416 stroker cam choice

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pat d

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i have a 416 stroker that i am putting together and have a cam that i want to reuse its a old school solid purple shaft 284/528 . my motor will be street driven when ever poss maybe the strip once in a while, motor has flat tops with valve reliefs .65cc heads pro comps (i know) 1.6 rockers poss 1 3/4 mid length headers and want to run a fuel injection m1 injection manifold if i can find one dont know on the converter 3.22 gears i think how street friendly would that cam be or do i need to go bigger ??? i know the 1.6 rockers add a little bit more but how much . will this run out of cam too soon would like to be in the 2500-6000 range on rpms
 
Before you think about using a purple mechanical cam, you need to address the needs of your injection system. I believe the manifold you are talking about is for Magnum intake pattern. If you are planning on running factory MPFI then that cam will probably be a poor choice. If you post more info, you will get a better/more accurate answer.
 
was planning on using the factory set up mopar with a super victor or m1 mag style intakes are limited think i saw something on summit for a la intake motor is going into a dak since i have it wanted to build a 408 magnum but im stuck with this 340-416 that i put some coin into so trying to make the best out of what i have.
 
forgot to add compression will be close to 10.25
 
There is a lot more to it than just bolting a bunch of stuff you have together and expect a good result. Whats the LSA? Whats the duration at .050". Whats lobe lift or is .528" calculated at 1.6? . Factory injection is very picky about LSA and centerline. The injection was designed to work with a hydraulic roller as well. The difference between a FTS cam vs Hyd Roller is huge, lobes look completely different and thus have completely different manners. This can be bad when your fuel table is determined by a MAP sensor.

Sport74, you dont need a website to figure out different ratios. Just take lobe lift x ratio or if your cam lift is spec ed at 1.5 and you want to know lift with 1.6, simply divide lift by 1.5 and multiply by 1.6 or vise versa.
 
I so agree with Magnum Mopar. That purple cam would best work with a Holley 4 corner idle carb. Not F.I.
A Edel rpm intake would be best. Even more so in a truck. Also, being it is a stroked engine, it should perform very well in the 2500-6000 rpm range you listed. Maybe a slight higher. The added cubes lower the rpm range slightly.
 
cam specs mopar #4120653 528 lift and 284 duration 112 center can map sensor be programed to run this and other modification. this cam was nice in my 340 but i was told that strokers need bigger cam and more duration. so this cam would go up to 563 0n lift does duration change also
 
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That cam has a duration of about 240 [email protected], with .528 lift based on 1.5 ratio rockers. With a 1.6 ratio its .563, plus a bit more duration . This will give you a power band in the 3000-7500 range and would want more like 3.55 gears and a big converter, at least 3200. You will have very low vacuum signal as well. I would want to talk to the guy that writes our tunes but guessing they are going to say not good. You will want a custom ground cam to take full advantage of your combo as well as using factory injection. Another thing you have not mentioned is what has been done to the heads, bowl work, push rod pinch, exhaust short side radius ...what size valves? Makes a huge difference in cam choice. What do you plan on using for throttle body? Pcm? Ignition?
 
thanks magnummopar the heads are pro comps 2.02 1.60 cnc porting 130# springs 63or 65cc chambers plan on using a ported thottle body if i use a carb what size i have a 700 ddbl pumper or a 950 and can i put a regulator on the in tank fuel pump for the carb. this sounds like it would be a dog on the street.what size cam would you recommend i want to drive on the streets and use my a/c but dont want to run out of breath
 
Without talking to my cam designer/grinder, I would say keep duratiion at .050" around 220, lift .540 with installed height of 1.660 and if your installed height is 1.800 then maybe 226 @.050" lift about .550". ground on 110 LSA . It would be a pretty hot street cam on a 5.9 so in a stroker a bit mellower. You will want pcm flash, larger injectors, big TB and good exhaust. Would work well with 2800 converter.
 
Sorry, IMO and what I have seen written about that cam, even with the 1.6 rockers adding duration, a minor amount at that, the cam will perform no where near that rpm range and a stroker eats up some of that duration lowering the operating range of any can vs. a stock stroke engine.

Did I miss the fact the cam is in a 112 and not the narrower normal centerline?
 
Call Hughes engines and talk to Dave, they've built a bunch of these engines and can steer you in the right direction.
 
I've used this cam in two 440's. I am very familiar with it. Not far off CI wise from your 416 and strokers tend to like a little more cam anyway. First off, I would not reuse a cam, especially one that is that inexpensive. However that cam ids a good choice for a street car or a street/strip car. 1.6 rockers will give you .557 lift. It has a 112lsa. It will give you a nice mild idle and a broad powerband. That cam in a 440 makes peak toque between 3500 and 4000. It makes peak hp from 5600-5800.
 
Roccodart....But it would not be great with injection, even with 112 LSA, factory injection is timed to have roller cam grind, it needs valve opened quickly so you get max shot of fuel in chamber, not gradual opening of flat lobe design.
 
thanks guys the only reason i was going to reuse this cam is that i know where it came from and it looks perfect and all the lifters are marked thinking dont have to break it in this came out of my 340 with 11-1 comp and 3'' exh this thing sounded wicked
 
just saw ur post magnummopar and now i understand a little more, getting frustrated i have this motor that im trying to do something with was going in my duster but im changing direction now have this dakota and if its not magnum stuff its not happening its the same but different a 5.9 is in its own little world
 
I would recommend against reusing a flat tappet cam and lifters from another block, 97% chance it will roll a lobe, at least IMHO. Even if it was a good grind for FI, I would say dont.
 
Its the difference between carb and FI, not 5.9 and LA. That can be dealt with easily, you just have to use right combo or it will be a dud.
 
As to the cam, maybe this will help and maybe it won't. On a 10:1 383 Chevy running a self learning throttle body system we used a solid roller 236/242 @ .050, .564/570 lift, .016/.016 lash and 113 LSA. First we used a single plane with an 850 cfm 4150 carburetor and then switched over to a 600 HP throttle body. Never had time to fully let the self learning system mature but these were the dyno results.

RPM...........Carb HP/TQ...............TB HP/TQ
2500.............334/159...............not measured
2600.............336/167........................"
2700.............347/178........................"
2800.............355/189........................"
2900.............372/205........................"
3000.............386/221....................393/224
3100.............390/230....................393/232
3200.............410/250....................402/245
3300.............417/262....................403/253
3400.............425/275....................418/271
3500.............432/288....................423/282
3600.............440/302....................426/292
3700.............445/314....................439/309
3800.............447/324....................446/322
3900.............449/333....................448/333
4000.............447/341....................450/342
4100.............435/339....................446/348
4200.............435/348....................442/354
4300.............435/356....................444/363
4400.............441/370....................442/370
4500.............451/386....................445/381
4600.............460/403....................454/398
4700.............470/420....................464/415
4800.............478/437....................468/427
4900.............482/449....................475/443
5000.............481/458....................479/456
5100.............482/468....................471/458
5200.............483/478....................473/468
5300.............481/485....................467/471
5400.............477/490....................473/486
5500.............477/499....................468/491
5600.............473/504....................468/499
5700.............473/513....................466/505
5800.............466/514....................465/513
5900.............464/522....................460/516
6000.............465/531....................451/515
6100.............452/525.................not measured
 
pat d said:
just saw ur post magnummopar and now i understand a little more, getting frustrated i have this motor that im trying to do something with was going in my duster but im changing direction now have this dakota and if its not magnum stuff its not happening its the same but different a 5.9 is in its own little world
Click to expand...

If I'm going to mess with a Magnum and it's fuel injection, the first thing I'm going to do is find a guy who knows those computers. If he doesn't know what he is doing, the computer is going to retard the ignition every time you throw a load to the engine.
 
just looking around on this site and stumbled on to the magnum stuff dont even know where i was but i will be talking to magnummopar soon . bought a r/t dakota and was trying to figure out what to do with the 5.9 wanted to put my 340-416 in it but it does not look good thats where all these questions are coming from as far as cam choices i want a dd with a set of balls the 5.9 didnt look so hot magnummopar just changed my mind . great!!!! now i will be up all night reading
 
The 5.9 is enough to be a really nice motor on the street without a big effort.
 
IQ52, I would be surprised if more tuning of TB injection wouldnt get better results and probably produce better numbers over the carb. Multi port is a very different animal, and does require a good flash to work properly. however, you will have a better end result not only in power but much better driveability. I do tend to favor roller cams and multi port, not a fan of aftermarket TB units that can be problematic and hard to source parts. Plenty of issues with FiTech and no long term results, factory injection backed up by literally several hundred thousand units with more than 200K miles on them without problems is proof that factory injection works. Ultimately, its the OP's choice to use a less than optimum cam with injection or use a carb and well, use a carb. I quit driving carburated cars over 15 years ago and never looked back. I have driven a few Darts home after purchased and cant believe I used to drive a carbed engine daily. Gave up flat tappet cams at same time, unless I was going to build very quick revving drag engine and only to save weight with lifters assuming the economy recovers enough to justify $700 lifters. :eek:
 
lots of good info so it looks like im going to dump the 416, i see the duration is a lot shorter and the center line is numerically bigger what does the centerline do and will the roller cam give me a lumpy idle ? on the 5.9 how much potential do i have with the stock bore and not breaking the bank i know heads,cam, headers, 52mm tb and a tune. 3000-3500.00 will get me close to the 400hp mark?
 
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