More T5 Swap Information

RustyRatRod

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I've been talking back and forth with David and Bryce Gill from Gill Welding over the past few months. Lemmie tall yall, these guys are a HUGE asset to the Mopar community. I originally got one of their T5 bellhousing adapters. After checking the fit, I noticed that it utilized two bolt holes from one dedicated transmission pattern and two from another. It would have worked fine, but I really wanted one that would work with Vixen's original bellhousing. After talking it over with David, he told me to just send the first plate back. This is the new one they made. It has ALL THREE transmission bolt patterns on it. I have it pictured first, on the same style bellhousing that's in Vixen now, the early A body slant 6 bellhousing. Then it is on a slant 6 over drive bellhousing. Notice on that one, how all three patterns are lined up. Lastly, I have it on my dedicated big block three speed bellhousing. So this means it will fit on three speed and four speed bellhousings. WHY is all this important? I'll tell you why. Because now, you can use your original z-bar, clutch linkage AND clutch fork TOTALLY UNCHANGED and TOTALLY UNMODIFIED. There will be no custom work whatsoever, except to use the Hemi throwout bearing and to have the front bearing retainer turned down so that the throwout bearing fits. Nuthin to it. ....and of course "whatever" floor mods you need to do for your application. I will be starting this conversion soon and posting it here in the forum for you to follow along and see how bad I screw it up.

I cannot say enough good about these fellas and they are Mopar guys to boot! So if yall need any type of custom fabrication done, call them. I'm sure they can make adapters to suit other transmissions as well.
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Dave999

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Nice!!!
So much easier when you have the correct bits
I didn't
mine is a Moderndrivlein piece.
I had an aussie 3 speed Hemi 6 bellhousing bored to fit the IBR centered ring on its face. I had to get a ford plate that didn't involve boreing into the clutch fork mount.
that negated getting a plate that had enough meat for all the holes to mount the bell housing to it
so i had to drill it to fit the plate to the bell,and drill and tap 2 new holes in the bell because the plate doesn't cover all of the bellhousing bolt holes.

what a mess..... i'll know next time

anyway kinda worked.

But i too have the joy of standard fork

PS how ya like my funky austlian GM/Holdens BTR tailhousing.... :) sits the stick a bit back from mustang and has the flat and sensible not the canted over mounting of the camaro. Ford shifter box as well. hole for speedo in the other side
they also do one where the shift box overhangs the rear...

if its too hard to fit i have a chevy s10 tailhousing to go on and a swan neck stick

its not in yet
box is awaiting input shaft shims and ive just fitted rear countergear support

Dave

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RustyRatRod

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Nice!!!
So much easier when you have the correct bits
I didn't
mine is a Moderndrivlein piece.
I had an aussie 3 speed Hemi 6 bellhousing bored to fit the IBR centered ring on its face. I had to get a ford plate that didn't involve boreing into the clutch fork mount.
that negated getting a plate that had enough meat for all the holes to mount the bell housing to it
so i had to drill it to fit the plate to the bell,and drill and tap 2 new holes in the bell because the plate doesn't cover all of the bellhousing bolt holes.

what a mess..... i'll know next time

anyway kinda worked.

But i too have the joy of standard fork

PS how ya like my funky austlian GM/Holdens BTR tailhousing.... :) sits the stick a bit back from mustang and has the flat and sensible not the canted over mounting of the camaro. Ford shifter box as well. hole for speedo in the other side
they also do one where the shift box overhangs the rear...

if its too hard to fit i have a chevy s10 tailhousing to go on and a swan neck stick

its not in yet
box is awaiting input shaft shims and ive just fitted rear countergear support

Dave

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That's badass man! It all came together though! Nice!
 

Dave999

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got a throw out bearing off a jeep...fits the IBR but no idea yet if it fits the fork, thats still on the car and it school prom season so no dismatling at the mo... best to avoid upset daughter...

may end up doing some horrible custom job on the original.... just have to see.. but in other news there is a nice LONG yoke used on some fords which i got.... so it looks like i can use that and avoid having to get custom tail shaft/tail . its splined along its full tube, think as long as i have the same amount of spline width passed the output shaft/tailhousing bush/bearing, into the trans, as there is bearing width. i'll be ok, that should be 2.5 to 3 inches full spline engagement... and you can get a small dodge to ford UJ no probs.. so hopefully a win there..... if used full in it would more or less fill the housing and might hit speedo gears so some care needed

Dave
 

RustyRatRod

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got a throw out bearing off a jeep...fits the IBR but no idea yet if it fits the fork, thats still on the car and it school prom season so no dismatling at the mo... best to avoid upset daughter...

may end up doing some horrible custom job on the original.... just have to see.. but in other news there is a nice LONG yoke used on some fords which i got.... so it looks like i can use that and avoid having to get custom tail shaft/tail . its splined along its full tube, think as long as i have the same amount of spline width passed the output shaft/tailhousing bush/bearing, into the trans, as there is bearing width. i'll be ok, that should be 2.5 to 3 inches full spline engagement... and you can get a small dodge to ford UJ no probs.. so hopefully a win there..... if used full in it would more or less fill the housing and might hit speedo gears so some care needed

Dave
I used a Hemi throwout bearing and had a friend slightly turn down the front bearing retainer to fit. That way, I get to use the stock clutch fork and change nothing from the bellhousing forward.
 

Johnny71dusty

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I've been talking back and forth with David and Bryce Gill from Gill Welding over the past few months. Lemmie tall yall, these guys are a HUGE asset to the Mopar community. I originally got one of their T5 bellhousing adapters. After checking the fit, I noticed that it utilized two bolt holes from one dedicated transmission pattern and two from another. It would have worked fine, but I really wanted one that would work with Vixen's original bellhousing. After talking it over with David, he told me to just send the first plate back. This is the new one they made. It has ALL THREE transmission bolt patterns on it. I have it pictured first, on the same style bellhousing that's in Vixen now, the early A body slant 6 bellhousing. Then it is on a slant 6 over drive bellhousing. Notice on that one, how all three patterns are lined up. Lastly, I have it on my dedicated big block three speed bellhousing. So this means it will fit on three speed and four speed bellhousings. WHY is all this important? I'll tell you why. Because now, you can use your original z-bar, clutch linkage AND clutch fork TOTALLY UNCHANGED and TOTALLY UNMODIFIED. There will be no custom work whatsoever, except to use the Hemi throwout bearing and to have the front bearing retainer turned down so that the throwout bearing fits. Nuthin to it. ....and of course "whatever" floor mods you need to do for your application. I will be starting this conversion soon and posting it here in the forum for you to follow along and see how bad I screw it up.

I cannot say enough good about these fellas and they are Mopar guys to boot! So if yall need any type of custom fabrication done, call them. I'm sure they can make adapters to suit other transmissions as well.
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I got this kit , wondering about what clutch and fly wheel is needed to get it to work with a slant
 

YY1

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Might be a silly question...but what makes up for the thickness of the adapter plate?
 

RustyRatRod

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Glad this came back to the top. I was able to locate an NOS CA1525 pressure plate which allows you to put a 10" clutch disc on the stock 122 tooth slant six flywheel. I also got a McLeod 10" clutch disc with the proper 1.062 diameter 10 spline input shaft for the T5. Baby steps, but gettin there.
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Johnny71dusty

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Glad this came back to the top. I was able to locate an NOS CA1525 pressure plate which allows you to put a 10" clutch disc on the stock 122 tooth slant six flywheel. I also got a McLeod 10" clutch disc with the proper 1.062 diameter 10 spline input shaft for the T5. Baby steps, but gettin there.
View attachment 1715981746 View attachment 1715981747
So is this a Ford pressure plate and clutch ? Or no ? What did this come off off I googled it and nothing comes up
 

Johnny71dusty

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NOS CA1525 pressure plate which allows you to put a 10"


this a Ford part ? From what ? I'm googling it and nothing comes up
 

RustyRatRod

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NOS CA1525 pressure plate which allows you to put a 10"


this a Ford part ? From what ? I'm googling it and nothing comes up
I don't know what else you want. I've given you the part number for the pressure plate. Part number for the clutch disc is McLeod #260136. I didn't look up application for the pressure plate. I looked simply by slant 6 10" pressure plate and it popped up. There's also a diaphragm style pressure plate, but the Borg and Beck style is more heavy duty.
 

Dave999

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Might be a silly question...but what makes up for the thickness of the adapter plate?

well you are already up against the fact that the input shaft is too short to engage with the spigot bush in the crank. which means you need a solution for that. and that solution is part of your answer

and if you use a late mustang box like me (longest ford t5 input) its too long to use the roller bearing set up used on a dodge dakota with 318 with no adapter in place. so to basiclaly get the trans adapted to the bell and the corrct position for support you need to work out adpater thickness

And mustang t5i nput is a .608 spigot end on shaft, not .750 like mopar

so i lined it all up, made sure the bell was bolted to the block. laid the lot on its side, so i could look from the bottom, and slid the trans forward until the forward end of the spline on the input shaft aligned with the friction suface of the flywheel. My view was it didn't really need to go any further.... i might be wrong...!

at that point i worked out that the tip of the input would now engage pretty well right into a dakota roller bearing, bashed into the converter register, a position which is the thickness of the flywheel mounting flange + flange offset and a smidge back from the start of the old spigot bush in the crank. So then I measured the gap between the face of the trans and the back of the bell. worked out about 12mm..
so my adpater is 12mm thick.
with hinsight 13 might have been better currently the cone shape at the back end of the input shaft spline COULD interfere with the lip of the drawn cup roller. will just push it further into its holder is need be.

i could do this because i have 2 engines under the bench, i would have been stuck with a car in bits otherwise

I then took out the input shaft. Took it to an engineering shop and got the spigot end sleeved to 0.750, in a material suitable for use in a drawn cup needle roller

and now i can use the dakota roller in its poistion further back, to support the input shaft, and bolt the lot together.

My method could be flawed but in lieu of anything or anyone giving me any other clues it made sense at the time.

i guess i'll find out when i get off my backside and start work again...teenage kids and new (old) house getting in the way.

my chosen late 1999 to 2004 mustang trans is the strogest OEM standard t5 (not Z spec) BUT it has no speedo drive and an akward reverse and 5th gear brake to deal with
it currently has a rear stick world class australian BTR housing on it.

i don't want to cut the car up, so i have 2 tail shaft housings, the other is chevy S10 with a front stick position. BUT its not world class...but it is manual speedo and chevy shifter box size
none World class tail housings won't fit without machining due to the extra stuff on 5th gear on the WC ford T5

so i will try it as above with the rear stick
or use a chevy s10 housing with the front stick and make a new 2 inch by 3 inch hole in tunnel.. (easy to weld up in future)

can't use the ford housing it is mid/rear stick and aligns with torison bar cross member and has electronic speedo

how to fit an early s10 mechanical speedo housing to the mustang world class trans is here in my post on The HAMB. got pictures and everything. buy a kit off ebay for speedo drive gears and bullet adaptor for this one..differs from ford version

Technical - T5 Transmission S10 Tail/extension

too many words.. sorry, but hope it helps

Dave
 
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Dave999

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10 inch friction plate with 10 spline t5 centre was hard for me to find un the UK, but a 10 inch clutch in general should not be a problem... clutch place can swap the splined part and build you a custom job...if need be. My current is a 10 inch Exedy off a 90s holden with a mopar spline in the middle.
i have a muscle bound left leg the thing was designed for hydrulic operation... and boy oh boy a bit of traffic and you can tell, you get cramp in places you never knew you could get cramp in :)

mine much like some slants was a 9.5 inch clutch orgnally
but i went custom steel vented flywheel years ago.. didn't fancy crazed and cracked cast iron visiting my feet...unlikely but once you think it might, it pursuades you to spend too much money

it all had to come from Oz so did it once ad did it right.. flyhweel ring gear and clutch

but you don't have to, a heavy slant clutch with a custom plate would do... just need that 10 spline centre in the plate. if it starts to slip in 5th well...least you tried

Dave
 
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