early a traction bars

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63dartman

63dartman

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anyone know where to get traction bars for an early a? I have converted to an 8 3/4 rear so I'm mostly worried about the length. Will the ones at lakewood listed as universal 28" work?
 
63dartman said:
anyone know where to get traction bars for an early a? I have converted to an 8 3/4 rear so I'm mostly worried about the length. Will the ones at lakewood listed as universal 28" work?
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You already might have researched this, so forgive me if I'm treading on ground you have already been on - but most mopar folks use a pinion snubber instead of traction bars. The mopar leaf springs are set up so that traction bars don't work as well as they do on cars like a Chevy.

Since all A-bodies use the same size leaf-springs, my guess is that they will fit though. Most everything about the rear-end is universal with all a-body years.
 
I guess that leads to my second question, If I go with a snubber how much clearance should there be between the snubber and the place where it hits on the car. I have one in there now that came with the 8 3/4 but it has probably 3 inches of daylight and it's non-adjustable.
 
It depends on what the springs do when you dump the clutch or mash the go pedal. Getting a snubber to work as intended involves some guesswork. Better yet, video work. But it has to be alot closer than that. The reason we have the adjustable ones is so you can notch it up for racing and let it down for regular driving. Otherwise it would ride pretty rough out back over the bumps. At best, a stock snubber keeps you from damaging something if torque is high enough and/or your springs are weak enough to dive deep and invoke severe axle wrap.
 
With SS springs and the car on the ground at rest, an inch and a half worked for me for street use. I used about 1/4" clearance or less at the strip. The best pass I had with that car was 9.37 @139 and I was a little slow from 3rd to 4th. Hope this helps.
 
There's some good advice there about how to set up your snubber. If you decide to go for something more, before putting traction bars on your Mopar, have a look at the CalTrac type bars.
 
You should only be using stock leaf springs or split mono type leaf springs with a Cal-trac type traction bar.....if you are using the SS springs then a pinion snubber is the only thing needed. IIRC a manual trans requires a different air-gap than an auto trans on the snubber to floor pan clearance. SS springs and stock leaf springs with cal-tracs are two different types of suspensions and work in different ways to plant the tires.
 
I am running stock springs right now that have been refurbished by a local spring shop. They have been in business many years and do great work. From what I am reading I think I will start with the adjustable snubber and set it up according to grumpuscreature's post and start with that. Is it o.k. to run the snubber with traction bars or cal-tracs at the same time or would they be fighting each other?
 
I started the same way you are going.....stock springs with a snubber....and now I am running Cal-Tracs with the stock springs and soon the split mon-leafs. No you will not want to use the snubber with Cal-Tracs. Save your money on the slapper type bars....they do nothing on Mopars.
 
Dusterb318 said:
...SS springs and stock leaf springs with cal-tracs are two different types of suspensions and work in different ways to plant the tires.
Click to expand...

Can you explain that a little bit more?
 
Ace said:
Can you explain that a little bit more?
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I'm not getting into this discussion with you again.....I explained myself once in a thread before:
http://www.forabodiesonly.com/mopar/showthread.php?t=8130

Calvert Racing doesn't want their bars used with SS springs cause they react differently....I'm not going to argue with someone who steals a companies design and them claims to have their product......It seems you only like to argue with people on here and not offer any advice....when you car runs the same numbers as mine with your SS springs and homemade tractions bars then you can tell me how they work together. The Manufacturer doesn't want them used to gether casue eventually they will react against each other....why do you have such a problem with that.
 
Uh, Dusterb two things: 1) I didn't steal anything. My design is substantially different than Calvert's. Same basic idea, bit different execution. There's plenty of people making their own Caltracs. 2) You didn't explain anything last time, that's why I'm still asking, and you still can't answer the question.

Why? 2 reasons. 1) You don't know what you are talking about. and 2) you like to seem like it, so you keep repeating second hand stories you heard from someone.

Sorry, rumors and BS don't fly with me.
 
If you made your own bars and they are so different then why does your sig say you are running Cal-Tracs?
 
What didn't I explain......MP Performance states in their Chassis manual that the SS springs raise the rear of the vehicle to plant the rear tires and the thicker front on the springs reduces the axle wrap.....the Cal-Tracs transfer the load to the tires causing the rear to squat.....one raise the rear one squats it...opposite reactions.....they will cause problems eventually. The manufacturer doesn't want them used together....are you so much smarter than Calvert Racing? I think not....run your Mickey Mouse set-up and have fun......
 
Ace said:
Trying to change the subject, are we?
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Not at all...just wondering why you claim to have something when you don't....why should anyone believe you when you lie in your own sig? If you are so intelligent then why don't you explain to the mass audience why they work together and how each system works seperatly? Why don't you actually provide some information to people for once? Good info coming from someone who hasn't even been to the track to back up their claims:

http://www.forabodiesonly.com/mopar/member.php?&do=vehicledetails&userid=1513
 
I just e-mailed Calvert racing asking why if they can be used together and if not why.....we'll get the answer direct from the horses's mouth...hopefully that is enough of an answer for you....if not that is to bad...I am done with you on this subject and will not respond to anything you type.....I will provide info that has worked for me to anyone who asks....you have not provided on bit of proof on WHY they DO work together.
 
Dusterb318 said:
...the Cal-Tracs transfer the load to the tires causing the rear to squat.....
Click to expand...

Cite please. Publication, chapter and verse.

And I am still asking the original question, your quote: "SS springs and stock leaf springs with cal-tracs are two different types of suspensions "

How are they different and why? Leave the Caltracs comepletely out of it if you like, or leave them both in it, if you like. Apples to apples please. How is any leaf spring so different from any other leaf spring?

I could be completely wrong about this, Lord knows it wouldn't be the first time. I just cannot find anyone to explain this urban legend in any detail. So I'm out to de-bunk it.

"Raise the rear?" Sure SS springs produce a more pronounced effect in this regard, but it is the SAME effect as produced by stock leaf springs.

"Transfer the load" What load? Oh, you mean the same load that gets transferred when the leaf spring (ANY leaf spring) resists axle torque, raising the rear of the car?

Still waiting for some physics major turned gearhead to chime in here...
 
I will pull out my MP Chassis manual out and get the info they provide for SS springs.....I will at least post the page number that it is on I am not sure if I can scan it or not. SS springs cause the rear of your car to raise up, which forces the rear tires down and adds traction. The CalTracs actually let your car squat and transfer the weight to the rear for added traction. If you use them together, you'll more than likely have traction issues and not know what the problem is. Yes the SS springs and stock springs act the same......the SS springs have a different rate and the a different and stiffer front section to reduse axle wrap.....they are similar I agree. Add the Cal-Tracs and you have a whole different animal. The combination of the Cal-Tracs with the leaf springs reduces the spring wrap-up of the axle by sending the "energy" through the transfer link (diagonal bar) into the Front Pivot. The front Pivot bracket and bolt resists this turning motion and also controls the bending of the leaf spring at its thinnest section. The push into the Front Pivot helps the cars weight shift towards the rear of the car because of a new directed angle of force toward the front of the vehicle. (The "Instant Center" moves farther forward). This is where the system emulates a Four link system. The pinion angle is also maintained.
 
Well here is the answer from the horses mouth.....and I have some crow to eat:

"No, they can be used with the SS Spring, We just see better results with a mono leaf spring due to a 50lb. weight saving and better weight transfer."

Travis @ Calvert Racing

I will be the first to admit I was wrong and I apologize.......I am an *** but not a big enough one to hide......I still do have a problem with you saying you have something that you don't......
 
No apologies necessary, man. I am just always digging for the truth and sometimes I get people annoyed when I do that.

OBTW, I adjusted my sig, fair enough. Next thing you know Calvert will have his lawyer sending me a nastygram!

:thumbup:
 
I don't have a problem apologizing....and I want to provide as much accurate info as possible too.....I do see how they can react with each other when you look at cars on the track with each system.......however like you said the physics are the same.....and I apologize for anything personal I might have said (typed).
 
I saw a comment in another thread a couple weeks ago, where the poster said something to the effect that when they had SS springs and Caltracs on the car it jumped down the track like a frog or bounced like a frog or some such thing. I didn't go after it at the time, because I didn't feel like getitng into another argument. My car doesn't do that, actually seems to hook real well. I was just hoping maybe he would see this thread and chime in.
 
I really think that the more power you put the the ground and the faster you are running you will have a problem......but his might be tire pressure or shock settings......tire pressure has a lot to do with the launch.
 
Sorry to open that can of worms guys, But to tell the truth I learned alot about setting up my rear suspension from your posts. (Dusterb318 - Ace)
I saw that post about the leap frog thing too. I think that's why I asked about using both the snubber and tracs and mono verses stock springs.

Dusterb318 I have seen your posts about your time slips, VERY impressive !!and I really like the stance of your Duster.

I remember as a kid, I was probably in 1st or 2nd grade and walked to school every day in New Castle PA. I walked past a chrysler dealership and still to this day I remember checking out the cool mopars. I always loved the twister decal and the great paint on those cars......great memories
 
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