Match Race ~ 1965 Valiant '273 Commando' vs. 1963 Fairlane 500 '289 K-Code'

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Ford C30-AF #4100 Autolite Carburetor {600 CFM}

1 9/16" Primary x 1 9/16" Secondary

Actually, a decent functional Carburetor for the 1963 1/2 'K-Code'.


C3OF-AJ_11.jpg
 
69 Cuda 440 said:
69 Cuda 440 said:
GIB

1965 NHRA 1965...... Weight to Horsepower.....Mopar A-Body cars

A/S....... 8.70 to 9.49

B/S....... 9.50 to 10.59

C/S....... 10.60 to 11.29

D/S....... 11.30 to 11.88 ....> 1965 Valiant V-200 {273/235 HP}

E/S....... 11.89 to 12.49.....> 1965 Valiant V-200 '4-Door' {273/235 HP} ~ Valiant Signet {273/235}
.........................................> 1965 Dart GT {273/235 HP}

F/S....... 12.50 to 13.99 ....> 1965 Barracuda {273 /235 HP} ~ 1965 Dart GT 'Convertible' {273/235 HP}

G/S....... 14.00 to 14.99

H/S....... 15.00 to 15.59 ....> 1964 and 1965 Valiant 'Hardtop' {273/180 HP}

I/S........ 15.60 to 16.99 ....> 1964 and 1965 Barracuda, Valiant 'Convertible', Valiant Signet {273/180 HP}
..........................................> 1965 Dart GT {273/180 HP}

Here you go for 1965

Plymouth Trivia Question.....

How many 1965 Valiant 'V-200' 4-Door, 273/235 Commando 4-Speeds were built...........
Click to expand...

Come to think of it- I didn't get the car until spring of '66. Maybe NHRA switched classes in 1966- or maybe the track I ran at (Mason Dixon in Hagerstown, MD) was a NASCAR track then.
If my memory is correct ( not very often) the guy who was my class regularly was a late 1950's Corvette with 2 4s and all tricked out track car- I didn't even have slicks-
Click to expand...
 
Small bore is not "theoretical"! Simple question: can you put W2 heads on a 273?
 
Gib,

NASCAR did use a slightly different Stock Class weight-to-horsepower bracket than the NHRA.

Other 1965 Mopars that were classed in NHRA 1965.

B/S........... 1965 Plymouth Belvedere and Satellite {426/365 HP}
B/S........... 1965 Dodge Coronet {426/365 HP}

C/S.......... 1965 Plymouth Belvedere and Satellite {383/325 HP}
C/S.......... 1965 Dodge Coronet {383/325 HP}
 
That big block Nova comin up in the rear view is gonna smoke um both.
 
That ain't a manual choke.

69 Cuda 440 said:
Ford C30-AF #4100 Autolite Carburetor {600 CFM}

1 9/16" Primary x 1 9/16" Secondary

Actually, a decent functional Carburetor for the 'K-Code'. Manual Choke.


C3OF-AJ_11.jpg
Click to expand...
 
RustyRatRod said:
That big block Nova comin up in the rear view is gonna smoke um both.
Click to expand...

Big Block Nova in 1965 ???,,,,,,,,,,,,,Maybe on the Planet 'Super Nova', but not on Earth.

My Error, the 1963 1/2 'K-Code' {C30-AF} #4100 Autolite Carburetor was equipped an Automatic Choke.

As well was the early 1964 289/271 HP 'K-Code' cars.
 
Jarlaxle said:
Small bore is not "theoretical"! Simple question: can you put W2 heads on a 273?
Click to expand...

With enough money you can do anything. I have put 1.88 J heads on a 273, and they worked more than Fine. Have you done anything with a 273? I also have actually built a 289 K motor for my brothers 65 Mustang. So I know what both are capable of. Neither was actually "stock" as in this case... It is the only non Mopar engine I still have.
 
Jarlaxle said:
Small bore is not "theoretical"! Simple question: can you put W2 heads on a 273?
Click to expand...

You can. It's a simple matter of a little fly cut on the top corner of the cylinder walls to allow the 2.02 valves to clear. I did it and put in some 13.5:1 pistons, which were available back in the day, to regain some compression from the huge head volume. There is no low end whatsoever with the W2s on that small bore. It is fun after 4000 RPM though!!
 
D-Man,

The 1963 1/2 'K-Code' 289/271 HP Engines had the small valves.

Intake.... 1.677"
Exhaust.. 1.457"

In February 1964, they increased the Intake Valve size to {1.77"}

The 'K-Code' Camshaft {Solid Lifter} is listed at;
Lift........... .480"
Duration.... 310*
Overlap...... 82*

Valve Springs...... #177 lbs. {Valve Open}

Compression........ 10.5-1 {Advertised} But the Flat-Top Piston is closer to 11.2-1
Deck Height......... -.0015"

Combustion Chamber... 47.40 CC's

The Cast Iron Low-Rise Dual-Plane Intake is the same as the 289/225 HP 'A-Code'.

Misconception > The 'K-Code' came thru with an Offenhauser Aluminum High-Rise Dual-Plane Intake and Holley Carburetor.
 
Gib Warnick said:
69 Cuda 440 said:
Come to think of it- I didn't get the car until spring of '66. Maybe NHRA switched classes in 1966- or maybe the track I ran at (Mason Dixon in Hagerstown, MD) was a NASCAR track then.
If my memory is correct ( not very often) the guy who was my class regularly was a late 1950's Corvette with 2 4s and all tricked out track car- I didn't even have slicks-
Click to expand...

Got a confirmation that Mason Dixon was a NASCAR track then- maybe the reason for being classed an F/stocker
Click to expand...
 
Gib,

In 1966, they bumped up the classes one notch in NASCAR Drag Racing.

So 'E/S' in 1965 was now 'F/S' in 1966.

NASCAR Drag Racing in 1966

D/S...... 9.80 to 10.49 Wt/Hp
E/S..... 10.50 to 11.19 Wt/Hp
F/S..... 11.20 to 11.89 Wt/Hp

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NHRA in 1966

D/S....... 10.60 to 11.29 Wt/Hp
E/S....... 11.20 to 11.88 Wt/Hp
F/S....... 11.89 to 12.49 Wt/Hp
 
grimreaper said:
You can. It's a simple matter of a little fly cut on the top corner of the cylinder walls to allow the 2.02 valves to clear. I did it and put in some 13.5:1 pistons, which were available back in the day, to regain some compression from the huge head volume. There is no low end whatsoever with the W2s on that small bore. It is fun after 4000 RPM though!!
Click to expand...

It really does not matter as, we are talking about Stock Class cars with the 273 having a 1.78 in intake valve at .42 lift. No intake valve shrouding whatsoever.

On a side note, how fast could you do the quarter with that setup?
 
Honest Injun,

Back in 1969,

One our 1967 Barracuda's 273/235 HP 4-Speed was running in K/Stock, and
putting down 13.85's @ 100 MPH like 'clockwork'.

We decided to try a set of 340 X-Heads {2.02" Intake and 1.60" Exhaust} on the
273 {bored. +.040} Engine, with a 'stock lift' General Kinetics {Blueprinted Camshaft}

We notched the Block Deck to provide for proper clearance, but we did 'not' mill
the Heads to get down to 57.3 CC.

We pulled 13.70's @ 102 MPH.

A Net Gain of.......... 15/100's and 2.0 MPH

All that work of 'grinding' the Block for Valve Reliefs, the cost of the Cylinder Heads and Valves.

We thought we'd gain close to 5/10's {half-a-second} due to just better flow and bigger valves alone.

All that work for so little gain..............
 
I do not have the 1/4 mile times and speeds that you do. The best combination in my 64 273 .040 over L2222 pistons, 4 speed Barracuda was 1.88 intake J heads. 340 stock cam springs and lifters, stock 71 340 intake and carb. The heads were milled .040 on block side and .038 intake side. Chambers cc'd, Gasket matched and bowl ported. Unbelievable power and mpg. No holdin her back. Too wild for the street, would not recommend.
 
66fs said:
I do not have the 1/4 mile times and speeds that you do. The best combination in my 64 273 .040 over L2222 pistons, 4 speed Barracuda was 1.88 intake J heads. 340 stock cam springs and lifters, stock 71 340 intake and carb. The heads were milled .040 on block side and .038 intake side. Chambers cc'd, Gasket matched and bowl ported. Unbelievable power and mpg. No holdin her back. Too wild for the street, would not recommend.
Click to expand...

In our experience.

273's..... 'Love Compression'

The 340-X Cylinder Heads were just too big for the 273. Very little gain.

On the Bottom-End, we dropped off the table. But on Top-End there was a
good power gain.
 
Old-Time Racer,

When the 1963 1/2 Ford Fairlane 500 {289/271} Hi-Po 'K-Codes' first came out in
mid-1963,

They were supposed to be the terror in C/Stock {10.60 to 11.29 Wt/Hp}.

They were a 4-Speed only car, and Ford only built 200 or so. It was called a
'Gun-Slinger', because it was a small #3000 lb. big-powered car with a high-revving 289,
and they came from the factory 'near' ready-to-go at the Drag Strip.

271 Horsepower @ 6000 RPM's

From the factory with 3.89 Gears, they were capable of 15.80's, but were advertised
as being able to put down 14.00's @ 100 MPH by just adding Headers, 7" Slicks and Gears.

When they first came out, the Fairly Fast Fairlane 500's were no match at the Drag Strip when
facing the 'C/Stock Terror', the 1960 Pontiac Catalina 389/348 HP 'Tri-Power'.

NHRA Classes
1963......... C/S
1964......... C/S
1965......... C/S
1966......... D/S
1967......... C/S
1968......... G/S
1969......... H/S
1970......... I/S
1971......... I/S
 
Johnny Valiant {1965 Production Numbers}

------------------------------------- Total ---- 273 Commando .... w/'Formula S' Package

* Valiant V-100 2-Door................ 42,857 ........... 1456
* Valiant V-100 4-Door................ 40,434 ............. 255
* Valiant V-100 'Station Wagon'.... 10,822 ............. N/A

* Valiant V-200 2-Door................... 8919 ............. 914
* Valiant V-200 4-Door.................41,642 ............. 605
* Valiant V-200 'Convertible'........... 2769 ............. 209
* Valiant V-200 'Station Wagon'...... 6133 .............. N/A

* Valiant 'Signet'......................... 10,999 ............ 1388
* Valliant 'Signet' 'Convertible'......... 2578 ............. 303

* Barracuda............................... 64,596 ............. 7027 .................... 3035
 
66fs said:
With enough money you can do anything. I have put 1.88 J heads on a 273, and they worked more than Fine. Have you done anything with a 273? I also have actually built a 289 K motor for my brothers 65 Mustang. So I know what both are capable of. Neither was actually "stock" as in this case... It is the only non Mopar engine I still have.
Click to expand...

Of course not! Why would I waste my time and money with a 273, when I can spend much LESS to make MORE power with a 360!
 
Jarlaxle said:
Of course not! Why would I waste my time and money with a 273, when I can spend much LESS to make MORE power with a 360!
Click to expand...

You do realize that we are talking about a "Stock Class" race back in the day??? This is not the Racing forum on how to make 600 HP from a small block Mopar.
 
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