Thanks,that's great info .
Box and No Box
- Thread starter Demonx2
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If I was younger I would set my car up totally different. Right now if I try going off the bottom bulb I redlite because my car leaves hard. What I’m seeing more and more from the younger crowd is to set your car up with a long throw transbrake button ( Just In Time). Now you can run box, no box class and have some adjustments. Now they run both classes so they get double the time trials, double the first rounds, double the buybacks. They always go rounds so it has some payback, they get on a roll being on the track so often and are hard to beat. As far as guys that have dropped back into so called street class we have a few racers that have run this class that was meant for beginner racers for years beating up on guys just starting out. Soon they get discouraged and quit racing. Some never make the move from a test n tuner because of it.
Good post. We have/had a guy who ran box/no box with the same car which caused lots of pissed of racers. He’d take his box out when running with us and just use a regular button. Eventually the track made a rule you couldn’t run two classes with the same car which solved that problem. We have a big money race every where that everyone can double enter in though, and the no box cars have to run against the box cars when there’s 8 of each left. The box guys still get to use their crossover which upsets me enough that I refuse to enter. The only no box racer to ever win that race was the same guy previously mentioned. He’s very well known in the Midwest/west.
I have a long throw Terminator button. It’s no where near the same as a box. You’re still waiting for the third light to come on. It’s adjusting the car to leave when you’re comfortable as opposed to adjusting to the car. Like changing front tire pressure, tire size, launch rpm, or using blinders. I’ve driven other peoples cars that leave slow enough they don’t need a long throw button.
Back in the 1980’s to 1990’s when I was running high 9’s with a 727 I had to do something to slow me down. So I added a visor to my helmet and put 4-5 rows of black electrical tape across it making a blinder. I found them lower my head so I could only see the last yellow. That worked great at most tracks but back then lighting was way weaker and some tracks would shine a spotlight on the tree, and some didn’t. Without that light it was tricky dropping your head and finding that last yellow.
Ohhh and locally most tracks at least on the east coast promote double-entering. They would be stupid not to. That’s easy money.
I tried blinders I screwed to the roof bracing in the car. Worked good a couple years until I lost some night races. The second bulb looks a lot like the third when you can see it refracting off the windshield. Now I use those blinders to block the opponents side of the tree.
I have my own opinions on that. I feel that bracket racing is supposed to have a level playing field for all budgets, and giving the wealthy guy a data advantage defeats that. The entry fee for the big money race we have is $200 per car, and they can double enter. That’s significant money to only have a chance to win $5000 after beating two rounds of super pro guys. Easy money for the track, but not what I consider fair. Why not have triple entries? Four entries? I like the idea of first round buybacks instead.
We are lucky around here as we have big money box, no box, and footbrake only races. Michael Beard being a footbrake racer is a promoter and has several of each but sadly for me he has his races down south. I did attend his St Patrick Day race in Virginia years ago and really enjoyed it. Bad track prep forced him to go further south.
Nobox and foot brake guys get no love here. The sponsors and track operators are all super pro guys, so everything is to their benefit. We outnumber them at least 3 to 1, and pay the same entry fees.
Rat Bastid
Dunamis Metron
I think you’ll be at 5200. That’s my WAG.
justinp61
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I have no problems at all with guys unhooking their box and running no box. Around here only the bigger races allow double entry, again I have no problem. I would have a problem with no box having to run box though.
And how is the fact someone says they'll unhook the delay box enforced? No way to know if they let go of the button on the top or bottom bulb. And no way to prove it later either. You can't expect the guy pulling cars out of the staging lanes to crawl in every car and see what they have or have not done in their wiring.
Sorry - you're right I'm skeptical. Because I've seen the cheats first-hand!! And that was just a guy using a tbrake in the Sportsman footbrake class. More than once and more than one weekend! Sadly, money begets greed begets cheating! Im of the opinion that you build your car for the class you want and then race in that class. No extra or missing hardware for the class you are in!!
Sorry - you're right I'm skeptical. Because I've seen the cheats first-hand!! And that was just a guy using a tbrake in the Sportsman footbrake class. More than once and more than one weekend! Sadly, money begets greed begets cheating! Im of the opinion that you build your car for the class you want and then race in that class. No extra or missing hardware for the class you are in!!
I worry more about guys using illegal ignition systems and Grids that are set up to do things they aren’t allowed to do. Our track has the machine to detect this but I’ve never seen him or heard of him using it.
Well we'll have to make some noise soon & figure that out.
B3422w5
Well-Known Member
some tracks/ races require the removal of the box. If found, you are disqualified.
our track has lots of guys who run both classes, but they don’t require the box to be out of the car
And I know your track is well attended. So I guarantee there's some rules being broken in the No Box class!!
Charrlie_S
Well-Known Member
Don't even get me started about my opinion of "box" cars/racers
Very educational. Thanks to everyone for posting.
Many guys bad mouth something without ever doing it. I’ve done all three so I’ve seen the tricks in all three class. I can give a few suggestions if you want to listen. If you have say a slower (6.50 eighth mile, 10.50 quarter mile car) learn how to “deep stage”. A trick used by many in box class and some in no box is the do their burn out and coast PAST the tree. They then back into the first, staged, the just into the pre staged. Then they know exactly where they are. As soon as their competition hits the pre staged they bump in. Others will not stage first. Lots of game players out there. But if you think box class is so easy join us. You better be ready the split second the bulb lights. Lol
That’s my problem. I refuse to pay for a class that I have to run against someone with cross-talk. We used to do a quick 16 here which let the fast cars use their box, but not crossover. Without that little feature a lot of those guys fall apart. I won’t that class twice with no box. They must’ve been tired of losing to the pro guys, so they started allowing cross talk this year
"Cross talk"? Another term we hear but a lackey like me would appreciate you defining. I suspect there are others too.
Their delay box is setup to let go of the button when their slower opponents light comes on. They put the other guys dial-in in the box which does the calculations on top of their set delay. Usually the timing system in that class turns on both top ambers at the same time regardless of the dial. If it’s not bad enough to leave on the top bulb, these guys don’t even have the focus to wait a second extra.
Thx for the explanation! Sorry but for me, all this seems more like a video game than a drag race. I certainly have no issues if some enjoy that, it's just not for me. It doesn't meet my old-school definition of a drag race. I prefer mano a mano, car against car, with handicaps as bracket racing is what allowed anyone and everyone to get in the action and enjoy the sport as it was conceived.
justinp61
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For the box haters, how do you feel about foot brakers running against trans brake (pro) cars? One of the tracks I used race at allowed that. They said there wasn't enough cars to have both foot brake and pro, so they combined them. I quit racing there, at the time I didn't have a trans brake but do now.
You young guys better get used to change like we did or give up the sport. We went from five yellows to three yellows, 45 degree slanted bulbs to straight on, floodlight bulbs to led bulbs, regular wiring to fiber optic wiring. The sport and technology is constantly changing. Get onboard the train or get in the bike lane.
For clarification, I don’t hate boxes. I’m considering throwing one in my car for next season just to try my luck beating up on them with their own toys.
Here the foot brake guys run Sportsman class if they’re slower than 7.50 in the 1/8. I don’t think it’s fair to force mix any of the classes.
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