Stuck mating small block back up to A833. Suggestions?

[MRGTX]

I’m stuck while reinstalling a Magnum crate motor that was previously hooked up to this exact transmission. I just can’t get this to go any farther and I could use a suggestion if you can spare one.

First, there are loose bolts in place just for guidance. I know enough to not pull it together with the bolts! .

Currently, there’s about 1/4” between the bell housing at the top and 1/3” down near the guide pins.The splines are engaged.

I’ve tried to brace the transmission at the front of the case to help it tilt “back” but it’s making no difference.

I don’t see any obstructions, I can’t tell why it’s stuck.

Any ideas? I took care aligning the clutch and it looked good before mating to the trans but could this be evidence that I was off a bit?

 

[pntastar69]

904 or 833?

 

[Professor Fate]

Couple of things come to mind.
1.) Convertor is not seated all the way into the 904. They slide onto the splines easily enough- but it takes a bit of jiggling and gradual turning (sometimes a whole bunch) to get it engaged to the pump. You'll know when it engages- it'll pop in another half-three quarters of an inch.
2.) If you had the later flange-mounted roller pilot bearing in the crank with your manual transmission, you did remove it before swapping back to the 904, right?

 

[toolmanmike]

I’m stuck while reinstalling a Magnum crate motor that was previously hooked up to this exact transmission. I just can’t get this to go any farther and I could use a suggestion if you can spare one.

First, there are loose bolts in place just for guidance. I know enough to not pull it together with the bolts! .

Currently, there’s about 1/4” between the bell housing at the top and 1/3” down near the guide pins.The splines are engaged.

I’ve tried to brace the transmission at the front of the case to help it tilt “back” but it’s making no difference.

I don’t see any obstructions, I can’t tell why it’s stuck.

Any ideas? I took care aligning the clutch and it looked good before mating to the trans but could this be evidence that I was off a bit?

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View attachment 1716404854

First of all that's a manual transmission and not a 904 automatic.

 

[MRGTX]

lol….I lived with an A904 for so damn long that I got my numbers mixed. Yes it’s an A833 4spd.

Fortunately, I was able to update the thread title.

 

[FlamesAreWicked]

I guess first thing is make sure the disc is aligned properly.

 

[Uncle Bob]

Loosen the pressure plate bolts, or have someone shove the pedal to the floor. Once the disc isn't clamped it can move the little bit you need to get it together.

 

[72bluNblu]

If you put the transmission in gear you can rock the output shaft back and forth a little to line up the splines with the clutch disk. Sometimes having the gear box in neutral still doesn’t let the splines come into alignment if they’re not close enough

 

[marksmopars]

Looks like pilot shaft isn’t going into the pilot bushing. Best method I know to resolve is to depress clutch to release the pressure plate so the clutch disk can move as needed to align. Good luck

 

[TT5.9mag]

Looks like the splines are engaged. That would leave only the pilot bearing/bushing to keep it from going together. Either mis-aligned or wrong size pilot, or too long an input shaft. Since it’s been together before I’m betting on mis alignment.

 

[RustyRatRod]

I agree about the pilot bushing not being aligned. The space left is just about the depth of the pilot bushing. Did you use a clutch alignment tool? You might try attaching the clutch linkage and getting a helper to depress the clutch pedal. As mentioned, that might unclamp the disk enough to allow it to align the bushing.

 

[Dartswinger70]

I'm thinking same or something in the pilot hole or pilot bearing/bushing broken crushed jammed up . But that's if the clutch disk was properly lined up. But basically it could be "all the above"

 

[Hellrats]

Pilot bushing is too small for the shaft or the disc is not lined up. I'd pull it back out and make sure everything is correct.
Who said 904?

 

[AJ/FormS]

OK I'm having a brain-stall moment;
If the bellhousing is not attached to the engine, how is depressing the clutch pedal gunna do anything but push the trans back out of the the disc?

 

[marksmopars]

OK I'm having a brain-stall moment;
If the bellhousing is not attached to the engine, how is depressing the clutch pedal gunna do anything but push the trans back

Good point, in this case I think he will likely need to back up and separate the tranny from the bellhousing, then install the bellhousing followed by the tranny. Then releasing the clutch via the pedal will make the installation easier.
While he has it out he can verify everything still looks ok.

 

[AJ/FormS]

Any ideas? I took care aligning the clutch and it looked good before mating to the trans but could this be evidence that I was off a bit?

I would install the BH on the block and index it first. Plus it's just way easier to install the TOP bolts without the trans in there.

To install the trans, I install some longer line-up bolts in the bottom two corners (bolts with the heads cut off, and screwdriver-slots cut in). and I put the trans in direct gear, with a spare yoke stuffed in the output end.
Thus with the Input entering the Disc, and the trans sitting on the line-up pins, the trans practically falls in, sometimes with a little jiggling on the yoke.
Once in place, I install one of the top corner bolts finger tight, then continue. Then tighten them.

The thing is,
I have an old stripped-tooth input-gear that I use to align the disc. If you don't have one of those, then as mentioned, you might consider leaving the PP loose beforehand; just don't forget to secure it later.
To immobilize the Flywheel, I use a prybar in the ring-gear, against the BH
To turn the crank, I Flip the fanbelt off, and put a ratchet on the Front damper-bolt. But you can also turn it by the ring-gear, the PP, or even the rear yoke.
I highly recommend that you tighten the bolts in a minimum of two stages; three is better.

When yur done, put the trans back into Neutral.

 

[Dartswinger70]

does the op not have a clutch alignment tool?

 

[MRGTX]

does the op not have a clutch alignment tool?

I used Dorman part number 14503. It was my first time doing this procedure so it’s possible it still ended up misaligned.

I cleared my schedule tomorrow to put these suggestions to use.

Thanks to all.

 

[Uncle Bob]

OK I'm having a brain-stall moment;
If the bellhousing is not attached to the engine, how is depressing the clutch pedal gunna do anything but push the trans back out of the the disc?

I replied above and didn't pick up on the OP mentioning they're putting things together in the wrong order.

 

[mopar head]

Dejha Vue.

 

[MRGTX]

Thanks to all for the help. It turns out that the hydraulic throwout bearing was not fully retracted.

As a life long ADHD sufferer (and generally successful manager thereof), it’s pretty typical for me to overlook such an obvious checklist item. All of the information you guys provided helped me work through this. I appreciate the help!

And yeah. This is why I don’t maintain aircraft!