Bad noise when clutch is disengaged! Help

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Kevin Jonker

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When clutch is pushed in loud screeching! The clutch setup, pilot bushing and Ram billet flywheel don't have 1000 miles and 7 1/4 mile passes on them. It's a centerforce dual friction with their T.O bearing. Does it look like the fingers on the clutch are not being evenly pressed down? I might have had the clutch adjustment to far to where the T.O bearing was over extending, but only for a couple of runs down the 1/4 at the most. Also the input shaft on the trans will move from side to side and all around in the bearing retainer but spins easily. Also on a side note, the trans has had an issue going into rev. You had to turn the motor off to get it into rev (major grinding), (I adjusted the shifter lever alignment using the hole). Out of the blue one day rev works fine!? Don't understand that at all! Thanks for all your input. Kevin
 

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The diaphragm fingers look like the throw out bearing is locking up under preload. Do you have a way to squeeze the throw out bearing together with slight pressure and see if it locks up or gets difficult to spin?
 
Ya know i thought about that, so I will see if i can put it in the vise or something. It just seems like that would be the simplest explanation. Thx for confirming that thought.
 
Kevin Jonker said:
Ya know i thought about that, so I will see if i can put it in the vise or something. It just seems like that would be the simplest explanation. Thx for confirming that thought.
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you can't spin it if its clamped in a vise:banghead:
 
I'd check the pilot bushing/bearing real good too. The reverse problem may have been a dragging clutch caused by bad adjustment, warped clutch disc, or faulty pressure plate. You can test the T/O bearing in a vise by using another known good bearing on the other side. I use an inner wheel bearing to do it. Just don't get carried away clamping it as you can damage them.
 
also, i just got my 340-4 speed running, and if i try to put it in gear with the pedal all the way down, it just grinds. but if i back off the pedal some, it shifts great, telling me that it is over extending the finger of pressure plate into the disc
 
I Agree with cudamark on the pilot bushing stick a little white lithium grease in it if you can.

Question is, Does it do the same thing and sound the same with the trans in nuetral when you push the clutch in.
The reason I ask is because a tight non lubricated pilot bushing will make it hard to get into reverse also.
So the whole problem could be the pilot bushing being dry.
As far as the input shaft moving around, the pilot bushing holds it straight when the trans is in the car.



cudamark said:
I'd check the pilot bushing/bearing real good too. The reverse problem may have been a dragging clutch caused by bad adjustment, warped clutch disc, or faulty pressure plate. You can test the T/O bearing in a vise by using another known good bearing on the other side. I use an inner wheel bearing to do it. Just don't get carried away clamping it as you can damage them.
Click to expand...
 
I had that happen once.
Kinda pissed me off that I went overboard making sure everything was nice and tight and all the bushings in the linkage were good and tight, only to find out it caused an over extention problem.
I had to back off the adjuster farther than I liked, just so it wouldn't trash on the thing.:banghead:

340plot said:
also, i just got my 340-4 speed running, and if i try to put it in gear with the pedal all the way down, it just grinds. but if i back off the pedal some, it shifts great, telling me that it is over extending the finger of pressure plate into the disc
Click to expand...
 
I see nothing wrong with the pilot bushing. End of the main shaft looks and feels fine. We greased the pilot bushing and the input shaft lightly when we installed it. I have the previous throwout bearing (it didn't make noise) from before, it only had a few 1000 miles on it. I pressed the two throwout bearings together in the vice. No problems with either. both spun with no noise. Could it be that we didn't put enough grease in the pilot bushing before we installed it? or it dried up? I will call Passon and Brewers to see if they have any answers also. Also yes it did it in neutral.
 
This is another one that I would love to see and hear in person.
It HAS to be a throwout bearing, pessure/plate or fork issue.
If I could see and feel it I could tell you exactly what it was.
Dammit!




Kevin Jonker said:
I see nothing wrong with the pilot bushing. End of the main shaft looks and feels fine. We greased the pilot bushing and the input shaft lightly when we installed it. I have the previous throwout bearing (it didn't make noise) from before, it only had a few 1000 miles on it. I pressed the two throwout bearings together in the vice. No problems with either. both spun with no noise. Could it be that we didn't put enough grease in the pilot bushing before we installed it? or it dried up? I will call Passon and Brewers to see if they have any answers also. Also yes it did it in neutral.
Click to expand...
 
What clutch fork pivot point bracket do you have in the bell.
If you have a B or E bracket in there it can cause the same problem.
Also what lenght is your clutch fork?
 
Well we put a new throwout bearing in. lightly greased the input shaft with ams oil syn. grease. We bolted the trans back up and fired the car while still on the ramps and stands, One float was sticking spewing some fuel so we ran it just long enough to push the clutch in a couple of times, Yippee no noise! shut it off, installed shifter linkage, trans. crossmember, driveshaft, yadda yadda, go to fire it up and test drive and guess what? It's screaming just like before!!!!!!! I am about done!!!!!! The zbar is not perfectly straight so the adjustment rod is angled some, but this was they way it was before for 700 plus miles (before the noise started). I can't believe I got a bad, brand new Centerforce T.O. bearing. The old T.O. bearing with about 700 miles on it, did have a little slop, (movement forward and back) in it. What do you think?
 
I ened up with exactly same problem...
I have the same clutch as you etc,...I changed the throw out bearing,even changed the pilot bearing from bushing to roller style.Tranny in, tranny out mult. times etc.... pain in the azz.

A tranny buddy of mine said could be in the transmission,probably the bearing at the input shaft to mainshaft. Well i didnt want to dig into the tranny as it shifted great etc. I put another one in that i had, just different ratios,................. Noise now gone, yay.........
We torn the other tranny apart,and checked the bearings etc,didnt look to bad, i put in a couple of new ones in anyway. Put the original trans back and and its been working noise free ever since...So maybe in the tranny ???
 
I think the op found his problem z-bar not straight, and clutch rod at an angle.
This may be a stack of of tolerance problems, like the front bearing in the tranny shot.
But with the marks on the pressure plate, it is shot. No doubt arguing that.
I have seen alot, the flwheel may be even ground at an angle, and not running true to the crank.
 
onetorun said:
I ened up with exactly same problem...
I have the same clutch as you etc,...I changed the throw out bearing,even changed the pilot bearing from bushing to roller style.Tranny in, tranny out mult. times etc.... pain in the azz.

A tranny buddy of mine said could be in the transmission,probably the bearing at the input shaft to mainshaft. Well i didnt want to dig into the tranny as it shifted great etc. I put another one in that i had, just different ratios,................. Noise now gone, yay.........
We torn the other tranny apart,and checked the bearings etc,didnt look to bad, i put in a couple of new ones in anyway. Put the original trans back and and its been working noise free ever since...So maybe in the tranny ???
Click to expand...
If it was those roller bearings it would make noise with the car stationary, in neutral, and the clutch engaged. With the clutch released, there should be very little movement of the input shaft if any. More than a little and you'd never get it in gear without grinding.
 
I sure appreciate the input folks. So the wear on the pressure plate looks excessive? If it were something in the trans, why didn't it make noise while just the trans was bolted up? I realize that without the cross member in place (we just had a floor jack supporting the trans with the 4 trans bolts tight) the trans probably wasn't in it's exact normal position but, you would think that that alignment would not have changed enough to cause the difference in noise. Also if I would have had a noise from the git go then I would understand the zbar and adjustment rod being not aligned perfectly causing the issue. But it was that way for a year and about 700 miles. Also the rev all of a sudden working when it was a pain to get into before has me baffled. I may just save up the money and install a hydraulic T.O. bearing setup... Pulled on the crank pulley, got no perceptible movement.
 
I concur that it is probably the input shaft bearing. A misalignment there will allow the shaft to be off-center which will cause the throw-out bearing to have problems engaging correctly with the pressure plate. This will also make it very difficult to shift into reverse. Ignoring this will cause you to break the gear teeth in the input shaft and the idler shaft gears - a very expensive replacement for sure! Good luck!
 
Hey guys:

Not to walk over a thread, but I have one making a noise also, except that mine is the opposite, noisy with the clutch let OUT.

I made a video of it and thought it would be educational to be able to differentiate the causes of noises when folks search for info on this type of problem:

[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n-C91jUgfuk"]Dodge A833OD noise... - YouTube[/ame]
 
Yours sounds more like a throwout bearing noise but it could be the input bearing too. Maybe both. Is there plenty of freeplay in the clutch adjustment? Can you feel a vibration with your hand on the clutch pedal without depressing the pedal? Does the transmission shift ok otherwise?
 
@ tylerw your noise is probably coming from the input bearing or the countershaft bearings in the transmission.
 
Well update on clutch noise. Cars sat since last post in feb. except for startups. Car is all together. I got thinking and put the car backup on stands and made sure trans was full of lube. Then I fired it to be sure noise was still there, it was... Then I put a floor jack under the trans and applied a little lift to the tranny. Fired car and wow less noise when clutch pushed in! Jacked it up some more and clutch noise gone... In my earlier posts recap, new TO bearing, new bronze crankshaft input shaft bushing, lightly lubed. Since engine/bell/trans/trans mount are all bolted together, could the possibility of the trans main input shaft bearings being bad be eliminated? My thought is it has to be in the clutch linkage. Pushing up the trans should have no effect on any other alignment right? Need 2 sets of eyes and a better back and neck for this stuff, LOL
 
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