You dont need to jack it up. Just watch the wheel when you start it to see if it kicks to the left.
Still pulling to left after alignment
- Thread starter standup303
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Yup. The SAI is always nice to display. You can identify a bent spindle or other front end part pretty quickly.
It's robbery if not measured. I didnt see set back either. No extra labor other than programing the computer. They should be default measurements.
Old school aligners made you hang the suspension to measure SAI. New machines, not so much. Hell these new machines you don't even have to jack the car up to measure wheel runout compensation. A true alignment should include a good "shake down" of steering components. It seems this may have been over looked in the OP's alignment.
A badly worn idler arm will cause a left pull. Especially when you hit the brakes.
You'd think. People owe it to themselves to learn some basics to this stuff if they are going to trust someone else to do it.
standup303
Well-Known Member
There was no mention of a shakedown. And this shop was tough to find every other shop said their machine won’t work on the car because of the rear wheels tucked under the quarters.
Can you describe the condition a little better? Acceleration? Braking. The steering wheel "kicking" check should be done in the center of the box. How many turns from lock to lock compared to the steering wheel being centered.
That sounds ridiculous. Even manual machines from the 40s and 50s will do that.
Well ya, that's the problem. When is the last time you seed a modern car with tucked rear wheels. We had extension adapters. I'm so out of the loop that I need to bow out now.
We all had adapters at the alignment shop I worked at last in 1999. It's just not that difficult.
99? I thought I was out of the loop.
That's why I use a lot of maybes and possiblys and "all that".
standup303
Well-Known Member
I’ll have to check rotations from lock to lock tomorrow and report back. There is definitely a shake when braking, but more throughout the entire car versus just the steering wheel like when you need rotors turned. If I and cruising accelerating or braking and let go of the steering wheel, the car will take and immediate left. Not gradual at all.
Oh ya, bad idler arm will definitely shake when braking.
harrisonm
Well-Known Member
Years ago, I bought new Goodyear tires for my 98 Dakota truck. After a short while, it started pulling hard to the left. First thing I thought of was a tire problem. It had NEVER pulled before. The tire shop tried really hard to sell me all new ball joints, tie rod ends, etc. I had just done that about a year ago. I insisted the manager go for a drive around the block to see how hard it was pulling. Then we got back to the shop and I insisted they swap the front tires and that the manager go around the block again. Wow, now it pulled hard to the right. They appologized and gave me two new tires. I am no tire expert, but I guess that a separated belt in the tire can do that. it will increase the rolling resistance.
Swapping tyres should be first on the list.....different brands or differing amounts of wear up front will always be a problem.
The slightest wear or looseness in any of the front-end components can cause problems.
I can also confirm that (not in this case) not having sufficient grease in King Pins, or Tie-rod ends & Ball Joints for that matter will make a significant difference to front end handling.
The slightest wear or looseness in any of the front-end components can cause problems.
I can also confirm that (not in this case) not having sufficient grease in King Pins, or Tie-rod ends & Ball Joints for that matter will make a significant difference to front end handling.
Lonewolf3165
Living the Dream!
The latest machines don’t clamp onto the edge of the rims anymore but instead use hooks that hold onto the tire on the tread and then you attach them @ 9-3 then roll the car forward to do the compensation. Problem is if the wheels tuck into the wheel wells the clamp hooks will hit the body.
Google the Hunter Hawk Eye system and you’ll see what it looks like.
Ewwwww. You know what my favorite machine was and STILL IS? The Hunter A111. So simple and very accurate as long as it's calibrated. Guys used to tell me "it's not accurate because the wind blows the strings".......well close the door, dummy. lol
Lonewolf3165
Living the Dream!
Yeah. Haha! If I recall correctly the strings were pretty taught when they were attached between the heads on those machines so unless they were doing alignments in gale force winds they wouldn’t be moving too much.
Modern machines just use targets & infrared or lasers, they only do compensation with a roll-out method, they have to be mounted vertically then rolled so far & held, then back to vertical. The clamping fixtures hit the quarters. The old ones got jacked up by the body, & got a 2 or 3-point compensation spinning the wheel 360°, but once done You could position the wheel & clamp fore&aft so You were clear of the wheel lip. But even those with a tight Sure-Grip, You had to be sure to place both fixtures so they'd be horizontal together.
Conicity, it's a mfg. defect where the casing is shorter on one side, either during ply arrangement or during molding/curing, it's not uncommon. Put a cone on the floor & roll it, You get it.....but there are variations in rolling resistance also, the only truly great piece of shop equipment We had at the dealer I worked at was a Hunter Hammerhead balancer. It balanced, spoke-split weights, did road-force/runout, and measured rolling resistance. It was the bomb.
67Dart273
Well-Known Member
The question, really, in my mind, is "do you really need laser accuracy" in a ? 30-60 ? year old vehicle that still can be aligned with old school methods. You need a device for accuratly measuring tilt in/ out of the spindle, and with something to indicate degrees of turn, you can then measure camber and calculate caster. Toe is easy. Ride height is easy. There are several of ways to measuring the "square" of the "body chassis" and thrust angle. I lined my 67 up with old tech (decades old Ammco caster / camber ga.) and used the same technique on the Cummins/ Dodge 2500 2wd---4wd conversion.
1WildRT
Well-Known Member
As previously mentioned..... First, Engine off, watch the steering wheel while starting the engine.... It should not move... If it does that's the first thing that needs to be corrected...
Second, jack up the car and try to spin the wheels, if one has significantly more drag than the other that's a sure sign of a brake issue.. If that's not the case good, but your not done, have someone step on the brake pedal & release it, then try spinning the wheels... The brakes should release fully as soon as the pedal is released...
Third, as mentioned swap the tires & see if the pull follows the tires...
Your caster being .6 is a little strong if it's being used to compensate for road crown, but not so strong it would cause a significant "pull" it would cause what I would describe as a "Drift"
Second, jack up the car and try to spin the wheels, if one has significantly more drag than the other that's a sure sign of a brake issue.. If that's not the case good, but your not done, have someone step on the brake pedal & release it, then try spinning the wheels... The brakes should release fully as soon as the pedal is released...
Third, as mentioned swap the tires & see if the pull follows the tires...
Your caster being .6 is a little strong if it's being used to compensate for road crown, but not so strong it would cause a significant "pull" it would cause what I would describe as a "Drift"
MOPAROFFICIAL
Oogliboogli
Bad tie rod. Typically..
Tight bearing would have to be tight enough to where it probably hurt it and make noise otherwise it probably just wear the race and accelerated fashion and not pull. The Idler arm and loose and its mounting point is more so a contributor to bumpster or oversteer.
How are your strut rods adjusted?
Tight bearing would have to be tight enough to where it probably hurt it and make noise otherwise it probably just wear the race and accelerated fashion and not pull. The Idler arm and loose and its mounting point is more so a contributor to bumpster or oversteer.
How are your strut rods adjusted?
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