ignition problems hard starting

Discussion in 'Electrical and Ignition' started by ike61, Sep 11, 2018.

  1. ike61

    ike61 Well-Known Member

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    Hello all here's what I have: friends 66 fury with butchered wiring. I wired in a factory electronic ignition and dual field alternator with electronic voltage regulator. Initially the car started ran good. I shut it off and re-started it several times. It seemed to crank a little much before starting than I'm used to though. two days later nothing. I got it started a few times since but obviously something isn't right. I did a few tests.
    Ok here’s what I have. 12.6volts battery
    2)Coil + 7.73volts key on
    3)Coil + 10.0volts cranking
    4)Ballast key on 11.6volts wire from ecu, blue/white tracer to bulk head, blue wire to voltage regulator on same side.
    5)Ballast key on 7.8volts brown wire to bulkhead, blue wire to + coil
    Does it appear I hooked everything up right? I also found out its not charging.
    checked several grounds yesterday and cleaned them up. didn't help.
    any help would be apprecieted
     
  2. TrailBeast

    TrailBeast Slightly Twisted Member

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    Do you have an "Ign 2" wire, and does it bypass the ballast resistor when cranking?
    You are supposed to have about 12v at the coil when cranking, then it drops back to about 8 volts at the coil when in the run position of the key.

    If you have 8 volts via the ballast when cranking, this may very well be the problem as your coil voltage will drop less than that 8 volts with the starter cranking.

    You could even verify that this is the problem by running a wire from the battery positive to the coil positive and try starting it.
    If it fires right off jumpered you know you have a low voltage problem at the coil.

    Don't leave the jumper on longer than it takes to test this, as it can overheat the coil from the constant 12v.

    On the no charging problem look up or Google search "Full field testing a Dodge dual field alternator"
    Since it's already all over the internet I don't see a need to type it all again for the 1,000,000.00 time.:D
     
    Last edited: Sep 11, 2018
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    • ike61

      ike61 Well-Known Member

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      Ok thanks. I did run a jumper wire from battery to positive and it fired right up. I'm not too smart when it comes to wiring so I didn't know what would cause this. What's an Ign 2 wire?
       
    • Mattax

      Mattax Just the facts, ma'am FABO Gold Member

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      The ignition circuit for 'start' position is slightly different than for 'run.'
      When the the switch is on 'start' power goes to the 2nd Ignition wire - usually brown.
      When the key is released and the switch is on 'Run' power goes to the main Ignition wire - usually some blue.

      Circuits will look something like this
      Circuits will be the same although details will be a different since this is a 67 Barrcuda and you're working on a '66 Fury.
      Notice the ignition and the power to the alternator's field circuit come from the same Blue Run wire.

      Charging-diagram67B-ALTr3.PNG
       
    • Mattax

      Mattax Just the facts, ma'am FABO Gold Member

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      On the original alternator, one field terminal was grounded.
      The 'two field' alternator and regulator differ as follows.
      The blue wire still goes to the regulator - but only for the regulator to monitor system voltage.
      It directly supplies power for the field -
      Whether or not power flows through the field is controlled by the green wire whch completes the circuit to ground through the regulator.

      A circuit with two isolated field terminals looks something like this.

      Main_charging_wires_plus.png
      For trouble shooting, I concur with TB's advice. But you might want t o make you're own circuit digram since you've modified the harness. It will help you see what a test means, and might make it more obvious what's wrong.
       
      Last edited: Sep 11, 2018
    • TrailBeast

      TrailBeast Slightly Twisted Member

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      Mattax has your back on it with the diagrams.
      Notice how in the ignition diagram Ign2 does not go through the ballast resistor, and Ignition does.

      Ignition 2 gives the coil full 12v when cranking and the other goes through the ballast and drops the coil voltage to your 7.8 volt reading after it starts.
       
    • ike61

      ike61 Well-Known Member

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      Howdy all. Call me crazy but I think I got it figured out. I went from a five pin ecu to a four pin and it fired right up several times, which it never did before. Now I can focus on my charging issue. Thanks to all who helped out!