Jeep 4.0 in 69 Barracuda

JohnFM3

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Update:
I spoke to the Jeep shop who is building my fuel management harness and ecu. He has convinced me to skip the YJ Wrangler fuel management in favor for early TJ Wrangler (97-99) fuel management. There are performance improvements in going this route including the addition of it being ODB2.

In his opinion, running a dual exhaust setup on a 4.0 sounds bad. He urged me to consider single outlet header (OEM) to a 2.25 head pipe into Cat Converter. 2.5in pipe between header and muffler. Single in Dual out muffler with dual 2in tail pipes. Going this route with the early TJ fuel management will require me to have two O2 sensors. 1 up-stream at the start of the head pipe where it meets the header and 1 down stream (after Cat Converter).

He does not need the car, only pictures including tape measure to provide measurements of engine bay for what he needs to build. He is now sourcing out the parts to get me running.

More to come ~ Thanks,
John
 

65 Dartman

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Looks like they taking a cue from Chrysler. On the early A exhaust high performance exhaust, I’ve read that the Commando/Charger 273 benefited more from a well designed large diameter single exhaust than a smaller diameter dual exhaust. From the crossover back it’s something like 2 1/4 or maybe it’s 2 1/2 ID on the headpipe, muffler, over-the-axle pipe and resonator.
 

JohnFM3

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Looks like they taking a cue from Chrysler. On the early A exhaust high performance exhaust, I’ve read that the Commando/Charger 273 benefited more from a well designed large diameter single exhaust than a smaller diameter dual exhaust. From the crossover back it’s something like 2 1/4 or maybe it’s 2 1/2 ID on the headpipe, muffler, over-the-axle pipe and resonator.

This may be so. A large diam single exhaust is great for trucks. Muscle Cars and Dual Exhaust go together like Ben & Jerry's goes to Ice Cream.
 

Road/Rage

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So last month I bought a 69 barracuda fastback from a guy on here. I am totally stoked on it and looking at engine swaps. In the end, I plan on a 265 Hemi inline 6, which will be based on the Jeep 4.0L fuel injection. I was going to throw a slant 6 in to get it running, but then last weekend I came across a screaming deal on 2 Cherokee's that I will be buying.

Both 4.0Ls, 1 4wd and 1 2wd. While I would consider a 69 awd barracuda would be totally bad, I don't have the financing to even consider that kind of project. But a fuel injected jeep 4.0L with the 2wd AW4 tranny and matching Chry 8.25 with 3.55 gears would make for a fun car. And the fuel injection harness and ecu would be in place for when I swap over to a 265.

So now I am looking to see if anyone has considered this to pick their brain and consider gotchya's in this kind of conversion.

I am also looking to see if I can run a CJ 258 belly pan which if I recall has the oil pick up in the rear and not the middle. With this, I may be able to just cut off the engine mount points on the slant six K frame and build for jeep engine. I know K Frame changes are needed. There are no options for me to purchase, I may have to build it myself. I do have the V8 K-Frame in the car now, and the prior owner sold me a slant 6 K-Frame as well.

This will not be the official build thread, I am just doing some brain storming and asking around. I will post a link to a official build thread when I start later this year. I still have a YJ (wrangler) to swap the engine in first... :D

Jeep engine in a cuda? Blasphemy!!!!
:confederateflag::elmer:
 

RustyRatRod

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This may be so. A large diam single exhaust is great for trucks. Muscle Cars and Dual Exhaust go together like Ben & Jerry's goes to Ice Cream.
But a GOOD single exhaust and inline engine go together better than that. I'd let the guy do it. Sounds like he knows what he's doin.
 

JohnFM3

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But a GOOD single exhaust and inline engine go together better than that. I'd let the guy do it. Sounds like he knows what he's doin.

We came to a compromise. I really wanted a full dual system from the header back with a X pipe. The decision was made to keep the more common single outlet header. We are keeping the stock head pipe size of 2.25. Going into a Flowmaster 2.5in Cat Convert and then keep 2.5in into the muffler. We will then try a Flowmaster 40 Series 2.5in Single IN/2.25 Dual OUT Muffler . I will probably go dual 2 inch out the back.

He says I am going to hate the sound. I have heard dual exhaust in line 6 cyl, and think when done right they sound good. If it sounds as bad as he says it will, removing the muffler in favor of a single In/single Out will be easy. And only a small financial hit as compared to a full exhaust replacement including header.

If I do go single, I have thought about dumping the exhaust pipe straight down after the axle before running it out the back.
 

RustyRatRod

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Flowmaster sucks. Now I know he knows what he's talkin about.
 

JohnFM3

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Flowmaster sucks. Now I know he knows what he's talkin about.

Please elaborate. The person who is helping me is not against the Flowmaster brand. He believes I have made some good choices as to the exhaust parts.

Flowmaster Sucks??? This sounds like a opening of Flames. Almost as bad as opinions of pizza toppings.
 

RustyRatRod

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Please elaborate. The person who is helping me is not against the Flowmaster brand. He believes I have made some good choices as to the exhaust parts.

Flowmaster Sucks??? This sounds like a opening of Flames. Almost as bad as opinions of pizza toppings.
I cannot stand the Flowmaster sound. They're just way too loud and obnoxious. There are a LOT better flowing and sounding mufflers on the market nowadays. But it's yours man. Fix it like you want to.
 

JohnFM3

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I cannot stand the Flowmaster sound. They're just way too loud and obnoxious. There are a LOT better flowing and sounding mufflers on the market nowadays. But it's yours man. Fix it like you want to.

My 72 duster had a 2.5in 30 series Flowmaster on a built up slant six. Both of my Jeeps have 2.5in flowmaster 30 series. I am a flowmaster loyalist. The only things in my driveway not running flowmaster is my VW's.

And I love the sound. As long as its not too big to create a raspy exhaust sound.
 

RustyRatRod

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My 72 duster had a 2.5in 30 series Flowmaster on a built up slant six. Both of my Jeeps have 2.5in flowmaster 30 series. I am a flowmaster loyalist. The only things in my driveway not running flowmaster is my VW's.

And I love the sound. As long as its not too big to create a raspy exhaust sound.
Well knock it out, dude. Keep us posted.
 

65 Dartman

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He says I am going to hate the sound. I have heard dual exhaust in line 6 cyl, and think when done right they sound good. .

Way back in the 80’s I had a set of Clifford long tube headers and Clifford 4 barrel in my 65 Dart GT with a 225. The exhaust was full length with a pair of turbo mufflers on each side with turn downs out the back. Sitting there idling it sounded just like a V8. Driving normally it wasn’t V8 sound or stock 6 cyl sound. For my 65 V8 wagon I thought about dual exhaust but choose the Charger 273 single exhaust (commonly call the Commando exhaust) with resonator. With the complete exhaust no need to get an exhaust shop involved since i can install it right here at the house
 

JohnFM3

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Way back in the 80’s I had a set of Clifford long tube headers and Clifford 4 barrel in my 65 Dart GT with a 225.

My Super Six I built for my duster was with the stock SS 2bbl inake and manifold with a Holley 500 2bbl chokeless carb. And it sounded great. Like you, a v8 start and idle. And at cruise more of a V6 sound. Not too throaty, but enough to let the car next to you know you were there.

My buddy had the Clifford system you spoke of on his CJ5, Only he ran the webber 32/36 (I think) carb and the single tube header. That was a clean sounding setup.
 
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JohnFM3

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Ok everyone. We are on a holding pattern for a while, and I have been doing some research on the next item out side of my skill set.

I have a stripped hood nut plate. 1 of the 4 is not usable. This maybe a situation where its better to replace than repair. There are those who believe there is not enough metal to drill and tap for 7/16. And of course those who do. I have not seen any instructions for cutting the plate out and replacing it with new. WildCats can get me a replacement for $400 if I pick up.

Is this the time to move to fiber glass? Is there a good fiberglass company people recommend?

John
 

JohnFM3

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This hood looks like mine. I believe its from a 1968. When I bought the car, I asked the seller if he had a 68 nose as I liked the light bezels on 67 an 68 over the 69. Unsure if the hood had to be replaced. But this looks like mine.

barracudahood.jpg
 

RustyRatRod

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My Super Six I built for my duster was with the stock SS 2bbl inake and manifold with a Holley 500 2bbl chokeless carb. And it sounded great. Like you, a v8 start and idle. And at cruise more of a V6 sound. Not too throaty, but enough to let the car next to you know you were there.

My buddy had the Clifford system you spoke of on his CJ5, Only he ran the webber 32/36 (I think) carb and the single tube header. That was a clean sounding setup.
Have you ever heard Vixen's slant 6? Single, 2.5" TTI exhaust. Stock exhaust manifold ported and opened up to a 2.5" outlet.
 

JohnFM3

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That has a very different sound. It sounds nice, but not what I would want. Its almost too straight pipe sounding. Or cherry bombs. I wish I would have grabbed sounds of my duster with the built slant six. I was moving some real power on that. And it sounded great.

Meanwhile, I have some sound samples from youtube for comparison...

Slant Six flowmaster single outlet


Slant Six flowmaster dual outlet (I really like how this sounds)


Jeep Cherokee 4.0L flowmaster single outlet


Thats not my jeep, but that is what mine sounds like. Has a nice aggressive sound with out going raspy. And it is clean through out the throttle. That is what the barracuda will sound like.
 

JohnFM3

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The problem here is we are discussing personal taste. And I like the flowmaster sound. More so on the 4.0L. Always will.
 

JohnFM3

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I had found a CFM chart on exhaust sizes. And as I recall a 2.5 in exhaust pipe has a 510ish cfm rate. 2in pipe has around 300cfm. So I am hoping the dual 2in pipes on a 2.5in single exhaust system will flow nicely and still sound good. Worst case, I cut it out and go full single. But I am willing to gamble. I found a youtube video of a cherokee with dual exhaust flowmaster, it sounds good to me. I think I will be happy with it.
 

65 Dartman

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I may need u joints and intermediate shaft to mate my 65 PS box to the 80 J body steering column I will be using
 

JohnFM3

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I may need u joints and intermediate shaft to mate my 65 PS box to the 80 J body steering column I will be using

The change to the mid 70's powersteering box required me to buy this U-Joint and a column shaft from HDK to work.

Now I will have powersteering.
 

JohnFM3

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With parts needed for other work to be completed I have jumped into some body prep. As I can not afford to pay a body shop to work on the issues of my barracuda, I am going to target as much as I can on my own. This will be in large part the body dings. I am going to be plasti dipping the car. The products from Dip Your Car are really on the level of peel-able auto paint now.

In prep for spraying, I am pulling all the black off to the green oem color as much as possible. I thought the car was rattle can black primer and paint. As I hit it with 500 grit, I found it was some form of black paint and grey primer. What these pictures dont show is how much of the black paint is flaking off exposing the oem green which is why I believed it was rattle can.

All the black left behind is where a ding or a crease is. On the front fender, you can see where the square marker has been covered over.


20220602_175014.jpg


20220602_180936.jpg


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And of course I need a picture including my little helper.
20220602_190135.jpg


For those who have not seen this, Plasti Dipping has come along way from its beginning. With Color shifting and Pearls to High Gloss. A test was done where DYC took a bare body panel, sprayed it and left it for 1 year. When the plasti was pealed back, the bare metal was still clean of rust. Also look at the cars I touch, they are not honda civics. Higher end cars with paint 1 would really care about.

I have 3 colors I am considering (In order of consideration), below are youtube videos from the company...
(Short videos [5 - 7 min] where reveal is about half way thru video)

1) Wicked Wine


2) Persian Blue


3) Frozen Blue


And for those who are interested, here is a 6min video of the pealing process. Much like vinyl wrapping only with no glue to clean up.
 
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