Electrical Trouble

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67ragtop

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Been up since 2 am and I can't figure this out in my head so I figured I would ask the experts. Before I get started let it be known I hate electrical work and don't pretend to know what the hell I'm doing. Here's what I have 1967 Plymouth Barracuda with 340. Motor(car) has about 400 miles running the Ignitor kit from Pertronix(solid state ignition) as well as one of there blaster coils and mini starter. Factory engine harness all checked for continuity cleaned and greased with electrical grease. New harness on the way.
1.Put new intake manifold on and in the process of tightening up the altenator the ground wire broke loose and I drove around with it for a while until I lost all power in busy intersection. Brought car home fixed ground charged battery fired the car up and drove the car the next day.
2.Only to break down a second time. However as I was driving my guages first went out on me as I was driving. I continued down the road about 30mph gave it the gas and lost all power. Car would not even crank a little, no lights nothing. I figured I drained all the juice out of the battery running around with the ground off the altenator.
3. Had altenator tested and it was junk. So I got a new one that had a bad bearing. Still on the side of the road. Returned altenator for another new one installed it and took jumper box off battery and the car dies. Tried it again for about 15 mins. and car died again.
4. So i figured battery was totally used up and instead of paying for a tow buy a battery and not risk driving home with jumper box in engine compartment. Guage in dash shows battery charging.
5.Car ran fine for two weeks. Got to the mopar nats shut the car off after helping someone out. It was dead would not crank over at all. No lights, nothing.
6.Put brand new voltage regulator in. Jumped the car. Started her up and the guage was pegged.Then went to about 3/4. No more problems.
7.After the Nats. Noticed my wipers, blower motor etc. were staying on. Replaced ignition switch and problem solved. Drove car for week and half no problems.Guage was at half way mark not really showing a charge though.
8. Go to start the car funny noise like starter is having trouble engaging. Now motor won't crank at all. Have lights.
9.Ballast? My guage is not really showing a charge of the battery either. It stayed at the half way mark. Could I be shorting out voltage regulators? Any ideas?I have a multitester and a trouble shooting guide for the ignitor or should I be looking elsewhere?
 
Dang, sorry to hear about your string of bad luck with wiring issues!

electrical is one of them things that can run you for a loop.

Im no expert but I will try to put a few things out there for the heck of it.

has your car been repainted?,if you make sure all your ground points are not sitting on top of paint....scratch the paint off and reinstall.

check all grounds and make sure they are good.

check all the wires at the bulk head( wiggle them and see if there is any difference in your issues).

make sure under dash grounds and column ground are good.

make sure all fuses are good.

make sure the main positive and negative wires that run to the back left side ( I believe) of your gauge cluster are making good connection as these are what feed power to your entire car.

make sure your voltage reg checks out and your starter relay.

make sure you are getting good connections at your relay.

you said your car acts like it does not even want to crank now and I am assuming this you came to this conclusion by turning the key.....but you may want to try arcing the terminals at the relay with a screw driver which will send direct power to the starter and will tell you if your starter is taking a crap or your relay or the wiring from the point of the relay to the point of the starter ( if you have headers its not uncommon for a starter to take a crap from the added heat stress)......if the engine whips over with no problems like normal by arcing the relay with a screw driver than that will tell you the problem is somewhere else .

luckily older cars wiring was basic ( compared to vehicles of today that is LOL) so hopefully you can get it figured out with out to much of trouble.

by the sounds of it though you may have had a voltage spike ( or voltage drop)in your system that stressed out a bunch of different components....now its just a matter of pinpointing the problem and fixing any faulty equipment.

ALSO I believe there is a voltage regulator in the gauge cluster itself but I am not positive what all this regulates so i will let someone else chime in on that ( can't remember if it is gauge specific related or if it is tied into the rest of the electronic system )

I hope I was able to help a little and maybe give you a few ideas......sorry for the long post
 
whats the ground on the alt? you running a dual fld alt on a single fld system?

sure the amp gauge wires are tight?

put a volt meter on the battery and rear of alt and see if in fact its charging.
 
also you make sure the battery terminals are good and the wires themselves are good.

also a way I use to check if my alternator is working is if the car is running i will unhook the battery.....if the vehicle stays running than your alternator is producing current for the electrical system.....if the car dies, your alternator is junk.......this is just a basic test of course and if you want to know the exact out put the alt is producing than you will need to bust out a multi meter like was mentioned above
 
Fresh Paint seven years ago. It took me a while to get her back together. Positive and negative cables to battery are brand new. I did run an extra ground for the dash and put in a voltage limiter so that the power would shut off if I had a major problem in the harness. I will log on the web site and see what it does if there is a problem. I thought it would cut all power. As far as everything else. I will make a list and cross them off as I go. I will keep you guys posted.
 
Abodyjoe dual field single field Alt? How do I know? It does look different. My first Alt had pos and neg this alt has pos neg and then it's own ground. Did I get the wrong one. Does anyone know if I have to run a solid state voltage regulator with the ignitor system? I had a solid state and burned it up or it wasn't charging and car went dead at the nats. I put stock one in and system was charging?
 
On a dual field altenator simply take a short piece of wire and ground the second field terminal to the chassis of the altenator!

Had a simular issue with my 67 Cuda, This fixed it!!!

John D. Beckerley
Austin Texas
 
Fishthatkills said:
On a dual field altenator simply take a short piece of wire and ground the second field terminal to the chassis of the altenator!

Had a simular issue with my 67 Cuda, This fixed it!!!

John D. Beckerley
Austin Texas
Click to expand...

that full fields the alternator and makes it charge full out at 16 volts, okay for a test not so good for running all the time'

67ragtop said:
Abodyjoe dual field single field Alt? How do I know? It does look different. My first Alt had pos and neg this alt has pos neg and then it's own ground. Did I get the wrong one. Does anyone know if I have to run a solid state voltage regulator with the ignitor system? I had a solid state and burned it up or it wasn't charging and car went dead at the nats. I put stock one in and system was charging?
Click to expand...

dual field alternator's have three wires on them, the main power (big usually black wire), a blue/red wire and green wire
 
That wire was there when I bought it so I left it on. Now what? Sounds like fishthatkills says you need it and 66plyValiant says you don't. I do not have a clue?
 
if your car has the orignal alt. it would have a single field alternator only two wires to the alternator (small one and big one) if it has been changed it would have the dual field alternator which has three wires 2 small ones and one big one, in no case should you have to full field your alternator all the time unless the regulator isn't working or the wire is open between your alternator and voltage regulator. full fielding is for charging tests and to get you off the road when the regulator goes out, if its full fielded you might be overcharging your batteries and taking the life out of them
 
My original only had two wires two the alt. So I should disconnect the field terminal to the chasis of the altenator Green wire?
 
67ragtop said:
My original only had two wires two the alt. So I should disconnect the field terminal to the chasis of the altenator Green wire?
Click to expand...

yes and trace to see where the wire that is suppost to come from the voltage regulator is it should be a blue wire if I remember correctly, your voltage regulator is a square box about 2"x2" on the drivers side firewall. it should have two wires, one positive when the key is on and the field wire running to the alternator it also must have GOOD ground
 
67ragtop said:
Abodyjoe dual field single field Alt? How do I know? It does look different. My first Alt had pos and neg this alt has pos neg and then it's own ground. Did I get the wrong one. Does anyone know if I have to run a solid state voltage regulator with the ignitor system? I had a solid state and burned it up or it wasn't charging and car went dead at the nats. I put stock one in and system was charging?
Click to expand...

67ragtop said:
My original only had two wires two the alt. So I should disconnect the field terminal to the chasis of the altenator Green wire?
Click to expand...


what voltage regulator are you running.

can you get a picture of the wires and where they hook to your alt? and also of your regulator?
 
My first Alt had pos and neg this alt has pos neg and then it's own ground.
Click to expand...


ok the big thick wire is the 12v charge wire. the thinner wire is the field wire. if there is one that grounds to the alt then thats a dual field alt that your running on a single field system. shouldn't hurt anything. known guys run like that for years.
 
I got to go to doctors appt.to get my jaw put back together, It's a long story. When I get back I will post pix of everything, car not jaw. Then hopefully I can figure this out. Yes I am running a dual field but was running a single field before.
 
ahh that puts things into perspective, thought they took out the field wire going to the regulator
 
Got back late from Doc appt. didn't take any pics. Will take pics today. I am first going to jump the starter relay and then I will take some pix.
 
kursplat said:
something else to check on, when you convert to electronic ignition you need to upgrade the voltage regulator. chrysler has a specific one for single ballast resistor cars

http://www.mopartsracing.com/parts/electronic.html

P3690732 blue regulator about 3/4 of the way down the page

good luck
Click to expand...


i wouldn't use that on the street.. yea i know a bunch of people do but the constant output would worry me. especially with a stock wire harness... convert to a stock dual fld regulator and be done if you covert at all.

Constant Output Voltage Regulators

To ensure your ignition and electrical systems can provide maximum performance, install a Mopar Constant Output Voltage Regulator. Voltage is held at a constant 13.5 volts. For race applications only.
Click to expand...





.
 
I did check all my wires and everything is tight. I didn't take pics yet. I jumped the starter relay and the car fired right up. So I put a starter relay in. Wrong the car still won't start on it's own. When I jump the new starter relay she will fire right up. Is my new ignition bad?
 
Now I put the car in nuetral and she is tryin to turn over but the starter sounds funny. Then I put it in park and same thing what gives, Nuetral safety switch?
 
the neutral safety switch really only grounds the terminal on the starter relay.. it should be grounded( in P or N) or it isn't. if it isn't grounded then it won't even crank. whats funny sounding about the starter?
 
I put the starter relay in and turn the key and got nothing. So I jumped the starter relay and the car fired up. So I went back in the car and turned the key and got nothing. So I put the car in nuetral and the car was trying to start but the starter was making like a fast clicking noise. Then I put the car in park and it did the same thing. I did not wait long enough to see if the car would start either time.
 
I did have linkage rods adjusted on the tranny so the car would shift better at a transmission shop about two weeks ago. So I jacked the car up pulled the harness foor the nuetral safety switch. Checked the switch it was tight and the terminals were good. Ran a wire to bypass the NSswitch and nothing so I assumed it was not the switch. I put the harness back on. Let the car down and it fired right up.Could the harness been loose the whole time or am I grasping at straws?
 
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