My First Engine Build - 360 Help

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DNasty777

DNasty777

Perpetually In Pieces
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Ok guys and gals, I got my first engine to build the other day. It's an '86 360 with 943 heads. It came with an Eddy 1406 600cfm carb and performer 318/360 intake. I disassembled the motor over that last 3 days to get it ready for the machine shop. I'm thinking its going to need to be bored out as it has a lip at the top of the cylinder. Pictures of what I'm working with can be seen in my ongoing project thread here: http://www.forabodiesonly.com/mopar/showthread.php?t=290650&page=2

With that said, I'm looking to build a healthy street engine. I'd like to get it set up so that I can expand on it in the future. Once rebuilt I'll run it with the stock heads, eddy carb, and intake that I have right now and when I get tired with that I'd like to be able to do head work and get an RPM airgap. Right now I'm looking for advice on what pistons and cam I should run. I've been searching this forum since before I got the motor and it seems a lot of people run KB107 or the Speed-pro 116cp pistons and something along the lines of an XE268 cam. Would these be a good choice for me?

This is my first build and I'm really needing some direction here, any more info that I can give just ask and I will do my best to give answers. I'd like to at least have a plan and idea of what I'm going to spend on parts before I go to the machine shop empty headed. Thanks all for the help.
 
Get the Speed Pro pistons No special ring gap requirements. One less thing to worry about. For what you're talking about, I would find a modern version of the 340 cam. Maybe one of the smaller VooDoo grinds. Lunati has it all over Comp, IM. The 268 is good, but there's better to be had.
 
I also have an 86 360 block. I've done pretty much the same thing in which I sunk all my money this last winter into the machine work and the bottom end. I use the stock heads. For $1400 i bought a complete bottom end kit from Jegs. It was the scat stroker kit with scat cast crank, scat I-beams, icon forged flat tops with total seal rings and king bearings. I am extremely happy with the result and this has left lots of room for improvement with the top end.
 
Thanks Rusty! I appreciate the expertise. I'll check out those lunati cams.

J par, I really like the idea of the stroker but it might be out of my price range. I'll probably save that for my next build.
 
I lean toward KB107's myself, I don't quite get the ring gap issue people have with them; you're checking ring gap anyways and adjusting to spec, so the top ring just has a larger spec, pay attention to the details.

If you can afford it, have the rotating assembly internally balanced, it will pay dividends down the line, dampers, flex plates, converters, flywheels become simple, just go buy what you want with out the worry of "what else do I need to make this work?"

How healthy is healthy? The Comp XE274H looks good to me.

Good luck!
 
[ame="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wb13N9USp8I"]'68 Dart Holeshot - YouTube[/ame]


This is the lunati 256/262 Rusty was talking about. I yanked it out of my 360 for a xe268. Had lots of low end grunt.
 
RustyRatRod said:
Get the Speed Pro pistons No special ring gap requirements. One less thing to worry about. For what you're talking about, I would find a modern version of the 340 cam. Maybe one of the smaller VooDoo grinds. Lunati has it all over Comp, IM. The 268 is good, but there's better to be had.
Click to expand...

Those Speed Pro hypers,take some serious abuse. No problem there... Take your time,ask lots of questions. One thing,I will add: Lost a really nice LA build,due to a sheared oil pump /intermediate shaft. I highly recommend the Mopar Performance P3690715 heavy duty replacement. Normally stock new ones don't have problems, save yourself a headache,spend the extra 30 bucks...
 
DNasty777 said:
J par, I really like the idea of the stroker but it might be out of my price range. I'll probably save that for my next build.
Click to expand...
I understand the whole price range thing, I think my whole car is out of my price range! Lol I did look at doing pistons and rings and bearings and then it was a little more to have the rods resized and refit and a little more to have the crank turned. By the time I added up the work for the rods it was just a little more for the brand new scat rods, by the time I had to crank turned, it was a little more for the new 4 inch crank.
I guess what I'm saying is the bottom line for me was by the time I bought new pistons, new rings, new main bearings, new rod bearings, and maybe some ARP bolts for the rods it was like $450 more to just buy the whole complete stroker kit. At that point I had a solid foundation to go any direction I wanted to and still do. I still try to save money here and save money there and almost every time it comes back to bite me that I didn't spend a little more and do it right the first time. Today I'm about to go out and take that stock harmonic balancer that almost flew off at the last races and replace it with an aftermarket one. And when I get that off I'm going to take the transmission back out and take that stock heavy duty clutch out and buy a heavy duty aftermarket race 1. All stuff that should have been done in the first place that I spent money on and now I'm spending money again. No I'm not saying you should go out and get a stroker I'm just telling you how it went for me and that's what I believe the forms all about hearing people's stories and what works for them and what didn't.
Please don't forget that I heard you say budget! That damn budget!
 
j par said:
I understand the whole price range thing, I think my whole car is out of my price range! Lol I did look at doing pistons and rings and bearings and then it was a little more to have the rods resized and refit and a little more to have the crank turned. By the time I added up the work for the rods it was just a little more for the brand new scat rods, by the time I had to crank turned, it was a little more for the new 4 inch crank.
I guess what I'm saying is the bottom line for me was by the time I bought new pistons, new rings, new main bearings, new rod bearings, and maybe some ARP bolts for the rods it was like $450 more to just buy the whole complete stroker kit. At that point I had a solid foundation to go any direction I wanted to and still do. I still try to save money here and save money there and almost every time it comes back to bite me that I didn't spend a little more and do it right the first time. Today I'm about to go out and take that stock harmonic balancer that almost flew off at the last races and replace it with an aftermarket one. And when I get that off I'm going to take the transmission back out and take that stock heavy duty clutch out and buy a heavy duty aftermarket race 1. All stuff that should have been done in the first place that I spent money on and now I'm spending money again. No I'm not saying you should go out and get a stroker I'm just telling you how it went for me and that's what I believe the forms all about hearing people's stories and what works for them and what didn't.
Please don't forget that I heard you say budget! That damn budget!
Click to expand...

I agree j par, I'll have to see how much the shop wants to charge me for all the machine work. I'll likely have to have the same stuff done. If it's really close, I might just go with the stroker.

Thanks for the heads up bomber, I won't cheap out on the pump.
 
Not the pump, but the intermediate shaft.

Well, don't cheap out on the pump either.
 
Point taken mirage, I'll definitely be getting the MP intermediate shaft and pump. I'll be bringing everything to the machine shop tomorrow, I'll let everyone know what they say.
 
I knew there was a reason I like KB107's..........per the catalog info, the SpeedPro H116cp weigh in at 582 grams vrs 524 grams for the 107's, pin weight is 154 grams SpeedPro vrs 132 KB......this works out to be in the neighborhood of 1.4 lbs difference. The added weight then comes into play during balancing; though with eather piston I still recommend internal balance. The KB's sit between .005 to .015 higher in the hole, a plus to you for building compression.

The idea for a stroker crank is nice but I don't see where "for a few dollars more" the stroker crankshaft becomes price competitive. My local crank grinder gets $175.00 to do a 10/10 cut; unless it's a fire sale deal (buyer beware) you'll spend over $100.00 more for a crank. On top of this DOES the current crank need to be turned? If it doesn't, that's money saved in the budget for other work/needs. As for the connecting rods, have the big ends checked for size, if they spec out good don't spend any more money on them, no need to. So there is more budget money saved for where it's needed.

As others have stated, the HD intermediate shaft is a very good idea, I personally would not use a HV oil pump, don't see the need. If you really want one, pm me I have a new one for sale.

You still haven't defined how "Healthy" you wish your build to be.
 
Ok, I dropped the everything off at the machine shop and talked to the guy there. The block will be hot tanked, pressure checked, rough bored .03X over, decked, and align honed. He is going to stop there so I can decide which direction to go.

JBurch, the crank does need to be turned, I don't think I'm lucky enough to make out with the rods either. Price wise I'll end up paying close to only $400 more for a stroker kit.

J Par, you where exactly right, now I need to decide if I want to reuse the stock rods and crank, paying to have the machine work done to them, or just go with a stroker kit. Do you by chance know what your stock heads cc'd at?
 
I guess I may as well have that done too, after the hot tank and pressure test.
 
DNasty777 said:
I guess I may as well have that done too, after the hot tank and pressure test.
Click to expand...

Well, it would be nice to know your block doesn't have any hidden cracks, and to be sure it will take the bore safely, before sinking money into it and finding something later.
 
I agree, I don't want to spend all this money on machining to only find out I can't use it.
 
ir3333 said:
you need a performance target....and then you can build for it
Click to expand...

Sorry, I know, I'm not making it easy to help me. I'll try and lay it out a little more clearly. My budget for the bottom end is about $2k including machine work. I'll go a little over budget getting a 408 stroker kit, but its so close in price to just staying stock +.030 that I'm seriously considering it now. The only problem with this is that I'm going to have to wait to do up my stock heads or buy fancy alum ones, so I know I'm going to take a big hit in the HP and it'd be unreasonable to ask for 400HP. Once I save up money for headwork I'd Like to see 400HP, though and that's my end goal.
 
O.K. lots of good advise here. I would like to add: use ARP rod and main bolts and check EVERYTHING. Use premium bearings, check EVERYTHING. You can always upgrade heads/intake later on. Good luck and have fun
 
I see you said that they are going to line hone the block but are they going to deck and square it before they bore it?

Ted
 
DusTed74 said:
I see you said that they are going to line hone the block but are they going to deck and square it before they bore it?

Ted
Click to expand...

Yes, I believe that is the order he said he would do it in. I'll double check with him though and recommend that if he wasn't.
 
408 cubes with 1.88 valves should see 400 HP
depending on cam, carb and intake
 
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