72 Scamp front drums

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jrc4y4

jrc4y4

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Hi all. I got a 72 Scamp and I've never replaced the shoes on the car. I'm wanting to do the front ones.

1) What size are these (pics below, not sure how to measure, but from the part where it tapers out in the back to the center of the hub is 5.5 inches)? I wanted to order the right ones from rock auto.

2) should I replace anything else while I am in there?

3) is there already a thread that addresses these issues?
 

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Shoes are measured by the original ID of the drum and the width of the shoes.
 
Ok cool. I wanted to order parts before I took them apart so my car is down less, so I could get it fixed rather than have them set! Thanks guys. Should I replace anything else while in there?
 
Make sure to replace all hardware also!!! And check for any leakage from wheel cyl. if any replace both and don't play around with safety. If you can't stop it it doesn't matter how fast you can go!
 
well - seeing as you asked.... the whole shebang.. that car is begging for a disc brake conversion..
 
If it is all original, then I would not hesitate to 'shotgun' EVERYTHING there. With that age, the likelihood of issues with any part is very high. Certainly replace the wheel cylinders or rebuild them, and replace the rubber lines. The spring sets may be OK, but if one spring gets weak with age, then it will effect the brake operation and you may end up with a pull to right or left under braking. The drums should be turned too, but if they are worn, then you may have to replace them with new.

Being fronts, be sure to at least clean and re-pack the wheel bearings. Personally, I'd be ready to put in new bearings and races: they are pretty cheap.

There have been some warnings on the wheel cylinders from places like RockAuto being Chinese made and of questionable quality. I have had good luck with NAPA's premium line parts. I also would not bother with RockAuto brake linings unless they were a good name brand; they may be OK, but I do not know, and I got some VERY bad, unsafe linings from a low cost parts outlet. This IS the place to buy all premium parts, IMHO.

As Mike says.... I'd be changing out everything in the whole system. Fronts, rears, and master cylinder and all 3 rubber lines. Water gets absorbed by brake fluid and gets held inside the iron parts and rusts things out. The rubber lines rot on the inside lining and fall apart where you cannot see it and cause all sorts of havoc (like brakes stuck ON) when they do that. Only the main metal lines MAY be good to reuse.

BTW, nice looking car! If it has spent some of its life in a garage, then that is a plus for the overall brake system condition. But my '62 Dart got ALL new parts, including steel lines, despite spending all 52 years in a garage before I got it 2 years ago. It sat for many, many years, and all the brake parts rusted on the inside to varying degrees.
 
jrc4y4 said:
Ok cool. I wanted to order parts before I took them apart so my car is down less, so I could get it fixed rather than have them set! Thanks guys. Should I replace anything else while in there?
Click to expand...

At least get a spring kit and replace the springs, they are only about $10... One spring kit will do both sides...

I don't like the new hardware kits with the adjusting lever. The levers seem thin and do not catch the star wheel as well as the old original style ones...

Cost reductions affecting functionality... :banghead: :banghead: :banghead:
 
Cool, thanks for all the input on this! I've never dealt with drums before. The car HAS been garage kept for most of its life (bought from the original family in 2004). It has NON power brakes and occasionally I have to pump the brake once to get it to really grab, so I'm guessing there could be something up with those lines.

nm9stheham I am seeing the shoes, lines, and hardware on NAPA but I am NOT seeing the cylinders. Any other ideas? Good call on not Rock Auto on the safety side. As was said, if you can't stop it, it doesn't matter how fast you go. And I don't feel like risking my or other's lives. ScampMike, I would love to do a disc brake conversion. But when I do that, I will do BBP conversion, then I'm into wheels and tires, etc..
 
jrc4y4 said:
Cool, thanks for all the input on this! I've never dealt with drums before. The car HAS been garage kept for most of its life (bought from the original family in 2004). It has NON power brakes and occasionally I have to pump the brake once to get it to really grab, so I'm guessing there could be something up with those lines.

nm9stheham I am seeing the shoes, lines, and hardware on NAPA but I am NOT seeing the cylinders. Any other ideas? Good call on not Rock Auto on the safety side. As was said, if you can't stop it, it doesn't matter how fast you go. And I don't feel like risking my or other's lives. ScampMike, I would love to do a disc brake conversion. But when I do that, I will do BBP conversion, then I'm into wheels and tires, etc..
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Pumping up on occasion like that is a bad sign. It could be in the master cylinder (gunk in the bore making the pistons stick) or wheel cylinders or a few other spots, like something pushing the shoes back. MC goes on the list as mandatory at this point, IMHO.

BTW, I am seeing the NAPA Ultra Premium wheel cylinders for a 1927 Plymouth Scamp online... $28 each for the 10" fronts and $10 for the rears, and less if you do regular biz locally and get a discount. Not sure what is up with your NAPA search.

And, BTW, I go with NAPA because I get them locally and can look at the parts when I get them and before I pay, and can easily return them if there is a problem. All ther brake parts have worked for me, but I stick with the top grades. I avoid the 'Duralast' and other lesser cost parts at the other stores. RockAuto may have some better parts: I do see they have the Raybestos ones. But again, it is a pain to do returns and wait, etc.

It will be very worth your while to go to www.mymopar.com com and find the Factory Service Manual online for free for you car, and download it.

AAAAND since the system is so unknown to you, I'd pull the front drums and have them checked for inside diameter to see if they can be turned before getting too far into buying parts. If not, then there is that cost for drums, and you may want to look at a disk upgrade sooner rather than later. Sorry..... it seems like there is never a clear, straight-line path to the finish on this stuff LOL
 
Found the wheel cylinders. Picked those up, along with bearings, shoes, and spring kits this morning. Hoses come in tomorrow morning. Gonna see how that works before also doing the master cylinder.
 
Now your on the right track! If your planning on keeping the car the disc conversion as mentioned before is something to consider in future and it can be done on a tight budget and well worth the investment!
 
jrc4y4 said:
Found the wheel cylinders. Picked those up, along with bearings, shoes, and spring kits this morning. Hoses come in tomorrow morning. Gonna see how that works before also doing the master cylinder.
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Just keep in mind that you will have to bleed the system when doing the wheel cylinders, and then do it again, when you replace the MC.

But, it may be worthwhile to do one step at a time so as to not introduce too many variables and changes at one time. That would especially good if you have not ever done it a lot.

When you do get to the MC, you will have to perform a process called 'bench bleeding' of the new MC. That is very important to do well or you will always and forever have soft brakes.

When bleeding the wheel cylinders, you will find it very useful to have a small offset wrench made for the task; make sure you get one to fit the bleeder screws hex size on your wheel cylinders; they may be 1/4", 5/16" or even 3/8". The right angle ones are more useful for drums brakes than the simple offset types.

Like this one: http://www.ebay.com/itm/Snap-On-1-4...rench-6-Point-Double-Box-Wrench-/131774697950
 
Too bad you were in a hurry -- and picked up all the garbage parts from the chinesium world of parts stores / rock auto.....

I have ALLLLLL of the above -- NEW OLD STOCK ___ VERY VERY AMERICAN MADE ---
and with N.O.S. ++ Asbestos ++ Brake shoes --- which , of course, none of them CAN
have.....

Unless you want to return all that garbage ---- maybe now you are stuck with it.....

IF you want to do the ABSOLUTE RIGHT thing --- you would be smart to get all these
items from me..... that is WHY I hunt this stuff down -- and am at Chryslers @ Carlisle in July and @ the Mopar Nationals in Columbus, Ohio in August....

It is up to you whether you care about your car or not........................
 
FYI, if you want to keep the small bolt pattern-- the scarebird conversion has been successfully done numerous times. By the time you pay for these drum brake parts you would be well on your way to converting to disc brakes.

Just something to ponder, Lawrence
 
mobileparts, I didn't say I had already bought all the stuff from Rock Auto. Just that I was looking there. I priced everything and planned on doing drums and bought the stuff from NAPA, expecting my rotors to be turnable. Turns out they weren't (no pun intended).

With that said, for the price of hoses, wheel cylinders, shoes, bearings, drums, and spring/hardware kit, I'm looking at right at $300.

I don't want to spend $750 on a BBP disc conversion, because then comes wheels/tires/changing my rear end, etc.

Vdart, I looked into this scarebird. Is this what you're talking about?
https://scarebird.com/index.php?route=product/product&path=64&product_id=143

Looks like the rotors are drilled for BBP and SBP which is nice. I did a little looking on the forum and have not seen anything bad about it. What do you guys think? Thanks for all the input.
 
mobileparts said:
Too bad you were in a hurry -- and picked up all the garbage parts from the chinesium world of parts stores / rock auto.....

I have ALLLLLL of the above -- NEW OLD STOCK ___ VERY VERY AMERICAN MADE ---
and with N.O.S. ++ Asbestos ++ Brake shoes --- which , of course, none of them CAN
have.....

Unless you want to return all that garbage ---- maybe now you are stuck with it.....

IF you want to do the ABSOLUTE RIGHT thing --- you would be smart to get all these
items from me..... that is WHY I hunt this stuff down -- and am at Chryslers @ Carlisle in July and @ the Mopar Nationals in Columbus, Ohio in August....

It is up to you whether you care about your car or not........................
Click to expand...
Self Prompt much?
 
Haha exactly. Car isn't a concourse job. Dont need NOS parts...because i dont care about my car lol
 
Shop around on the drums... they are all made overseas now and some sources are less expensive than others. That might be a place to shop for NOS parts but finding that may be tough and they will be even more pricey. I would expect all the disc conversion rotors to be made overseas too.

BTW, why were the drums not turnable? I ask because a lot of places (includes NAPA stores too) don't want to fool with them and just want to sell you new ones. Were they worn too deep or what? I'd take them to an older shop and get a few more opinions if it was just a matter of the parts store said they would not turn within limits due to grooving or similar. Did they actually put a gage on them?
 
There was a REALLY deep groove in the middle of it that was going to take a lot of material off.
 
It doesn't have to be a concourse car -- to want GOOD BRAKES....
Drivers and Concourse cars alike NEED good brakes -- and this new garbage that they are
required to produce -- just plain stinks -- there is no "sugarcoating" it.......

I have N.O.S. ++ Asbestos ++ Brake Shoes --- for 6 cylinder also !! ---
American Made Brake Hardware (on this thread -- it is indicated how pathetic this china
garbage is) and N.O.S. U.S.A. made brake drums -- and OUR steel of yesteryear is FAR FAR SUPERIOR to china steel.... (Ever see any 140 story buildings in Bangkok??????)

And my prices are NOT outrageous ---I go out finding these goodies -- and closing out
businesses -- so I am not paying top dollars for it -- and I can pass along the savings
to you.......

Drivers and Concourse --------- SMART PEOPLE call me................Yours, Craig.....:blob:
 
Just a question for my knowledge bank. Does anyone know if and why all scamps came with a 10 in drum? I crashed my 73 duster and bought a donor 73 scamp and used its k, suspension and drums and noticed i had 9in before and 10 5x4 now . Also im going 8 3/4 with drum on the back will i be able to use my front drum system with a 383 bb with my stock master cylinder? I heard those front drums were used on many bb apps before minus the pattern. Input and suggestions welcome. Thanx
 
deathdust73 said:
Just a question for my knowledge bank. Does anyone know if and why all scamps came with a 10 in drum? I crashed my 73 duster and bought a donor 73 scamp and used its k, suspension and drums and noticed i had 9in before and 10 5x4 now . Also im going 8 3/4 with drum on the back will i be able to use my front drum system with a 383 bb with my stock master cylinder? I heard those front drums were used on many bb apps before minus the pattern. Input and suggestions welcome. Thanx
Click to expand...
6 cylinder cars were equipped with 9" x 2 1/2" in the Front & 9" x 2" in the Rear ,
8 cylinder cars were equipped with 10" x 2 1/4" in the Front & 10" x 1 3/4" in the Rear .....
This is for ALL "A" Body MOPAR cars from 1963 - 1972, All Models; Dart, Duster, Valiant, Scamp, Swinger, and Cuda/Barracuda through 1969.
All Small Bolt Pattern -- 5 studs X 4" Bolt circle -- No Exceptions....
I have N.O.S. ++ Asbestos ++ Shoes for EVERY application just listed !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! A Must for Very thin brand new Mopar Drums !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
I have N.O.S. ++ U S A Made ++ Brake Drums for EVERY application just listed -- though USA MADE quantities are LOW for some of just listed.....
 
mobileparts said:
6 cylinder cars were equipped with 9" x 2 1/2" in the Front & 9" x 2" in the Rear ,
8 cylinder cars were equipped with 10" x 2 1/4" in the Front & 10" x 1 3/4" in the Rear .....
This is for ALL "A" Body MOPAR cars from 1963 - 1972, All Models; Dart, Duster, Valiant, Scamp, Swinger, and Cuda/Barracuda through 1969.
All Small Bolt Pattern -- 5 studs X 4" Bolt circle -- No Exceptions....
I have N.O.S. ++ Asbestos ++ Shoes for EVERY application just listed !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! A Must for Very thin brand new Mopar Drums !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
I have N.O.S. ++ U S A Made ++ Brake Drums for EVERY application just listed -- though USA MADE quantities are LOW for some of just listed.....
Click to expand...

What about 73 and up?
 
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