BIG wheelhop! Please critique my launch

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Hey guys, i appreciate all the help and suggestions

Pinion angle is definatly a problem and will be getting fixed before anything else...im going to go one step at a time and see what helps and what doesnt...Going to be getting some shims to set the pinion angle down to about 4 degrees nose down (please chime in if this is too much/too little for a street strip stick car)

If that doesnt fix it, i will be going to a different shock, and i feel i probably will...mopar340dave, i dont have those ones, mine are part number C2620...maybe i will order a set of the ones you have...should they work ok on my car even though i dont have the ss springs? will they be too long or make the car sit higher?

I have the snubber still which i will also try once i make the change...if it still hops, then i will have to move to the SS springs or caltracs, but i will see when the time comes

also, does anybody know what factory cars came with a long shock? just in case i want to go factory non adjustable as im not sure how much the CE's cost

thanks so far everyone! I love how everyone tries to help! the variety of replies is great for getting an idea what needs to done!
 
The CE's i have will work on yours. They are 14.5"-24.5", compressed and extended. You sit about the same height as ss springs now. Given the choice today, I would go with the cal tracs and their split mono leaf springs. You can always add the caltracs later and just get the springs for now. Thee ss springs work great but they are a lot heavier. They may be better for all around drivability though. They handle pretty good.
Anyone have comments on the Calvert split mono leaf springs?
 
mopar340dave said:
The snubber is fine for moderate acceleration but we're talking drag here. The snubber hitting the pan can cause the tires to load and unload=wheel hop. Your springs are not strong enough to deal with the torque with or without the snubber, I think. you did the right thing clamping the fronts but a stiffer set will pay dividends bigtime.
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I know a guy that is running 9.20's with S/S springs and a snubber pulling the wheels off the ground just a bit.

Purple Haze said:
I say get some SS springs and fix your pinion angle first.
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Absoultely!!!!!!
 
mopar340dave said:
The CE's i have will work on yours. They are 14.5"-24.5", compressed and extended. You sit about the same height as ss springs now. Given the choice today, I would go with the cal tracs and their split mono leaf springs. You can always add the caltracs later and just get the springs for now. Thee ss springs work great but they are a lot heavier. They may be better for all around drivability though. They handle pretty good.
Anyone have comments on the Calvert split mono leaf springs?
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My advice for him is go ahead with the cal trac/mono leaf setup. I wouldn't suggest SS springs, because as long as you're spending money go with the better technology available today. The only alternative I would suggest is stock springs from a 340 car if he can get em cheap, or work out his modified /6 springs to be the equivalent to them.

His first order of business is get that pinion angle right and some longer shocks. SS springs won't help a damn bit if those 2 things are still wrong.
 
451Cuda said:
My advice for him is go ahead with the cal trac/mono leaf setup. I wouldn't suggest SS springs, because as long as you're spending money go with the better technology available today. The only alternative I would suggest is stock springs from a 340 car if he can get em cheap, or work out his modified /6 springs to be the equivalent to them.

His first order of business is get that pinion angle right and some longer shocks. SS springs won't help a damn bit if those 2 things are still wrong.
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Exactly!!

Another trick you might want to try is this, it is very cheap, put in some 1/8 or 1/4" thick bar stock on the top of the front segment of the springs (both side), from the back part of the front eye too the front of the spring purch, clamp it all down, at least 3 clamps on each side, fix your pinion angle, longer shocks, make sure the rear hangers are positioned right, you won't be out much $$$, you can also try the snubber, but set it at least 1/4" away from the floor, no more, but try it without the snubber 1st.
 
hey guys, i agree the pinion angle needs to be corrected before anything else...like i said one step at a time

Ive already spent 100 bucks on getting the factory springs clamped extra in the front and a leaf added to stiffen them up...I have the snubber as well, and i checked yesterday and its about a half inch from the floor giver take

once i get the pinion angle fixed, first order of business will be to take the car to an abandoned area and do a few launches to see what happens...if im still getting hop, im going to go to a longer shock...if it still happens after that then i would probably go to a caltrac since they are only 50 bucks more than SS springs (SS springs are 300 bucks here in good ole canada) and are better technology imo

Im just wondering, if i did go the caltrac route, how hard are they to setup and how well do they work with a factory spring like what i have? and how do they ride on the street most importantly
 
and one more thing....who knows what cars came with the LONG shocks that i want and need...im talking as long as possible...those CE shocks that mopar340dave suggested have only one inch more extension than mine, and im not sure thats really going to do much
 
Rumble, because our suspension extends under torque, that snubber is most likely not touching the pan when it counts. You want the springs and the tires to hold the torque. The snubber was a factory band aid for a soft suspension.
 
mshred said:
hey guys, i agree the pinion angle needs to be corrected before anything else...like i said one step at a time

Ive already spent 100 bucks on getting the factory springs clamped extra in the front and a leaf added to stiffen them up...I have the snubber as well, and i checked yesterday and its about a half inch from the floor giver take

once i get the pinion angle fixed, first order of business will be to take the car to an abandoned area and do a few launches to see what happens...if im still getting hop, im going to go to a longer shock...if it still happens after that then i would probably go to a caltrac since they are only 50 bucks more than SS springs (SS springs are 300 bucks here in good ole canada) and are better technology imo

Im just wondering, if i did go the caltrac route, how hard are they to setup and how well do they work with a factory spring like what i have? and how do they ride on the street most importantly
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The cal trac setup is about $350 and the cal trac mono-leaf spring is another $350. Thats a lot more than a set of $300 SS springs. Even if you spend a bunch of time resetting your pinion angle without fixing the spring/shock problem then you probably wont see much of an improvement. Then when you get (whichever) new springs, you will need to re-check or re-set the pinion angle again anyway.

I would not put anymore time or money into the old 6-cyl leafs. I say, change to SSs (or XHDs) and new shocks and then set the pinion angle. The SS springs work great (all the way into the 10s - 9s or maybe even faster) with the correct shocks and pinion angle. If you have your heart set on Cal tracs, It will be much more money but no doubt a good investment if you plan to go to the track a lot.

Maybe you already said and I didn't see but here is another question: Do you have subframe connectors?
 
I have a triangular 4 link and get occasional wheel hop. I suspect a pinion angle issue. Anyone know the right pinion angle for a 4 link set up.
 
It does not change so much (or shouldn't) so you want only a degree or so down.
 
684mulas said:
The cal trac setup is about $350 and the cal trac mono-leaf spring is another $350. Thats a lot more than a set of $300 SS springs. Even if you spend a bunch of time resetting your pinion angle without fixing the spring/shock problem then you probably wont see much of an improvement. Then when you get (whichever) new springs, you will need to re-check or re-set the pinion angle again anyway.

I would not put anymore time or money into the old 6-cyl leafs. I say, change to SSs (or XHDs) and new shocks and then set the pinion angle. The SS springs work great (all the way into the 10s - 9s or maybe even faster) with the correct shocks and pinion angle. If you have your heart set on Cal tracs, It will be much more money but no doubt a good investment if you plan to go to the track a lot.

Maybe you already said and I didn't see but here is another question: Do you have subframe connectors?
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caltracs do not have to be used with their monoleafs, which is why i asked how they would work with a factory spring...obviously 600+ dollars is nowhere near 300 bucks, i was comparing just straight caltracs only to SS springs

as far as SS springs go, im not ready to put my money into them plain and simple...ive seen far too many guys run fine with stock 6cyl springs or xhd's (Which i attempted to mimick by adding a leaf under the main leaf on each spring...also unclamped the rears and clamped the fronts) to spend the money on the SS springs...like i said, i will fix the pinion angle and launch it...same problem, then i will change the shocks...if it occurs after that, only then will i decide on SS springs/ caltracs...i dont have money to splurge on all this stuff at once, so im going to go step by step trial and error and see what it needs...the car does have subframe connectors as well

I have some axle shims on order to get my pinion angle correct, which should be here by Tuesday...once i get them installed i will be taking the car out for some launches in the country just to see if im getting the same problem and then go from there
 
One thing I have read about the caltracs is the ride tends to be stiff with them adjusted to work on the strip. I called them a while ago and was told by a sales rep that the monspring's life span is very short......
 
hey thanks for the info guys! kinda figured the monos wouldnt be the greatest street option...gonna get this stuff figured out first and then see if the car needs the SS springs or caltracs...redid my shock settings as they were different from eachother (DOH!) and found a broken trans slip yoke that now needs to be replaced, so when its all back on the road will do some testing and see what happens...im almost certain the shocks will still be too short, but its worth a try before spending more money
 
mshred said:
hey thanks for the info guys! kinda figured the monos wouldnt be the greatest street option...gonna get this stuff figured out first and then see if the car needs the SS springs or caltracs...redid my shock settings as they were different from eachother (DOH!) and found a broken trans slip yoke that now needs to be replaced, so when its all back on the road will do some testing and see what happens...im almost certain the shocks will still be too short, but its worth a try before spending more money
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I noticed in 2 of your replies you mentioned that you have the rear of the springs clamped, this might be alot of your problem, The trick is to let them "fan" out back there, try un-clamping them & see how it reacts.
 
JoeDust451 said:
I noticed in 2 of your replies you mentioned that you have the rear of the springs clamped, this might be alot of your problem, The trick is to let them "fan" out back there, try un-clamping them & see how it reacts.
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hey Joe,

i was actually just going to do that tommoro! lol i was sitting looking at the springs and in all honesty the one clamp that i still have on the rear segment doesnt need to be there if i have 4 up front...i just kinda thought it would be better for street driving, but all its for is to keep the leafs in place in their stacked position, which i shouldnt have a problem with...the clamp is comin off when i hit the garage!
 
mshred said:
hey Joe,

i was actually just going to do that tommoro! lol i was sitting looking at the springs and in all honesty the one clamp that i still have on the rear segment doesnt need to be there if i have 4 up front...i just kinda thought it would be better for street driving, but all its for is to keep the leafs in place in their stacked position, which i shouldnt have a problem with...the clamp is comin off when i hit the garage!
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Yeah, if its just the factory peice, its not a "clamp" like most think, its just a strap thats on there loosely, doesn't keep the springs from moving (slideing), BUT if you added a solid type clamp/clamps back there, take them off, the rear needs to have movement.
 
These suckers:

720-1293.jpg


http://www.jegs.com/i/Mr-Gasket/720/1293/10002/-1?parentProductId=1196571

and they do more than just keep the stack in place, they prevent separation of any kind, and effectively turn the front section into a torque arm.
 
I put a set of C.E's Slide-a-Link setup on my truck due to it having severe wheelhop on Micky's 33x21.5 street tires. They Worked!! Toughest part of the install was pressing the solid aluminum sleeve in the front of the leafspring. Other than that it was a breeze.
 
the clamp i have is similar to a factory style, as are the ones in the front...but they must be working slightly since the body seperated quite a bit on launch with just those springs and a pinion snubber...i may look into those mr. gasket clamps or maybe make a set of my own
 
mshred said:
the clamp i have is similar to a factory style, as are the ones in the front...but they must be working slightly since the body seperated quite a bit on launch with just those springs and a pinion snubber...i may look into those mr. gasket clamps or maybe make a set of my own
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You can get the clamp kits at O"Reilly or AZone, its a 2 pack & around 15 bucks, if all you have on the front are the factory clamps Hum... (straps), they will not work, you need to literly "CLAMP" the springs tight, i would also try putting the snubber right on the floor with you in it, if clamping the springs, adj. the pinion angle, making sure the shocks are long enough & the rear shackles are angled right doesn't work, then i'd get some SS springs are C-tracs.
 
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