trans input shaft will not slide onto clutch

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You will have better luck turning the output shaft as you can wiggle n turn at same time. Do it the way they are saying.

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stroker402 said:
why can I just turn the engine or a bit > isn't that same result



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Click to expand...
It’s way way way way earlier to turn the transmission. Drop the drive line from the rear end. Like I said it’s the angle of the dangle.

Making it way harder than it has to be.

As an FYI on a 2 post lift with a trans jack, I can pull and put in a different trans in my car in less than an hour by myself. On the ground is like 2 hours. Speaking on bearing on the ground, 2 weeks ago I was putting in a racing 5 speed transmission in an English Ford Escort that has next to no clearance, you had to have the trans on the bell and turn it 90° and stick the spline through the dual disk clutch and then turn it 90° and slide onto the locating pins. It was a C**t….
 
stroker402 said:
why can I just turn the engine or a bit > isn't that same result



/
Click to expand...
Maybe, maybe not...

If the shaft is pinned on the clutch disk, you turn the engine, you turn the pinned input shaft the same amount.

Get it up, see if it goes in. Girls love that... :) If it doesn't pull it back slightly,. turn the trunion, tailshaft or yoke a bit. Push it back forward. engages, keep going with install, not, pull it back and turn it a little more.
 
You all are telling me you want me the turn the driveshaft a bit at a time to turn the spline sum until it aligns up with clutch disc ....... why can't I just turn the engine a bit so I turn the disc teeth instead of turning the trans spline. it's easier this way /
 
I 'll try turning the driveshaft a little bit at a time in gear . Im working out of a tight one car stall .. i just don't have the room to barely jack the rear end of car up.\
that 's why I was asking if I could just the engine a bit at a time instead.. isn't that the same principle ? which I already tried doing with no good results
 
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I always put all-thread diagonally into 2 of the bellhousing bolt holes to help align and take pressure off when pushing it forward. Get them through the trans bolt holes. Makes life easier if by yourself.

You have people that have been building and racing stuff for over 40 years making suggestions you have refused to try or accept as potential fixes. Why can't I just turn the engine. >>>> :BangHead:
What does jacking up the rear of the car have to do with this. The driveshaft still attached to the trans and rear end, rolling it all under the car as a unit?. Doesn't make sense. Nothing should be on the trans past the tailshaft/trunion.

PP loosening was another that I was going to suggest that JD has. Alignment tools are a rough shot sometimes. The all thread helps a ton with that too.

Good luck.
 
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OK, @stroker402, I may be wrong, but I think you are missing the point of what @RustyRatRod, @Scody21 and others have told you. Let me try.
1. You said you used a clutch alignment tool. Did you install a new clutch and did it come with an alignment tool? If so, did you use that alignment tool? Is it possible that you have a misalignment between the number of splines on the transmission shaft and the clutch disc? That would certainly do it. The point I am trying to make is that you did not give us a lot of information, and we are wondering what is going on.
2 Assuming you have the right clutch disk for the transmission shaft and the alignment tool was correct and used properly, the transmission input shaft should slide in. I have installed a lot of manual transmissions, and they have just slid right in for me maybe 50% of the time. Sometimes it was a real pain. Here is what you need to do:
3. Make sure the transmission is sliding straight into the clutch disk and pilot bearing. If the transmission is tilted up/down or left/right, it will not slide in easily or at all. A transmission jack on wheels would be a big help. You might need a helper for the next step.
4. What the guys are saying is to put the transmission in gear and rotate the output shaft from the back. You could use an old transmission yoke or slide the driveshaft's front yoke into the transmission and wiggle it. This will be a lot easier with a helper. I wish I had a dollar for every time I was having trouble and then after wiggling/rotating the yoke on the back of the transmission a few degrees one way or the other, it slipped right in.
Bottom line is this: IF the splines on the transmission match, and IF you are sliding the transmission in straight (not tilted), and IF you wiggle/rotate the output shaft of the transmission a bit (by whatever method) the transmission WILL slip in.
 
crackedback said:
I always put all-thread diagonally into 2 of the bellhousing bolt holes to help align and take pressure off when pushing it forward. Get them through the trans bolt holes. Makes life easier if by yourself.

You have people that have been building and racing stuff for over 40 years making suggestions you have refused to try or accept as potential fixes. Why can't I just turn the engine. >>>> :BangHead:
What does jacking up the rear of the car have to do with this. The driveshaft still attached to the trans and rear end, rolling it all under the car as a unit?. Doesn't make sense. Nothing should be on the trans past the tailshaft/trunion.

PP loosening was another that I was going to suggest that JD has. Alignment tools are a rough shot sometimes. The all thread helps a ton with that too.

Good luck.
Click to expand...
Frustrating, huh? I'm surprised that @RustyRatRod hasn't already signed out on this one.
 
Scody21 said:
Oh he did like 20 post back…. OP has the trans in the car and is trying to slide the motor onto the trans. Going that route is like 2 monkeys Fing a football…
Click to expand...
I see that now. So the OP is trying to install the engine into the engine bay and slide it back onto the transmission that is already in the car??? That is a backwards way to do it. If you read his first post, He says, "install this 273 onto a 4 speed trans". I assumed that it was just poorly written. I assumed he was trying to install a transmission the usual way. He didn't give us much information, did he?
 
harrisonm said:
I see that now. So the OP is trying to install the engine into the engine bay and slide it back onto the transmission that is already in the car??? That is a backwards way to do it. If you read his first post, He says, "install this 273 onto a 4 speed trans". I assumed that it was just poorly written. I assumed he was trying to install a transmission the usual way. He didn't give us much information, did he?
Click to expand...

Yeah somewhere in the thread he says the trans is still in the car. Be better off pulling the trans, bolting it up to the motor and then stabbing it in… My next thought is how the heck is the trans sitting in the car without the motor? Just by the drive line and crossmember? Killing the trans rubber mount….. twisting and bending the crossmember?

Makes you go hummmmmm? :realcrazy:
 
Trying to mate the engine with the trans in place. Good luck with that. Figured this was a normal deal, engine in lifting trans into place. The all thread may help and a jack under the trans to hammer it against the floor pan for angle. Doing it by dropping the engine in is asking to flex the **** out of that disc. Better have one of those hand crank levelers on the hoist to adjust the engine angle.

If that does get it installed with trans in place, buy a lottery ticket, it's your lucky week!

I hold transmissions in place with a ratchet strap underneath going across to each torsion bar, works great.
 
1. splines not lined up
2. disc not centered with bushing.
3. crank hole not deep enough
4. Throw out bearing wrong and to long .
5. Wrong splines on disc.

Other then that there could be no answer. Just get a BFH
 
harrisonm said:
OK, @stroker402, I may be wrong, but I think you are missing the point of what @RustyRatRod, @Scody21 and others have told you. Let me try.
1. You said you used a clutch alignment tool. Did you install a new clutch and did it come with an alignment tool? If so, did you use that alignment tool? Is it possible that you have a misalignment between the number of splines on the transmission shaft and the clutch disc? That would certainly do it. The point I am trying to make is that you did not give us a lot of information, and we are wondering what is going on.
2 Assuming you have the right clutch disk for the transmission shaft and the alignment tool was correct and used properly, the transmission input shaft should slide in. I have installed a lot of manual transmissions, and they have just slid right in for me maybe 50% of the time. Sometimes it was a real pain. Here is what you need to do:
3. Make sure the transmission is sliding straight into the clutch disk and pilot bearing. If the transmission is tilted up/down or left/right, it will not slide in easily or at all. A transmission jack on wheels would be a big help. You might need a helper for the next step.
4. What the guys are saying is to put the transmission in gear and rotate the output shaft from the back. You could use an old transmission yoke or slide the driveshaft's front yoke into the transmission and wiggle it. This will be a lot easier with a helper. I wish I had a dollar for every time I was having trouble and then after wiggling/rotating the yoke on the back of the transmission a few degrees one way or the other, it slipped right in.
Bottom line is this: IF the splines on the transmission match, and IF you are sliding the transmission in straight (not tilted), and IF you wiggle/rotate the output shaft of the transmission a bit (by whatever method) the transmission WILL slip in.
Click to expand...
thanks for your help .. so turning the engine over by hand will not work? vs turning the output shaft in trans . isn't that the same result . not understanding.
about the set ... nothing has changed anywhere using all the old parts . old clutch set up, pressure plate ,disc. etc. turning the engine over spins the disc which is the same as turning the output shaft on trans to align the two parts ... am I wrong about that ?
 
This is what i do.... and have always done it this way since experiencing exactly the same frustration...not saying its right but it works for me.

i undo the clutch pressure plate so that the drive plate is just clamped loosely
i nominally centre it with my socket extension, but make sure i can lever it about with minimal effort, whilst making sure that it doesn't just fall down

then i jiggle the motor onto the trans or vice versa.
Input shaft pushes plate where it wants to go until everything is aligned and the spigot end goes into the spigot bush in the crank

then i get under and do up the clutch bolts

this way it doesn't matter if the clutch spline section does not align with the spigot bush
because it definitely bloody well will, by the time you have shoved the engine on.

Dave
 
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