helllp with cooling issue

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Damn, I read this whole thread looking for the answer to my problem.
Same type of symptoms:
Temp gauge creeps up above 200 while driving. I got an infrared thermometer for Christmas and this confirms the 200+ temp. I am concerned that next summer when the outside temp gets 90+ that it won't stay cool. I also have a 180* thermostat, installed correctly. I haven't found a shroud that fits yet, but that begs another question. The radiator fills the complete core support hole, where else is the air coming through? I can see the shroud would help at a stop sign, but not so much when you are moving...
Thanks,
C
 
Calvin, what does the Duster do when idling at a standstill? Does the temp creep up further? If so, does the temp go down at ALL when on the road? I don't remember....is that a two row radiator?
 
First thing I would do if I were you (and what I did) was give the engine block and radiator both a good backflush.
It can be done pretty efficiently at home if you have a half decent compressor (100 plus pounds) and decent CFM.
I pulled the thermostat and put the stat housing back on.
Then pulled the bottom radiator hose from the rad end.
Put a garden hose into the thermostat housing along with the air gun and wrap them both with a wet rag to get the best seal I could.
Turn the water on full blast and hit the air about every 10 - 15 seconds.
(You will need to hold the rag down around the hoses pretty tight so the air blasts the water through the block really good.
I think you would be amazed at the amount of crap that comes out the lower hose.

Using the lower hose fitting on the radiator to do the same to it.
You may want to tie the top hose pointing down somewhere to keep what comes out from going all over the engine.

If that does not help, then you only have airflow and coolant circulation to consider. (But you'll know your block is clean)

These older motors can fill with sediment over the years and cause spots in the block that get much hotter than they normally do.
Circulation won't help with that either, because the places that get hot are covered with said sediment and the coolant can't get to it like it used too.
I'm not saying that this is what it is, just that it's a good place to start so you can quickly narrow it down and find it.

Hope ya get it figured out.




clhyer said:
Damn, I read this whole thread looking for the answer to my problem.
Same type of symptoms:
Temp gauge creeps up above 200 while driving. I got an infrared thermometer for Christmas and this confirms the 200+ temp. I am concerned that next summer when the outside temp gets 90+ that it won't stay cool. I also have a 180* thermostat, installed correctly. I haven't found a shroud that fits yet, but that begs another question. The radiator fills the complete core support hole, where else is the air coming through? I can see the shroud would help at a stop sign, but not so much when you are moving...
Thanks,
C
Click to expand...
 
Rob,
When sitting at idle, temp creeps up above the 200 mark. While driving it, it also creeps up above the 200. I have not had it where it was hot, sit at a light and then drive again.
I did take it to Athens a few weeks back. Rode & drove fine, although the temp hung in right above the 200 mark.
The radiator is a 2 row.

TrailBeast,
The engine is a new long block that I purchased. I did change out the soft plugs for brass and it was clean back in there. Thanks for the suggestions.
C
 
New long block, ok.
I think it's a misread of the acual temp then.
Does it perculate after you shut it off when your temp gauge says 200?
(You know, kinda hear it rumble like it's boiling at little in the cooling system) or push coolant out of the radiator?

If not, then it is a invalid temp reading.


clhyer said:
Rob,
When sitting at idle, temp creeps up above the 200 mark. While driving it, it also creeps up above the 200. I have not had it where it was hot, sit at a light and then drive again.
I did take it to Athens a few weeks back. Rode & drove fine, although the temp hung in right above the 200 mark.
The radiator is a 2 row.

TrailBeast,
The engine is a new long block that I purchased. I did change out the soft plugs for brass and it was clean back in there. Thanks for the suggestions.
C
Click to expand...
 
Mild 318's came with an 18 inch two row radiator for decades that didn't get hot, he says his takes up the whole opening in the front clip which is about 24 inches I think.

I'd put money on a temp misread, but he has not responded to the last questions yet so we'll see.
 
Koolradiator has the aluminum 1" 2 row on sale on ebay for $124.95 plus shipping. My .30 over 318 with Comp Extreme 268 cam barely gets to first notch. It has transcooler built in too. I have had two of these and beat them for price and cooling. You can save your orignal in case you want to sell car. Joe
 
Green1 - I will try this the next time I get the car out and report back to you (might be a week or so).
72golddustermike - I have a new 2 row radiator from Advance...
Trailbeast - I do not hear it gurgling when I shut it off. I have a coolant recovery bottle hooked up, so I don't know if I would. I cannot tell if it puts any coolant into the bottle either as I am battling the various small leaks at the thermostat housing and temp. sensor. I am reluctant to call it a misreading on the gauge since that is what my i.r. thermometer also reads. By the way, it is a '72 Duster so the radiator is about 18-19" wide.
red67gts - I will be looking at that option and thanks for the tip. Are you using fan shrouds with these radiators?

Tonight (while the wife is out) I plan to test the thermostat on the stove. It should also provide a check for the i.r. thermometer. I also plan to check the thermostat housing for flatness and decide whether to try one more time with a paper gasket or go for a new housing with an O ring. I see that Summit carries one (90820) for about $45.
Keep the suggestions coming, and I'll keep reporting back!
C
 
what i am trying to say is in my 72 duster with a mild 318 bored 30 over with a 340 cam the new radiator from advance with a reprodution shroud did the same thing so went with a new on from wizard cooling. it was alot of money but worth it. if you can find a factory three row it should also do the job. thats my opinion. i tryed every thing when i had the advance radiator from watter wetter to adjusting timing and carb.by the time i bought the radiator and shroud i could got a new aluminum fro champion which alot of guys run with success.
 
The results of tonights tests. It is a 180* thermostat. According to my IR thermometer, it started to open at about 195* and was fully open at 205*. It stayed open until the water had cooled down to about 175*. As a check, the IR read 215* when the water began boiling, not a rolling boil, but bubbling to the top.
I repeated the test 3 times with the same approx. numbers each time.
I guess my question now is, should the thermostat start to open at 180, or be fully open at 180? I plan to pick up a new one tomorrow and will test it prior to installation.

As to the flatness of the housing and intake, they both checked out flat. I used a disc of self stick 180 grit sandpaper on a sheet of glass to check the housing, then stuck the paper to the housing and checked the intake. I think I will get the O ring housing and hope it works.
C
 
It needs two things. More air flow and more radiator. Period. End of story.
 
Is the radiator new? I bet you scavenged it from the cop car, didn't you? I bet it's stopped up like a toilet at a butt doctor's office. Plus, the heatin up at idle Means it's not moving enough air...but if the radiator is stopped up bad enough, correcting that might solve both problems.
 
LOL, no Rob. The radiator in the cop car was leaking and was much too large to fit the Duster. It is a new 2 row I got at Advance...
C
 
clhyer said:
LOL, no Rob. The radiator in the cop car was leaking and was much too large to fit the Duster. It is a new 2 row I got at Advance...
C
Click to expand...

Well either the thermostat is making more of an issue than I would think or that radiator ain't enough. Since it's running hot at idle, I suspect the fan ain't doin it either.
 
clhyer said:
As a check, the IR read 215* when the water began boiling, not a rolling boil, but bubbling to the top.
C
Click to expand...

I am surprised the IR thermometer is that accurate. Were you aiming it at the thermostat or the water? I would think it might not read correctly pointed at clear water. I have a cheap one from Harbor Freight, but haven't tried it yet. Some people imagine they must be accurate because digital, but I know how they work. Cheap ones traditionally just measure the intensity of emitted IR light, which varies both with surface temperature and the emissivity. They are most accurate measuring a flat black surface. Maybe even the cheap ones today use the 2 color method or laser reflection to compensate for emissivity.
 
What size rad? that seems small. Local shop can do a 3 row. Therm sounds bad. It should keep temp between 175 and 185. Period. Radiator.
 
the radiator I have from Koolradiator from ebay is the American Eagle AE2374 and it is on sale as inventory reduction for $125.95 now. It keeps my .30 over 318 with 9.2 cr at the first notch without a shroud and with air conditioning. Hope this helps,Joe
 
BillG - the IR I have is a cheapo from Harbor Freight. I was surprised that it was fairly accurate also. I was aiming at the thermostat itself, and also the bottom of the can I was heating it in (top of water).
green1 - the radiator was a stock replacement 22" wide x 19" tall.
Joe - I looked at these radiators on ebay. I just sold a few parts and have a few bucks at paypal now so I may very well bite the bullet and buy a new one. I do want to try a new thermostat first though - and check with a local radiator shop for a three row as green1 suggested.
Thanks everyone:cheers:
I will post results as changes are made.
C
 
I run a 195 thermostat and the ONLY time it shows that warm on the guages is idling around in traffic.
With a 26 inch two row and a 17 inch electric puller fan in the summer and in Phoenix AZ it gets to 210 at low speeds in traffic and the fan comes on to bring it down to 190.
Thermostats are not that cut and dried, as my normal driving temp is around 175-180 and like I said I had a new 195 stat in that I replaced to be sure it was doing what the guages said it was.
 
We just built a 440. 3 row rad. 160 therm. It opened at 155, closed at 170. Too cold for hp. Installed a 180; 175, 185. The radiator has to be clean. Distilled water and anti freeze.
 
If everything in the cooling system checks out, carb is probably running to lean. Often overlooked. Lean engines build heat.
 
Have you flushed the engine really well? Is the radiator good and completely cleaned out? I see you have a new radiator What kind of fan do you have? Clutch fan is the best period.
Do you have a fan shroud these are very important.
I presume you are running the correct 50/50 coolant mix ratio?
Pure coolant cools pretty crappy, although it has a high boiling point.

If you are running a new radiator, good clutch fan with shroud 50 /50 coolant and still having problems, remove the thermostat and test it. If it still over heats then..

I would bet the engine has scale build up in the block.

What does it do w/o a thermostat? If it still overheats with no thermostat (and you can see plenty of coolant circulation at idle) then there is a layer of scale made of calcium, rust and minerals deposited creating an insulating film completely ruining your chances of heat exchange. All the heat extraction in the block relies on bare metal contacting the coolant. If the water passages are silted up, or coated with a thin layer of scale your cooling system will be very inefficient. It is not about over doing the flow or over doing the radiator, it is about making your system efficient.

Several repeated treatments of off the shelf high strength radiator engine flush (with a complete system drain by pulling the bottom radiator hose between each treatment) will help this issue considerably if your fan, pump and radiator are good condition.

.
"turns out brother had rewired gauges and gauge was grounding somwhere rewired all good now"

Oh, right. :)
I was going to suggest cross drilling the rotors next anyway.. :)
 
Cal, let us know how the new American Eagle works for you. Hope it does runs as cool as mine. I don't know if I mentioned but I am running a 7 blade straight fan, no clutch. I use a 1" spacer and have 1 1/2" clearance between fan and radiator. Hope this helps,Joe
 
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