Dustert73
Stripping bolts since ‘10
I used a total of 4, camber and caster for both sides.
offset bushings
- Thread starter dan5354
- Start date
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I used a total of 4, camber and caster for both sides.
Dustert73
Stripping bolts since ‘10
It's a pain but I would.
Dustert73
Stripping bolts since ‘10
I'd have to find the chart, pretty sure it's a thread on this forum. From what I remember there's specs on it for granny setting, typical street performance setting, drag race setting etc.
Im going to look into how that works! but I wont be pulling my uppers back off!!
On our cars, you install all four to help raise caster. Install the bushings so that they shift the upper ball joint to the rear of the car. That is, with the front bushing's hole closer to the car's frame and the rear bushing's hole farther from the cars frame. Essentially, you are lengthening the front segment of the upper control arm and shortening the rear segment.
ok I understand that, but that sounds like it could potentially give you a mile of more caster, and with one bushing opposite the other would cancel any change in camber. Im way over thinking this I know1
Consider this. 4 offset bushings installed opposite of each other would give you positive or negative caster depending on how installed but would cancel any change in camber. 4 offset bushings installed the same would give you positive or negative camber, depending on how installed, but would cancel any change in caster. Looks like you potentially have 4 options for installation depending on the effect your after
Yes you are.
:cheers:I think im opening a front end shop!
I already know that. I did alignment work over 20 years.
Install the bushings as I outlined. You will never need as much caster as they will be capable of. So, this means the camber change will NOT be cancelled out. Since you will not be adjusting as much caster as possible, there will be added camber from the bushings.
Stop thinking and trust someone who has done and done and done it.
BillGrissom
Well-Known Member
Several good posts on the offset bushings. Their original intent is to repair a pushed-in upper frame from a side collision. To improve caster, do not install them per package directions, follow the photos in posts here. I used just one on each UCA (cheap), as the aft bushing. I don't particularly like them because there is little rubber on one side, so seems like a future problem.
You want to move the upper ball joint aft. Imagine a line between the centers of the ball joints and project it down to the road. If the tire's "contact patch" is behind that point, you have positive caster, which is good. The tires then want to follow, like a shopping cart wheels. Negative caster is like a bad shopping cart. Another way to get more caster is to pull the lower ball joint forward, by using a shorter strut rod. The only one I know is an adjustable strut rod. Some posts here.
I disagree that one can't set toe-in very accurately with a tape measure. Try it and you will find that even a small turn on the adjusters is very apparent on the tape measure. You also see the effect by sighting along the front tires w/ a straight edge at the rears. I doubt shops with an expensive laser machine turn your adjusters finer than a 30 deg turn. That setting won't hold forever anyway. Toe-in changes greatly as the ride height changes, etc, so most important is to check and adjust it regularly, by whatever method. If you can afford yearly alignment shop work, go for it. Incorrect toe-in is the main thing that affects wandering and tire wear.
You want to move the upper ball joint aft. Imagine a line between the centers of the ball joints and project it down to the road. If the tire's "contact patch" is behind that point, you have positive caster, which is good. The tires then want to follow, like a shopping cart wheels. Negative caster is like a bad shopping cart. Another way to get more caster is to pull the lower ball joint forward, by using a shorter strut rod. The only one I know is an adjustable strut rod. Some posts here.
I disagree that one can't set toe-in very accurately with a tape measure. Try it and you will find that even a small turn on the adjusters is very apparent on the tape measure. You also see the effect by sighting along the front tires w/ a straight edge at the rears. I doubt shops with an expensive laser machine turn your adjusters finer than a 30 deg turn. That setting won't hold forever anyway. Toe-in changes greatly as the ride height changes, etc, so most important is to check and adjust it regularly, by whatever method. If you can afford yearly alignment shop work, go for it. Incorrect toe-in is the main thing that affects wandering and tire wear.
AJ/FormS
68 Formua-S fastback clone 367/A833/GVod/3.55s
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What Rusty said.
-To Rusty; I guess you got a few hours on me,then. I only did front-end work for 5.5 years.
-To Bill; You can set the toe, with a tape, if you scribe the tires first. Just try and find accurate reference points on modern tires. Or you can use some sharp-edged thing leaned up against the tires. Problem is you cant really get up high enough to be accurate. Unless maybe you have a 4X4.You can however use this method for relative adjustments. Ie; add/ subtract some arbitrary number to the current number. But why bother?With all the jacking up, dropping down, trying to settle the suspension, rolling back, rolling it ahead, do it over, etc. IDK.PITA. Get it roughed in , take it to the shop.
-Having said all that; There have been times where nothing I would do for a customer,would cure a toe-related wander.I knew it had to be toe.So I marked the tierod sleeves, picked a side and cranked in some toe. Went for a ride.Stopped. cranked in a tad more, and so on til it steered right. Back to the garage I went. Jacked er up,observed the toe-change, split the difference, and reset both sleeves. Then back onto the rack to record the actual toe-spec, and made the notation in the customer history file, for future reference.Happy customer, happy boss,free advertising. Well not free but good PR. Now in another thread on this business, someone chewed me out over doing adjustments on the side of the highway.I do what I gotta do. Or rather did. Im semi-retired now.And FWIW, here in southern Mb. the highways just aint that busy. Sometimes you can drive 10 miles, in the middle of the afternoon, and not encounter another vehicle.
-So Bill, I know youre a good guy, and very knowledgeble, and I dont mean to aggravate you, but IMHO, Im sticking to my guns on that tape statement.
-To Rusty; I guess you got a few hours on me,then. I only did front-end work for 5.5 years.
-To Bill; You can set the toe, with a tape, if you scribe the tires first. Just try and find accurate reference points on modern tires. Or you can use some sharp-edged thing leaned up against the tires. Problem is you cant really get up high enough to be accurate. Unless maybe you have a 4X4.You can however use this method for relative adjustments. Ie; add/ subtract some arbitrary number to the current number. But why bother?With all the jacking up, dropping down, trying to settle the suspension, rolling back, rolling it ahead, do it over, etc. IDK.PITA. Get it roughed in , take it to the shop.
-Having said all that; There have been times where nothing I would do for a customer,would cure a toe-related wander.I knew it had to be toe.So I marked the tierod sleeves, picked a side and cranked in some toe. Went for a ride.Stopped. cranked in a tad more, and so on til it steered right. Back to the garage I went. Jacked er up,observed the toe-change, split the difference, and reset both sleeves. Then back onto the rack to record the actual toe-spec, and made the notation in the customer history file, for future reference.Happy customer, happy boss,free advertising. Well not free but good PR. Now in another thread on this business, someone chewed me out over doing adjustments on the side of the highway.I do what I gotta do. Or rather did. Im semi-retired now.And FWIW, here in southern Mb. the highways just aint that busy. Sometimes you can drive 10 miles, in the middle of the afternoon, and not encounter another vehicle.
-So Bill, I know youre a good guy, and very knowledgeble, and I dont mean to aggravate you, but IMHO, Im sticking to my guns on that tape statement.
Ah, makes sense, I got you now.
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