440 Dart cooling fan & shroud

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George R

George R

Mopar Nutcase
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Hey guys. I have very little room for a mechanical fan in my 69 Dart. Its a 440 with a BeCool 2 row aluminum radiator. I have a couple of electric fans I can use, but I've never been in favor of electric fans as primary cooling fans. Anyway, I would have to install 1 electric fan on each side of the radiator in order to have air movement over the whole radiator.
What do you veterans suggest I do here? Maybe a stainless flex fan with no spacer bolted directly to the face of the pulley? I suppose I could fab a shroud, but if you have any suggestions as far as a stock plastic shroud I will be appreciative. The radiator is 22 inches wide.

Thanks in advance for the help.

George

Hydraulic clutch & fan space 016.jpg


Hydraulic clutch & fan space 017.jpg


Hydraulic clutch & fan space 018.jpg
 
I wouldnt do a flex fan especially without a shroud. I dont think they cool worth a crap. I'll have to see what kind of room I have in the 71 but, I mocked mine up with my stock 2 core 22" rad and a clutch fan and had about 3/4 inch clearance from fan to radiator. I wonder why yours wont fit??? What is that b/w your W/P housing and the block?
 
George, I just measured my clutch fan and its 2 3/8 from mounting flange to radiator end of clutch. Maybe your rad is a little thicker than mine.?
 
Had the same problem in my 440 fastback.
Becool makes a dual 11" fan and shoud assembly worked for me.

t5220[1].jpg
 
Mike-
Thanks for measuring your set up. I only have about 2" maybe 2-1/4" tops.
The plates between the WP housing and the block are spacers. The WP housing was on an engine with a motor plate at one time, and they milled the housing to make room for the plate. The spacers are there to bring the WP housing back to where it was before machining.

Kocuda-
Can I ask what a set up like that costs? The picture you posted is very small, but it looks like the ideal ticket with my limited space, although I would hate to rely on electric fans all the time. If it will cool your monster, I'm sure it will cool my basically stock 440.

Thanks guys.

George
 
have you looked into the HHR fan setup? I hear they fit great on a 22" radiator and flow a butt load of air and are pretty reasonable as far as cost goes. Dont know how deep they are though.
 
George,
With what you have for the lower pulley I think you'll need an electric fan setup. And a good one with a shroud. It's not a good idea to put a fan on each side... they tend to cause turbulence over each other and both lose affect that way. Two smaller fans are much more efficient. Use a thermal switch to control them, and upgrade the wiring and relays to power them, and they are as reliable as any mechanical setup.
 
Thanks guys.
I have a thermal switch to turn them on/off, and it has a dial to set the on temp. I don't know what you mean when you say upgrade the wiring though. I can run the fans through a relay no problem.
Having said all that, what electric fan set ups would you recommend? I looked on eBay and found 2 that looked good, one was a single with shroud and one was a dual with shroud, and the dimensions were PERFECT but the OE application for both was V6 modern cars. I don't know if these will be enough to cool my car.
Help! LOL

George
 
71DartGuy said:
have you looked into the HHR fan setup? I hear they fit great on a 22" radiator and flow a butt load of air and are pretty reasonable as far as cost goes. Dont know how deep they are though.
Click to expand...
HHR fan assenbly looks great as far as outside dimensions, but it's 4-1/2" thick. I don't have the room.
I dunno WTF I'm gonna do here.......

Geo
 
I have a flex fan hanging in the garage if you want it to try. I'll ship it to you and hope it works and if it doesnt- oh well, at least I gained some garage space!
 
71DartGuy said:
I have a flex fan hanging in the garage if you want it to try. I'll ship it to you and hope it works and if it doesnt- oh well, at least I gained some garage space!
Click to expand...
Thats one hell of a generous offer Mike, but Moper said my lower pulley is too small to run a mechanical fan with good results.....even IF it did fit. I love the sound those flex fans make though! LOL
I got some feelers out on my Corvette board. Hopefully some of my buds can locate something that will fit.
Thanks again Mike.

George
 
George,
I took some bigger pictures and did some measuring.
The shoud at the center is about 2 1/4" from the radiator.
The unit was BeCool # 134-95007, it includes all wiring with relays, temp switch and mounting brackets. Cost me $571.99 two years ago from Jegs.
Heres the pictures, good luck.

radiator fans 001.jpg


radiator fans 002.jpg


radiator fans 003.jpg
 
Here's the setup on my Demon, using a Hayden 2765 fan clutch (Jaguar) but I can't figure where you only have 2 1/2 " of clearance where I have 3 1/2" of space. I have a Champion rad but I can't believe it's 1" thinner than your B-Cool. Are you using Schumacher mounts?

Demon.jpg
 
Kocuda-
Thats a sweet set up, but well out of my price range. It does look like the perfect ticket though. I'll keep it in mind if I can't find anything else, but I would have to save for something like that.
Nice clean install too. Thanks for taking the time to help!

Scoot-
Yes, Schumacher /6 to B/RB mounts. Has aluminum pump housing and a MP water pump. The BeCool radiator sits tight against the core support and sticks out 2-3/4" to 3" from the support. That only leaves 2-1/2" to the face of the WP pulley.
It seems I'm the only one with this little clearance. How thick is the Hayden clutch??

I might just set up 2 pusher fans on the outside of the radiator with a shroud and see what happens! LOL The motor is pretty stock with a mild solid cam.

Geo
 
There are a few places that make dual fans... Spal makes very good fans but I'm not sure about a dual assembly. What I meant by upgrade the wiring is if they call for 14ga, use 10... And run the power straight off the battery to the load supply side of the relay. I use a switch from TPI Specialties. It closes at 215 and opens at 185. Then there's no toggling a switch and it's a cleaner install. One hole in the water pump housing and a single wire vs the thermocouple and the rotary switch in view.
 
George R said:
Scoot-
Yes, Schumacher /6 to B/RB mounts. Has aluminum pump housing and a MP water pump. The BeCool radiator sits tight against the core support and sticks out 2-3/4" to 3" from the support. That only leaves 2-1/2" to the face of the WP pulley.
It seems I'm the only one with this little clearance. How thick is the Hayden clutch??
Geo
Click to expand...

The Hayden clutch is actually for a mid 90's Jag. The total length is 2.7 in. and it's 1.09 shaft length according to Hayden catalog.
 
George R said:
Kocuda-
Thats a sweet set up, but well out of my price range. It does look like the perfect ticket though. I'll keep it in mind if I can't find anything else, but I would have to save for something like that.
Nice clean install too. Thanks for taking the time to help!

Scoot-
Yes, Schumacher /6 to B/RB mounts. Has aluminum pump housing and a MP water pump. The BeCool radiator sits tight against the core support and sticks out 2-3/4" to 3" from the support. That only leaves 2-1/2" to the face of the WP pulley.
It seems I'm the only one with this little clearance. How thick is the Hayden clutch??

I might just set up 2 pusher fans on the outside of the radiator with a shroud and see what happens! LOL The motor is pretty stock with a mild solid cam.

Geo
Click to expand...
I had the same problem, even a little worse, I had to clear an A/C compressor...I used an 18" flex fan with a 2 inch spacer...and two 12" fans on the front condensor coil as pushers...they are set to come on at 180 degrees...also note how close mine was to the A/C compressor...I had to notch the fan shroud...

IMG00120-20100328-1124.jpg


IMG00122-20100328-1457.jpg
 
Thanks for the pix Bre. Engine compartment looks good.
I'll check into a flex fan & shroud and see if there'll be room.

George
 
George , what waterpump pulley is that , looks like a smallblock ?

My factory big block dart uses a 5/8" spacer on the back of the 7blade steel fan , it's not together now so I can't check the distance from pulley to rad .
 
George, the Hayden 2765 is the shortest clutch available. I tried it with a stock type 3 row 22" rad and shroud. Also tried a large single electric. Cooling was marginal for my taste until I switched to a solid, non-flex fan. If you go non-clutch, a spacer will get you closer to the core if need be but I would definitely consider some type of shroud. BTW, also using a Milodon hi-flow 180* stat. I'm getting better cooling results now with the solid fan despite any parasitic power loss.
 
JohnRR said:
George , what waterpump pulley is that , looks like a smallblock ?

My factory big block dart uses a 5/8" spacer on the back of the 7blade steel fan , it's not together now so I can't check the distance from pulley to rad .
Click to expand...
John-
The pulley was on the car when I bought it so I have no idea where it came from. I'll check later tonight for the part number and maybe one of you guys can ID it for me.
70Duster440 said:
George, the Hayden 2765 is the shortest clutch available. I tried it with a stock type 3 row 22" rad and shroud. Also tried a large single electric. Cooling was marginal for my taste until I switched to a solid, non-flex fan. If you go non-clutch, a spacer will get you closer to the core if need be but I would definitely consider some type of shroud. BTW, also using a Milodon hi-flow 180* stat. I'm getting better cooling results now with the solid fan despite any parasitic power loss.
Click to expand...

Well, I think I have enough room for the flex fan, and I'll definately get a plastic shroud for it too. Whatever fits will have to do.

Thanks for the help guys, I REALLY appreciate it.

George
 
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