Edelbrock Air-Gap intake reviews???

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MRL? Yeah, well when someone is trying to sell me a cheap high margin product vs. a more expensive low margin product, I"m going to take every word they say with a grain of salt and find out for myself.

I bought 'em all. One was dead nuts, the other was so far off even porting couldn't fix it. The bad one was a piece of low quality aluminum made in China, and the best one was by a company that's been doing this stuff for 50+ years. I must have just gotten lucky.

All I'm doing is putting up my experience which was gained by doing actual work and putting my $$$ on the line. I'm doing this for other people's benefit, for free.

Hell with it, believe what you want and do what you want, and maybe if you ever find yourself in the midwest we'll line up your fiberglass encrusted race car against my all steel street car, and we'll find out who's right.

;)
 
LXguy said:
MRL? Yeah, well when someone is trying to sell me a cheap high margin product vs. a more expensive low margin product, I"m going to take every word they say with a grain of salt and find out for myself.

I bought 'em all. One was dead nuts, the other was so far off even porting couldn't fix it. The bad one was a piece of low quality aluminum made in China, and the best one was by a company that's been doing this stuff for 50+ years. I must have just gotten lucky.

All I'm doing is putting up my experience which was gained by doing actual work and putting my $$$ on the line. I'm doing this for other people's benefit, for free.

Hell with it, believe what you want and do what you want, and maybe if you ever find yourself in the midwest we'll line up your fiberglass encrusted race car against my all steel street car, and we'll find out who's right.

;)
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fiberglass encrusted? you have problems....I have a fiberglass hood..how many factory mopars came with factory fiberglass parts...hmmm

you speak as if your the only one that has bought all the intakes..I have also...and the crosswind lined up pretty well. either way ur opinion is yours which is why everyone should take anything on the internet unless a credited source. Which is why MRL was more credible than you...but im done once again and wont bother to try to change your mind.
 
Just a friendly invite, don't get bent out of shape.

74Burntorange said:
fiberglass encrusted? you have problems....I have a fiberglass hood..how many factory mopars came with factory fiberglass parts...hmmm
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74Burntorange said:
Fiberglass Front Bumper
Fiberglass Trunk
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I guess I got a "problem" from reading your sig. Sorry. I didn't know about the hood when I made that statement.

74Burntorange said:
you speak as if your the only one that has bought all the intakes..I have also...
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Oh, come on. :colors:
And out of the three you chose to stay with the Chinese intake? Really?

Dug up a couple of photos of my Magnum intake comparisons to the Chinese. Not the best, but you'll get the idea. Hopefully I'll dig up the other ones.

Edelbrock Magnum:

IMG_1332.jpg


Chinee:

IMG_1333.jpg


Maybe its just me, but one of these looks like something a jr high shop class put together. Check out how the ports on this intake aren't symmetrical left to right, or top to bottom. They're not even the same size. WOW. You don't often see "core shift" make one port 1/8" taller than another.

On the left hand port look how steep the ramp is. On the right, check out how far the side of the port intrudes into the air path vs. the edelbrock.
 
The bottom one is pure junk , no idea how it made it through QC
 
74Burntorange said:
fiberglass encrusted? you have problems....I have a fiberglass hood..how many factory mopars came with factory fiberglass parts...hmmm

you speak as if your the only one that has bought all the intakes..I have also...and the crosswind lined up pretty well. either way ur opinion is yours which is why everyone should take anything on the internet unless a credited source. Which is why MRL was more credible than you...but im done once again and wont bother to try to change your mind.
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Is this crosswind the intake you had on your engine when you got coolant in the oil because you needed to use the cork end seals ??????
 
EL5DEMON340 said:
Is this crosswind the intake you had on your engine when you got coolant in the oil because you needed to use the cork end seals ??????
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Back when this style of manifold was first introduced, Edelbrock ran ads in national magazines showing pictures of the then-new Air Gap. I don't remember the month for sure, but I THINK it was in the Spring. I contacted Summit, Jegs, and some other sources in an attenpt to buy one for my 5.9 Magnum, which was in the process of getting a blow-thru Vortec supercharger installed.

I had NO luck.... introduction of this manifold was delayed. I called Edelbrock on the phone and they cited casting problems for the delay, and said they were working on it and might be shipping manifolds in as little as two weeks. So, I waited. And after a month, I waited some more...

I REALLY wanted one of these manifolds! Car Craft, or maybe Hot Rod had gotten ahold of an early prototype, and tested it against some single-plane manifolds, and it was off, by only ONE horsepower in peak horsepower versus the BEST single plane, and kicked *** in the mid range.

So, by this time, the Professional Product manifolds WERE available (this was probably, October, by now) and I NEEDED a manifold, so I tried the Edelbrock option, but couldn't get one. That's how I ended up ordering the Chinese part.

I am running 10 pounds of boost, on an otherwise stock engine (except for a Hughes cam) and have had ZERO problems with this manifold.

I'll readily admit that I never checked it for core shift, or port alignment. Ten pounds of boost will cover a lot of misalignment problems.... :)

My car runs low-to mid 11's (3,300-pounds) and makes 445 RWHP, so it's kind of a fun street car.


If Edelbrock had gotten their act together a little sooner, I would have an American manifold on my car... but, they didn't.

Just thought I'd relay this story about a Professional Products manifold that has delivered a trouble-free service life, in spite of the bad press it seems to "enjoy." No water, oil, or vacuum leaks, so far.
 
LXguy said:
Just a friendly invite, don't get bent out of shape.





I guess I got a "problem" from reading your sig. Sorry. I didn't know about the hood when I made that statement.



Oh, come on. :colors:
And out of the three you chose to stay with the Chinese intake? Really?

Dug up a couple of photos of my Magnum intake comparisons to the Chinese. Not the best, but you'll get the idea. Hopefully I'll dig up the other ones.

Edelbrock Magnum:

IMG_1332.jpg


Chinee:

IMG_1333.jpg


Maybe its just me, but one of these looks like something a jr high shop class put together. Check out how the ports on this intake aren't symmetrical left to right, or top to bottom. They're not even the same size. WOW. You don't often see "core shift" make one port 1/8" taller than another.

On the left hand port look how steep the ramp is. On the right, check out how far the side of the port intrudes into the air path vs. the edelbrock.
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1. Those are wants not already have....
2. I think I said it about 15 times maybe less...that I went to the eddy magnum and that brian said it had to be ported, or didn't I?

Once again you keep it going, but ok...In your case yes the crosswind was crap..Im glad your not a scientist that does 1 test with only 3 subjects for new products to help people or else half the people would be dead or in the hospital.

You need more than one test item to call a line bad...there have been people on here that said their eddy had to be port matched because it was core shifted as well, but you and everyone still buys it.. Like I said, your intake was crap, mine wasn't and others weren't.

IF you could get 5 total crosswinds and dont even have to be all yours and show everyone that 5 were crap I would join in and say that the 5-8 guys and me were lucky that ours was not crap like yours.
 
LXguy said:
MRL? Yeah, well when someone is trying to sell me a cheap high margin product vs. a more expensive low margin product, I"m going to take every word they say with a grain of salt and find out for myself.

Your economics are backwards. Cheap is the low margin stuff. Expensive is the high margin stuff. Cheap relies on economies of scale to keep the cost low, so you have to reduce your margins and sell a ton of them. Expensive is expected to sell less volume so you have to keep your margins up.
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Thrashard340 said:
Your economics are backwards. Cheap is the low margin stuff. Expensive is the high margin stuff. Cheap relies on economies of scale to keep the cost low, so you have to reduce your margins and sell a ton of them. Expensive is expected to sell less volume so you have to keep your margins up.
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Actually in this case the reverse is true.

Wholesale pricing:
Edelbrock 7576 RPM Air Gap $237.99
Pro Products 55026 air gap (satin finish) $159.50

Of course, this is distribution pricing. The Pro Products intakes are about $30 cheaper through a couple of different import sources if you buy in bulk. The Edelbrock isn't available outside distribution unless you're buying in Summit type volume.

Summit pricing:
Edelbrock $265.95
Pro Products $243.95

Of course, you can find these Pro Products priced all over the place on Ebay, usually from people who have imported a full container of them at some crazy low price.

By the time a speed shop has to compete with Summit on tax vs. shipping to sell you, the Mopar customer, an intake, he's going to say the Pro Products is the same thing (or better) and costs a whole lot less. He'll sell it to you for the rock bottom price of $199 or $219.

You'll spend less money, he'll make more money, everybody wins, right?

Not saying this is what anyone specifically is doing, but you get the idea.

Obviously, the high price of the comparable product is supporting a capability to charge a high price for the cheap intake. Pro Products labor costs are going to be a small fraction of Edelbrock's. They are also clearly cutting corners on materials cost, and I'll bet manufacturing equipment also. I'm sure Edelbrock's ad budget is much larger, and I'll bet Pro Products doesn't actually employ any engineers..
 
74Burntorange said:
IF you could get 5 total crosswinds and dont even have to be all yours and show everyone that 5 were crap I would join in and say that the 5-8 guys and me were lucky that ours was not crap like yours.
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Well, I'm not a scientist (I don't even play one on TV), and fortunately for all of us, nobody's life is on the line.

However, my car runs pretty good for having a junkyard motor in it, and I'm not selling anything, nor do I work for either of these two companies. I'm providing this information for free. This means I have nothing to gain, but also means it's worth, well...nothing.

However:

Since I'm buying my parts at wholesale, I'm putting at least twice as much of my money on the line as a typical end user by sticking with the Edelbrock. Given the fact that the two different Edelbrock intakes were very well made, with very regular, correctly spaced port outlets and an overall high level of fit and finish (and Edelbrock actually makes parts that people use on big boy high dollar race cars) and the very inexpensive offshore intake was way off on port size and alignment and poorly finished overall, I think the predicted outcomes of buying more intakes are easy to grasp without actually placing the order.

My experience is anecdotal and your mileage may vary. Past performance does not guarantee future results, some assembly required, contents may settle during shipping, batteries not included.

Got any pics of your Pro Products intake? :)
 
LXguy said:
Well, I'm not a scientist (I don't even play one on TV), and fortunately for all of us, nobody's life is on the line.

However, my car runs pretty good for having a junkyard motor in it, and I'm not selling anything, nor do I work for either of these two companies. I'm providing this information for free. This means I have nothing to gain, but also means it's worth, well...nothing.

However:

Since I'm buying my parts at wholesale, I'm putting at least twice as much of my money on the line as a typical end user by sticking with the Edelbrock. Given the fact that the two different Edelbrock intakes were very well made, with very regular, correctly spaced port outlets and an overall high level of fit and finish (and Edelbrock actually makes parts that people use on big boy high dollar race cars) and the very inexpensive offshore intake was way off on port size and alignment and poorly finished overall, I think the predicted outcomes of buying more intakes are easy to grasp without actually placing the order.

My experience is anecdotal and your mileage may vary. Past performance does not guarantee future results, some assembly required, contents may settle during shipping, batteries not included.

Got any pics of your Pro Products intake? :)
Click to expand...

No worries.... Im sold on the Edelbrock either way....we all buy enough from China as it is...besides a product is only as good as its weakest/lowest point.....
 
LXguy said:
Well, I'm not a scientist (I don't even play one on TV), and fortunately for all of us, nobody's life is on the line.

However, my car runs pretty good for having a junkyard motor in it, and I'm not selling anything, nor do I work for either of these two companies. I'm providing this information for free. This means I have nothing to gain, but also means it's worth, well...nothing.

However:

Since I'm buying my parts at wholesale, I'm putting at least twice as much of my money on the line as a typical end user by sticking with the Edelbrock. Given the fact that the two different Edelbrock intakes were very well made, with very regular, correctly spaced port outlets and an overall high level of fit and finish (and Edelbrock actually makes parts that people use on big boy high dollar race cars) and the very inexpensive offshore intake was way off on port size and alignment and poorly finished overall, I think the predicted outcomes of buying more intakes are easy to grasp without actually placing the order.

My experience is anecdotal and your mileage may vary. Past performance does not guarantee future results, some assembly required, contents may settle during shipping, batteries not included.

Got any pics of your Pro Products intake? :)
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Actually I dont, that and I dont have a camera. And I sold it like I said and went with magnum thats being port matched. I never got to see magnum eddy either had it shipped to IMM directly for porting.
 
How many pages are we going to argue the same point for ? Lets move on please. The bickering is of no use to anyone and every time someone asks about the RPM intakes the same argument comes up.
 
Sounds good Adam...Like I said each has their own opinion. So I will say that if you have a chance to look at the crosswind before getting it and it lines up and everything, worth a shot, but if the ports suck, check the eddy out. Either way both intakes serve same purpose, but might have different result.
 
LXguy said:
Actually in this case the reverse is true.

Wholesale pricing:
Edelbrock 7576 RPM Air Gap $237.99
Pro Products 55026 air gap (satin finish) $159.50

Of course, this is distribution pricing. The Pro Products intakes are about $30 cheaper through a couple of different import sources if you buy in bulk. The Edelbrock isn't available outside distribution unless you're buying in Summit type volume.

Summit pricing:
Edelbrock $265.95
Pro Products $243.95

Of course, you can find these Pro Products priced all over the place on Ebay, usually from people who have imported a full container of them at some crazy low price.

By the time a speed shop has to compete with Summit on tax vs. shipping to sell you, the Mopar customer, an intake, he's going to say the Pro Products is the same thing (or better) and costs a whole lot less. He'll sell it to you for the rock bottom price of $199 or $219.

You'll spend less money, he'll make more money, everybody wins, right?

Not saying this is what anyone specifically is doing, but you get the idea.

Obviously, the high price of the comparable product is supporting a capability to charge a high price for the cheap intake. Pro Products labor costs are going to be a small fraction of Edelbrock's. They are also clearly cutting corners on materials cost, and I'll bet manufacturing equipment also. I'm sure Edelbrock's ad budget is much larger, and I'll bet Pro Products doesn't actually employ any engineers..
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When dealing with supply and demand economics, your looking at the market as a whole...not just a single reseller. As you mentioned, there are E-bay resellers selling lower than Summit. Which technically, makes it available to buy for you and me. The lowest cost on Ebay brand new for the Crosswinds is $179, which is $20 margin for the Crosswinds. Summit has the lowest price for the Eddy, so the margin is $28. They could choose to sell the Crosswinds at $179. However, they opt to hold margin. That's their prerogative (and their may be some obligatory factors at work), but not an accurate indicator of the market price for the Crosswinds. Shipping is a separate element. A reseller or wholesaler can pad their margins on shipping, but this isn't an accurate gauge for true margin on the item itself.
 
Thrashard340 said:
When dealing with supply and demand economics, your looking at the market as a whole...not just a single reseller.
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But that's just it, professor: I'm not dealing with supply and demand economics or the Chinese intake market as a whole, I'm dealing with specific resellers and their motivation for specific claims about the value of the Pro Products intake vs. the Edelbrock RPM Air Gap.

Bluntly: I was attempting to illustrate that the specific motives for these vendors' specific statements might be based on profit motive, rather than their stated desire to make someone more horsepower for less money.

Read the thread please.

In the interest of diplomacy, I'll agree that your initial statement

Thrashard340 said:
Cheap is the low margin stuff. Expensive is the high margin stuff.
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is generally correct when dealing with supply and demand economics in general, if you're willing to allow that one can use the words margin and markup and profit interchangeably. (However, in the specific profit Summit vs. Ebay retailer numbers you posted above, the cheaper Crosswind would be the higher margin item at 11.5% than the Edelbrock at only 10.5%, but I don't want to be pedantic- I know you meant gross profit.)

BMWs are higher profit products per unit than Kias. Better?

However, whether you meant to say markup or margin or profit, your statement is completely wrong when discussing the actual case I was talking about, never mind the motivation.

The resellers I was speaking of do not sell for the rock bottom Ebay/Internet whored out price. They make more markup and more margin and more profit selling the lower cost, cheaper intake for around $200-$220.

I'm sure we could have a (not) really interesting discussion about perfect knowledge of markets and price elasticities vs. profit/unit volume curves till the cows come home -

--but I don't really want to. So lets put our economics-weiners and tape measures away and say we were just talking past one another. Deal?

:love6:

Sorry Adam, will seek therapy about why I felt the need to respond to this (must be too hot to work on the car so I blather on the Internet). In the future my responses to threads about the Air Gap/Crosswind will be limited to:

"The search button is your friend - this has been beaten to death."
 
[QUOTE

"The search button is your friend - this has been beaten to death."[/QUOTE]

I will go with this as well
 
Dont ever recall the OP asking anything about a Chinese intake....Do you ?

No, he asked about the Ede Air-Gap. No other intake should have ever been mentioned.

So, to the Original Poster...Get the Air-Gap. It is a proven intake, and will be hard to beat, Period.

That was easy.
 
Johnny Dart said:
Dont ever recall the OP asking anything about a Chinese intake....Do you ?

No, he asked about the Ede Air-Gap. No other intake should have ever been mentioned.

So, to the Original Poster...Get the Air-Gap. It is a proven intake, and will be hard to beat, Period.

That was easy.
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Correct, he didnt ask, but mentioned it.:icon_smi:

sorry, done now.
 
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