Bracing shock towers?

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mguner said:
Ok..... My $0.02 will probably light some girlyman's hormones on fire but WTF..... Why do I see and hear all this about flex concern when alot of you are leaving off the factory fender to firewall braces that Ma Mopar provided you from the factory? I'll still use them on my 452 Six Pack Duster with fenderwell headers and they clear what needs clearing and must do some good..... No frame machine checks or pothole stories just a few 1.80 60 ft times and lots of fun on the street.... Everybody's car is gonna be a little different depending on rust or how well the spot welds were placed from the factory and other custom mods... I think we can all agree though that just leaving naked frame rails hanging out with no subconnectors or other braces is asking for a failure of some kind.
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Agreed!
 
I've got two 75's and two 74's.... forgot that my Demon & Dart didn't have em... I'm guessing you are right about being 73 or mid year.... but guys with cars that came with them should keep them especially on fenderwell header cars.... You can see the factory braces that someone painted gold on this 75 Dart 4 speed car.

l_596c6c9fc01586f16617b9e4023997d0.jpg
 
mguner said:
I've got two 75's and two 74's.... forgot that my Demon & Dart didn't have em... I'm guessing you are right about being 73 or mid year.... but guys with cars that came with them should keep them especially on fenderwell header cars.... You can see the factory braces that someone painted gold on this 75 Dart 4 speed car.

l_596c6c9fc01586f16617b9e4023997d0.jpg
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If you take the inner completely out and leave that brace in, it doesn't do squat, except transfer the load into a flimsy fender.

If you can leave the shelf and top fender mounting area intact, they will transfer the load. Think triangles and boxes.
 
Yeah I don't like cutting any more than I have to... an old pic but intact.

l_91c191c56a803653d9974c447b9889c3.jpg
 
it probably wouldnt hurt to add those to an early a body if they would fit. i should see if the ones on my scamp would fit the wagon.
 
slantscamp said:
it probably wouldnt hurt to add those to an early a body if they would fit. i should see if the ones on my scamp would fit the wagon.
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There isn't the holes on teh firewall to bolt to. Nothing a drill can't fix.

Phil
 
doktor_x said:
Children sometimes sit on laps and read these threads with parents. Take it elsewhere.
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I agree and sometimes I have my kid on my lap looking at COOL CARS and talking about them and things.

Good call Doktor_x

I mentioned to a member you all can go call each other poop heads all night long. The last wave of madness was way over the top. While a normal dialog was being entered by everybody, his was brutal, vial and unrulely.

THE BUCK STOPS THERE!

Go back to abreivations (sp?) and kindergarden words! Gezzzzz!
 
I have a question for you all. I keep hering about factory spot welds and how week every one seams to think thay are. But I was thinking to make things stronger. Couldent you just brake out the welder and burn it better. I was just thinking this when I was looking at my factory toruqre box's on my car with a few tacks. I said "I am going to brake out the welder and burn them better". Would doing things like that help strangthine things up at all?
 
BO70, YES! Spot welds are fine for most applications and duty, however, for racing and hi powered engines, welding the whole thing up can't hurt and so long as it is done right, (Good burn through) it'll be stronger.

I did my floor pans this way (Perimeter weld on the patch pans.) and tack welded them to the frame via holes drilled into the pan like the factory, just more often.
 
i often thought about those braces on the later A,s wonder where i could geta set to try out,, may lok weird on an early A,, but any thing that is an improvemnt can be over looked
 
here's something i did, i jack the hotrod up and put it on 2 jack stands just in front on the trans x-member. i could see that the front on the car would settle an inch or so after the car had it's full weight on the stands, also when i would lift the car back up to get it off the stands the front would move up the same mount befor it would clear the stands. very interesting indeed.
 
To give you an idea about flex in unibody I have a early -a with a 360 4-speed. Drove it for 2 years and noticed the quarters geting wavey, doors hard to shut and the paint cracking at stess points. So, I bought a Mopar Chassis book pn p5249441 It helped. I had it straightend at a frame shop and added subframe connectors using 2 x 4 square tubing and boxed the front sub. I also got inspired by a buddies mustang and fabed up the compartment braces using steel conduit since going across the towers are geometricly imposible.

In the chassis book it states 3 things to stiffen the chassis.
1 subframe connectors
2 box the sill and front longitudinal
3 box the sill and rear longitudinal

But they are assuming you are leaving the original design alone.

I was going to upload picks of the bracing and cracks but can't resize the pictures to fit.:angry7:

The stiffer the chassis is the better the suspension will perform and put more power to the ground.
 
bOb shingler said:
here's something i did, i jack the hotrod up and put it on 2 jack stands just in front on the trans x-member. i could see that the front on the car would settle an inch or so after the car had it's full weight on the stands, also when i would lift the car back up to get it off the stands the front would move up the same mount befor it would clear the stands. very interesting indeed.
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i did the same wit my car except when i jacked it up my fenders gaps didnt move they stayed nice & straight. I have vid that i can upload onto youtube, then post it here for the non-belivers
 
Burntorange70 said:
I have a question for you all. I keep hering about factory spot welds and how week every one seams to think thay are. But I was thinking to make things stronger. Couldent you just brake out the welder and burn it better. I was just thinking this when I was looking at my factory toruqre box's on my car with a few tacks. I said "I am going to brake out the welder and burn them better". Would doing things like that help strangthine things up at all?
Click to expand...

the factories used spot weld for the inner fenders because the inner fenders are unnessecary. When Chrysler was building these cars they took everything into consideration, aggressive driving, hard cornering, accidents, bumps on the road, etc.. & they still just spot welded them in place because inner fenders truly do nothing for your car except "help" keep road grime and water off your engine when driving in harsh weather conditions.
 
mguner said:
Ok..... My $0.02 will probably light some girlyman's hormones on fire but WTF..... Why do I see and hear all this about flex concern when alot of you are leaving off the factory fender to firewall braces that Ma Mopar provided you from the factory? I'll still use them on my 452 Six Pack Duster with fenderwell headers and they clear what needs clearing and must do some good..... No frame machine checks or pothole stories just a few 1.80 60 ft times and lots of fun on the street.... Everybody's car is gonna be a little different depending on rust or how well the spot welds were placed from the factory and other custom mods... I think we can all agree though that just leaving naked frame rails hanging out with no subconnectors or other braces is asking for a failure of some kind.
Click to expand...

my cars 60 foot is 1.64 (so far with drag radials) & hasnt had failure of any kind
 
Just because mopars have inner fenders people just assume that the shock towers are spot welded to them, However comma many mopars came out of the factories with the shock towers not welded at all. My family has 6 a bodies & 2 b bodies. My dads dodge demon has inner fenders, is untouched all original & the shock towers AREN'T welded to the innner fenders, same way with our dart swinger.
 
Almost the ENTIRE unibody structure is spot welded together. So none of the unibody is structural or it's unnecessary by some posters rationale.

Inner fenders act as gussets for the front rails.
 
Funny, as I've cut apart plenty of Mopar sheetmetal over the years, that almost everything is spot welded. Lots of overlapping in the rocker panel area, strength built in with bends and curves. There is some stitch welded area on the floor hump as I remember... my 2 pennies
 
Just a question to satisfy my ignorance. What is the benefit from switching from torsion bars to coil-over shock set-up?
 
When it comes down to it and any frame guy will agree IT's ALL ABOUT TRIANGULATION! forgive me if I spelt that wrong lol.
 
FISHBREATH said:
Just a question to satisfy my ignorance. What is the benefit from switching from torsion bars to coil-over shock set-up?
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Gets rid of the bars which are a pain for exhaust clearance. Lots easier to fab up headers without the bars in the way.
 
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