would work. Maybe someone else here has ran an 18" with that Champion model?

I built a fan shroud for mine. But it wasn't really bad without the shroud. I would just run the mechanical fan first. Check out what is going on. Then get/build a fan shroud.

Building a fan shroud step by step: http://www.forabodiesonly.com/mopar/showthread.php?t=198911&highlight=cooling
 
My dads just keep overheating. It was freshly flushed (3 times), new correct mix of anti-freeze and water, new 180 deg t-stat, new Edelbrock water pump, 26" Champion 3 core radiator and their dual fan shroud. It overheated worse than the leaking, old, 2 core for a 318 that was in it. Pulled the shroud and no more overheating, even with no fan at all sitting at idle on a hi 60 deg day with very low to no humidity at around 100 ft elevation. I think he now runs a single electric fan or the old flex fan that was on it originally. That shroud is restrictive, and I bet a 900 cfm fan cuts down to around 400-500 cfm with a radiator, grill, trans cooler, etc in front of it. At speed, the shroud does not allow air over the engine, only forced past those 2 10" fans choking it down more. We even installed an override for the fans and at Idle it would over heat from dead cold with the fans on. He worked on this issue for over a week and as soon as that shroud and fans were removed, all was well.
 
I would check that the lower hose is not being pulled shut under power. My cheap napa hose will sit and idle all day at 180 degrees. When I start to drive it would start to heat up to 230 degrees. Because the hose is being pulled shut. I have a new Champion 3 core radiator new high flow water pump.
 
I'm using a Spal #2052 and I'm pretty happy with it. It pulls 2780 cfm at 25 amps and fits really nice on the 22" champion with minor mods.. The water pump snout fits between the two fans with room to spare and there's light rubber flaps on the shroud that open up at anything over about 25 mph and allow air to pass through.
Mines wired with one fan on a controller for use in most circumstances and the second fan on a switch on the dash for stop and go traffic when the temp usually starts to creep up.
It is kind of loud, but can only be heard when the motor isn't running.

[ame]http://www.spal-usa.com/fans/automated/tech_sheets/2052.pdf[/ame]
 
pauly v.100 said:
I'm using a Spal #2052 and I'm pretty happy with it. It pulls 2780 cfm at 25 amps and fits really nice on the 22" champion with minor mods.. The water pump snout fits between the two fans with room to spare and there's light rubber flaps on the shroud that open up at anything over about 25 mph and allow air to pass through.
Mines wired with one fan on a controller for use in most circumstances and the second fan on a switch on the dash for stop and go traffic when the temp usually starts to creep up.
It is kind of loud, but can only be heard when the motor isn't running.

http://www.spal-usa.com/fans/automated/tech_sheets/2052.pdf
Click to expand...

That is a nice fan....but it cost more than the radiator....just sayin...

http://www.summitracing.com/parts/spu-ix-30102052
 
autoxcuda said:
38 degrees timing sounds pretty stout with pump gas. I run 34 with 9.8 to 1 compression and aluminum heads on 91 octane california gas.

Most aftermarket electric fan setups are not adequate.

If you are running a aluminum 70 up water pump, you will need the Jaguar short fan clutch (Hayden #2765). You might be limited on the diameter of the fan depending on where your upper radiator hose is mounted in relation to the center of the water pump. Looking at your picture, I think at least a 17" fan would work. Maybe someone else here has ran an 18" with that Champion model?

I built a fan shroud for mine. But it wasn't really bad without the shroud. I would just run the mechanical fan first. Check out what is going on. Then get/build a fan shroud.

Building a fan shroud step by step: http://www.forabodiesonly.com/mopar/showthread.php?t=198911&highlight=cooling
Click to expand...

i think im going to try the hayden 2765 and a 17" flexalite 6 blade fan and also a new Milodon high volume pump along with their high volume 180 degree thermo
 
How big is the carb? I would toss some 82 jets in the primary side and put some 86's on the secondary side, toss out vacuum advance distributor and get a old mopar race electronic or MSD , a distributor that you can lock the advance.
And as others have said get a mechanical fan & shroud also.
To me it seems like it is too lean along with too much timing
 
dwire67 said:
How big is the carb? I would toss some 82 jets in the primary side and put some 86's on the secondary side, toss out vacuum advance distributor and get a old mopar race electronic or MSD , a distributor that you can lock the advance.
And as others have said get a mechanical fan & shroud also.
To me it seems like it is too lean along with too much timing
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carb is a quick fuel SS750 mechanical
 
Derale mechanical fan worked for me too.. Pulls a LOT of air thru the rad.. Flattens slightly at higher rpms. Has deep pitch blades.
Added a homemade shroud.
it runs at 180 . and stays there.
 
If you're running an automatic, an auxilary trans cooler is a must. Even more so if it has a high stall converter.
 
Ditch the junk Champion radiator. Get a Griffin. I put a brand new champion cc375 in my coronet. Car was a ground up build. I tried timing ,jetting ,different pump pulleys, different thermostats and then tried different hole size restrictors instead of thermostats and water wetter and purple ice.Went as far as new head gaskets and head inspection. Never would have believed it was my brand new radiator.Temperature slowly creeped up and wouldnt stop.Finally had enough of driving the car 5 miles at a time and shutting it down. After 6 months of weekends trying everything under the sun I bought a griffin muscle car series with 2 rows of 1.25 tubes. Hasnt run hot since.Champion sucks imo. But thats just my opinion.BTW that peice of craps still in my garage. Might try it on a stock 318 one day.
 
I sure would like to know the precise WHY as to why the Griffin will cool and the Champion would not. I mean not just "cause the Griffin is made better" but a sho nuff reason. ...and I certainly believe you, it's not that, cause I've seen your same complaint elsewhere when Griffin or some other better brand fixed the problem.
 
pauly v.100 said:
I'm using a Spal #2052 and I'm pretty happy with it. It pulls 2780 cfm at 25 amps and fits really nice on the 22" champion with minor mods.. The water pump snout fits between the two fans with room to spare and there's light rubber flaps on the shroud that open up at anything over about 25 mph and allow air to pass through.
Mines wired with one fan on a controller for use in most circumstances and the second fan on a switch on the dash for stop and go traffic when the temp usually starts to creep up.
It is kind of loud, but can only be heard when the motor isn't running.

http://www.spal-usa.com/fans/automated/tech_sheets/2052.pdf
Click to expand...

That fan and shroud have almost the same dimensions as the 95-00 Ford Contour V6 fans I am going to use. It seems like it would be a bit too wide for the 22" radiator. I have them going on a 26" radiator.

To the OP....I think your problem is the fan flow. 2x 900cfm fans just plain isn't enough.
 
RustyRatRod said:
I sure would like to know the precise WHY as to why the Griffin will cool and the Champion would not. I mean not just "cause the Griffin is made better" but a sho nuff reason. ...and I certainly believe you, it's not that, cause I've seen your same complaint elsewhere when Griffin or some other better brand fixed the problem.
Click to expand...

Too many tubes too close together and they look about an 1/8 inch wide looking thru the cap.No air flow and too small of tubes. Cools 700 hp my ***.One day I will pull it out of the corner and take a pic.
 
340kid said:
i think im going to try the hayden 2765 and a 17" flexalite 6 blade fan and also a new Milodon high volume pump along with their high volume 180 degree thermo
Click to expand...

I would use a stock fan. More air, more reliability.

Do you have an old used water pump? If it's new and fine, just run it.
 
autoxcuda said:
I would use a stock fan. More air, more reliability.

Do you have an old used water pump? If it's new and fine, just run it.
Click to expand...

water pump is new - don't remember what brand, im thinking it was an autozone pump

i ordered a new Milodon hogh flow pump and 180 degree hi flow thermo

should i drill a weep hole in the hi flow thermo ???

if yes where on the milodon - it looks different from other thermos ive seen
 
What radiator cap are you running... I have been battling overheating. I have a new Wizard Radiator and had bought a nice looking billet radiator cap for it. Found out the cap was barely rubbing the bottom of the hood, so I swapped on a cheap parts store radiator cap I had laying around (14-15lbs?). Immediately didn't have any overheating issues. Weird huh? Worth considering!
 
rob_robinson87 said:
What radiator cap are you running... I have been battling overheating. I have a new Wizard Radiator and had bought a nice looking billet radiator cap for it. Found out the cap was barely rubbing the bottom of the hood, so I swapped on a cheap parts store radiator cap I had laying around (14-15lbs?). Immediately didn't have any overheating issues. Weird huh? Worth considering!
Click to expand...

original one that came with the champion radiator
 
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