Just went out to check the timing on my 360 (LA) and I rotated the Distributor clockwise and counterclockwise. While I was checking with the light, I didn't see a timing mark at all. After coming in the house I realized that I didn't disconnect the vacuum advance. Would the mark not show up just from not disconnecting the vacuum advance? I checked TDC and the Distributor lined up properly. Car fired right up. What do you guys think.
Dumb Timing question?
- Thread starter TF360
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Plymouth 65
I'll be in the shop
Disconnect the vacuum advance, plug the port and check your initial timing. 65
middleagecrisis
Well-Known Member
Yes
Well, technically the VA shouldn't be pulling timing at idle if it's hooked to the right port on the carb. But technically, the VA should be disconnected to check timing.
yes, that is odd. Right timing cover? Early years were on the passenger side, later was on drivers. Gotta have the right mark on the balancer to the right cover
Did the mark show on this engine prior to today?
Did you have it on #1 wire?
Has the balancer or timing cover been changed?
Do you have a dial timing light that was dialed up or is faulty?
Pull #1 plug, put it on compression stroke TDC. Is the mark on the tab where it belongs?
Did you have it on #1 wire?
Has the balancer or timing cover been changed?
Do you have a dial timing light that was dialed up or is faulty?
Pull #1 plug, put it on compression stroke TDC. Is the mark on the tab where it belongs?
middleagecrisis
Well-Known Member
As 318willrun mentioned if you have the vacuum advance line hooked up to the ported vacuum on the carburetor, it won’t advance the timing at idle. If you have it hooked up to manifold vacuum on the carb it will and your timing mark will be way off. Try timing it tomorrow with the vacuum advance line from the carburetor plugged and see if you can see the timing mark.
Get in there with a white paint stick and put a good mark on the TDC hash on the balancer so you can see it. That will help. And yes, if you are on manifold vacuum on the vacuum advance can, that can pull the timing mark out of the range of vision.
Have you timed it previously? Just for giggles, I'd buy/ get/ make a piston stop and check the accuracy of the mark. Here's the one I made IN THE SEVENTIES for my then 340. The dimension is not critical. Mine is not really adjustable. If you buy an adjustable one, examine it carefully. Many are wobbly without a locknut. You may had to buy a special nut with reduced hex size. You can get them at "real" fasteners shops
You are on the front drivers spark plug wire, correct? I know, just ask'n ....
Yea Tim, I set the timing up previously. I rotated the engine to the compression stroke, and brought the balancer up to TDC according to the balancer- set to 0- Then I dropped the Distributor in with the oil drive gear slot lined up to the front intake manifold bolt. Engine fired right up, so I thought everything was correct. I have to verify the light is working properly first, and the I'll have to back track and check the position of the piston with the balancer
hillbilly timing tape it
maybe the balancer has slipped... Could put it at TDC on compression stroke and see if you have a mark. IF not, then the balancer is suspect
And this is why, and it pays to make sure. When I had the part time job at the NAS hobby shop in the 70s, for some reason we found several Ford 352/390s came in with slipped dampeners. THAT is what originally got me into piston stops. I don't have the Ferd stop, anymore.
AN ANNOYING STORY FROM THE OLD DAYS
Back then, in the 70s, a Lt? Ltjg? Navy guy came in with a friend with a ford FE. Just a family sedan. They had "tuned it up" off base, and had nursed it into the hobby shop
The thing is sitting there spitting and chugging, and sounded aweful. New plugs, points, maybe? condenser, cap, rotor, wires.
First thing I did was check firing order. YUP. The Fords are CCW, just like a 440, and they had run the wires CW. I fixed that and it STILL sounded terrible.
So I put it on the scope. Next I find out the points were SO CLOSE, and the cam and rubbing block, so dry, like sandpaper, that the points were barely and accidently opening at ALL. Opened them up, cleaned and lubed the cam, and now it idled.
But the ADVANCE was stuck Ended up pulling the dist apart right there on the engine. Someone, at sometime, had dropped a screw down in there and screwed up the advance, churning around inslde. SO THERE WAS NO MECH advance!!!
And the punch line? THE VACUUM ADVANCE WAS LEAKY SO IT DID NOT WORK EITHER!!!
To this day, I have NO idea how they got that thing in there while running on TWO cylinders, and some others "accidently crossfiring," with the points all but closed, and NO ADVANCE of either KIND!!!
That was in the early 70's. Funny how you remember that kind of thing.
Back then, in the 70s, a Lt? Ltjg? Navy guy came in with a friend with a ford FE. Just a family sedan. They had "tuned it up" off base, and had nursed it into the hobby shop
The thing is sitting there spitting and chugging, and sounded aweful. New plugs, points, maybe? condenser, cap, rotor, wires.
First thing I did was check firing order. YUP. The Fords are CCW, just like a 440, and they had run the wires CW. I fixed that and it STILL sounded terrible.
So I put it on the scope. Next I find out the points were SO CLOSE, and the cam and rubbing block, so dry, like sandpaper, that the points were barely and accidently opening at ALL. Opened them up, cleaned and lubed the cam, and now it idled.
But the ADVANCE was stuck Ended up pulling the dist apart right there on the engine. Someone, at sometime, had dropped a screw down in there and screwed up the advance, churning around inslde. SO THERE WAS NO MECH advance!!!
And the punch line? THE VACUUM ADVANCE WAS LEAKY SO IT DID NOT WORK EITHER!!!
To this day, I have NO idea how they got that thing in there while running on TWO cylinders, and some others "accidently crossfiring," with the points all but closed, and NO ADVANCE of either KIND!!!
That was in the early 70's. Funny how you remember that kind of thing.
Mattax
Just the facts, ma'am
A golf tee is a your friend!
Yes, most factory instruction are to remove and plug the vac advance hose when setting initial. Even though there should be no vacuum advance at slow idle even with the hose connected, depending on the year and model, sometimes there is some. There are times you may be working with a car that does use vac advance at idle (eg 1963 Kaiser Jeep) but even with those, initial is usually set without vac advance connected.
Yes, most factory instruction are to remove and plug the vac advance hose when setting initial. Even though there should be no vacuum advance at slow idle even with the hose connected, depending on the year and model, sometimes there is some. There are times you may be working with a car that does use vac advance at idle (eg 1963 Kaiser Jeep) but even with those, initial is usually set without vac advance connected.
Yes, by all means use the remote starter switch to verify the timing mark. Once you have marked the hash on the balancer, bring it to TDC and see where the mark is pointing on the balancer as well as where the rotor is pointing.
Yea, I plugged it, and still didn't see a mark when using the light
Mattax
Just the facts, ma'am
RPM ?
I ask because many smog era distributers have a super quick advance above slow idle. Wouldn't take much to be more advanced than the factory marks.
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