tryin to break in new engine, ruff idle

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i was having carb problems also the way i knew it was carb problem- i have 2- carbs , i put a clean rag over 1 of them and it idle fine, my carbs got plugged up with debris. they rag mad it run rich where it needed to be. maybe try a rag over 1 side of the carb. it worked for me.
 
I also think it is a carburetor problem.
The metering block maybe clogged internally,if you notice no change adjusting idle/air mixture screws.
Did you every put a vacuum gauge on it? And what did it read?
To bad you could not swap your carb to another vehicle to see how it runs on theirs and how their carb works on yours....
A plus for me too many cars....
Set your idle high or adjust your choke partially closed so it will run on its own at it's lowest idle so you are still in the idle circuit.
Try unscrewing one air/fuel screw completely ,while running and feel with your finger if it is sucking air,if it is not the meter block is clogged...
Keep us posted!!!
TXDart
P.S. I have a older Edelbrock Performer Intake,definitely no better than the LD340 but would work with your application with a 700 or 750 carb....
PM me if interested.
 
TxDart, I was hoping you'd weigh in. No I didnt put vac guage on it. I figured since it was idling crappy and I need to keep it close to 2000rpm to keep it running - I wouldn't get a realistic reading. You think I should try it tho? I can get it fairly smooth with idle speed screw way in, and choking it for richer mix, but its a bit of a finess job.

I'm assuming the cam is broke in since I've run it 30 min., and drained the oil and there was no metal, so I think the cam is OK still.

Green6 - much appreciated input, expecially since you've run a Torker before. A couple of guys, plus the other website I checked, say the same thing: not enough vacuum using the Torker or not enough fuel delivered from this carb.
 
Sorry I meant Jerry6, not Green6. Also AbodyBomber - ran the same holly/motorcraft carb - thanks for your input. I know it came factory on 1985 mustang w/ 302.

I think I've got it narrowed down to 3 possibles:

1) Like TxDart said: clogged metering body in carb
2) Abodybomber: carb not designed to run a 360 w/ big cam
3) Jerry6: Torker manifold is crap

You guys are awesome. Thankyou. If you were here I'd buy you all beer. And DodgeFreak too
 
Torker ain't crap , it's just in your case , ie pistons cam carb head combo it will not work well . Been there done that . Once you get the right combo you'll enjoy the car , lots of great info on this site .
Enjoy the car once you get it sorted .
 
jerry6 said:
Torker ain't crap , it's just in your case , ie pistons cam carb head combo it will not work well . Been there done that . Once you get the right combo you'll enjoy the car , lots of great info on this site .
Enjoy the car once you get it sorted .
Click to expand...
Well said!!!
You could sell the Torker and replace it with one that will work good for your application.
Just wanting to know vacuum reading maybe you are sucking air from intake gaskets below manifold...Maybe your Torker was machined on the sides and bottom to match heads that were milled alot...
Maybe that carb would work on another manifold....
TXDart
 
TXDart said:
Well said!!!
You could sell the Torker and replace it with one that will work good for your application.
Just wanting to know vacuum reading maybe you are sucking air from intake gaskets below manifold...Maybe your Torker was machined on the sides and bottom to match heads that were milled alot...
Maybe that carb would work on another manifold....
TXDart
Click to expand...
And that is a problem buying used parts , was the intake milled to match another motor ? You never know , that has happened to me as well , there could be some small defect in it as well
(porous casting ), some people , not anyone here of course , but others try to pass crap they know is defective to make a buck .
 
Yesterday I bought Edelbrock Performer intake manifold on craigslist, from a trustworthy guy in my neighborhood, for $90. He showed me the 69 Dart that he just removed it from. I think its gonna be good. Now I just need a carb.

Glad to hear the Torker is not crap, just wasnt good for my application. I will sell it and hopefully make some of my money back.

Will keep you guys posted. Thanks again for all your advice!
 
I'm putting the top end back together now with my newly aquired edelbrock performer manifold and TQ carb I'm getting from David at DemonSizzler... but I can't decide whether to swap out the stock rockers that are still on it for the roller rockers I have in my garage.

Recap of my engine:
360 bored 30 over
stock pistons/rings
summit cam 228 duration, 480/480 lift at .050
rebuilt 360 heads w/ 1.88 valves (stainless) and double springs
Eddy performer manifold w/ TQ carb
Hooker headers
a-833 4spd w/ overdrive
3.23 rear end

I originally put on the stock rockers because so many of you told me I've over-cammed this motor, so I figured it good that the stock rockers don't give true 1.5 ratio and don't give you the full advertised lift of the cam.

But now I'm wondering if I ought to put on the roller rockers. What would you do if it were your motor? thanks guys
 
70aarcuda said:
mopar distributor do not have tooths to be off.....the distributor shaft sits inside the intermediate shaft....

pictures from the service manual shows the slot on the intermediate shaft pointing to the front intake bolt on the driver side for proper installation...

but it does not matter where it points...as long as went #1 cylinder is at TDC the distributor point is at #1 TDC....and rotor cap is pointing at #1 on the cap...

if you feel better with the slot installed as the service manual shows..take a large screw driver and move the intermediate shaft Clock wise and walk the shaft around then drop it in to line up...but it does not matter...

chevies get a tooth off...mopars do not...

besides you would be looking at a constant miss ....not a intermediate miss...
Click to expand...

I hate to disillusion you here, but there IS a correct orientation for the oil pump drive gear. The slot is supposed to point towards the driver's side rear most intake manifold bolt. It's in the factory service manual.
 
StrokerScamp said:
I hate to disillusion you here, but there IS a correct orientation for the oil pump drive gear. The slot is supposed to point towards the driver's side rear most intake manifold bolt. It's in the factory service manual.
Click to expand...

LOL yeah but that was with using the old factory point dist with the vacuum canister.

It really makes NO difference how the shaft goes in so long as the right spark goes to each plug. With a dist with no vacuum advance canister, its free to spin around more. Even with the vacuum can you can just go to where it needs to be.

Yeah your plug diagram on the cap might not line up with the dist cap clips like the factory manual shows, big freaken deal.

Now to run the plug wires really neatly, yes you would like it close to how the factory shows, only reason and it can be off a tooth or 2
 
screeminDemon said:
I

But now I'm wondering if I ought to put on the roller rockers. What would you do if it were your motor? thanks guys
Click to expand...


Well first I would had tried a different carb before pulling the intake but since were pass that point, no I would not swap in rollers, why ask for another problem ? Uless you heard loud clicking the lifters should have the pushrods in enough, so why mess with it?

You can aways pop just the valve covers off and swap them later on.

How did the intake ports look and the intake gasket, any traces of oil, if so there was a vacuum leak. What you should do is place the intake gasket on bone dry and lay the intake on, lightly tight a few bolts to make it sit on the gasket and take a .010 fleer gauge on the front water ports from top to bottom, if it slips in any place you need the intake milled or a thicker intake gasket depending where its off...or the heads need to come off.

Since the intake is off and it was running rough I would check really carefully the intake is sealing good top to bottom.

Or you can just slap lots of RTV around every port like some guys do, it might work, for how long it last nobody can say. RTV melts away with gasoline flowing through the ports
 
Thanks for weighing in DodgeFreak, I'm gonna take your advice and leave the stock rockers on for now. Like you said, I can easily swap them out later. I've just been bothered by a couple of loose exhaust rockers on the drivers side. I've clicked the engine over, checking each rocker one at at time when not on a lobe, and theres 2 that are wobbly loose. They do lift the valve when on lobe, but cant be as much as the others. I think the rocker shaft and/or rockers may be worn.

The intake gaskets looked really good. I used the blue felpro, and it appears everything matched up really well, and no evidence of any leaking. I didnt use any gasket glue, except for on the ends (instead of the cork). Do you think its OK to install the new manifold on those same gaskets? (Of course I'll scrape off the old rtv and run a new bead for the ends) The felpro intake gaskets are still firmly in place on the motor.
 
I re-use the intake gaskets if they look good. Just don't toque the bolts too tight or the gasket can split. It gets weaker with age, why now I use fel-pro gaskets that end with a S, they have a steel core sandwich in between.

A few rockers might feel loose after the engine has not be run in awhile but right after it ran all rockers should be pretty firm, if not you will hear them and its not good, parts get beat up quickly--not so fast everything is ruin, just its not good to leave them loose.
 
Thanks Dodgefreak. I will keep those gaskets on, they look good. The rockers still concern me. I couldn't hear them chatter when I ran the motor because I'm still runnin straight off the headers. But theres 2 exhaust valves on driver side that I'm sure are way too loose. And the cam and lifters are fine, the pushrods are good. The only thing I can think of is the rockers themselves are worn or slightly bent. Spring pressure should at least keep the rockers in contact with the pushrods even if they've lost hydraulic pressure I think (they do on the other 6 cylinders).

The 2 that I'm talking about can be rocked about 1/8 inch before even contacting the pushrods. Since I have a big cam I think the valves will still open enough, but I'm guessing this is gonna be a problem and I'm gonna need to put on my adjustable roller rockers sooner than later...
 
What happens is a few valves are left partly open when the engine is stop and the lifters bleed down. The lifters will not pump back up until the engine runs.

Why not leave the valve covers off and start the motor up for 10 good seconds and then check all the rockers while somebody bumps the starter off a few times.

If any rockers are loose they could cause a rougher idle--which you had
 
I know what your sayin, the lifters can bleed down. but what I discovered, upon close examination of the lifters and tryin to understand exactly how they work... the spring pressure in the lifter is at least enough to keep the pushrod up in contact with the rocker, even if it has bled down and wouldn't really give much lift until the engine is run and oil pressure builds again.

Even though I can press some of the rockers down (the ones that have bled down), by hand, they spring back up and keep the pushrod touching the rocker. But the #1 and #3 exhaust valves pushrods don't even touch the rockers (about 1/8" gap), even considering the lifter is fully extended by its little spring pressure.

So basically, I push the rocker down 1/8", it hits the pushrod, then I can push it (or bounce it up and down) another 1/4" or so due to the spring in the lifter.

None of the other lifters that have bled down have that 1/8" slack/gap... just the freeplay allowed by the spring in the lifter. Does that make any sense? Thanks again!
 
70aarcuda said:
mopar distributor do not have tooths to be off.....the distributor shaft sits inside the intermediate shaft....

pictures from the service manual shows the slot on the intermediate shaft pointing to the front intake bolt on the driver side for proper installation...

but it does not matter where it points...as long as went #1 cylinder is at TDC the distributor point is at #1 TDC....and rotor cap is pointing at #1 on the cap...

if you feel better with the slot installed as the service manual shows..take a large screw driver and move the intermediate shaft Clock wise and walk the shaft around then drop it in to line up...but it does not matter...

chevies get a tooth off...mopars do not...

besides you would be looking at a constant miss ....not a intermediate miss...
Click to expand...


it is possible the oil pump shaft was put back in on the wrong tooth, making the rotor button not completely point number one when its on TDC but your right it would be a constant miss/lucky to be able to get it to run
 
screeminDemon said:
I know what your sayin, the lifters can bleed down. but what I discovered, upon close examination of the lifters and tryin to understand exactly how they work... the spring pressure in the lifter is at least enough to keep the pushrod up in contact with the rocker, even if it has bled down and wouldn't really give much lift until the engine is run and oil pressure builds again.

Even though I can press some of the rockers down (the ones that have bled down), by hand, they spring back up and keep the pushrod touching the rocker. But the #1 and #3 exhaust valves pushrods don't even touch the rockers (about 1/8" gap), even considering the lifter is fully extended by its little spring pressure.

So basically, I push the rocker down 1/8", it hits the pushrod, then I can push it (or bounce it up and down) another 1/4" or so due to the spring in the lifter.

None of the other lifters that have bled down have that 1/8" slack/gap... just the freeplay allowed by the spring in the lifter. Does that make any sense? Thanks again!
Click to expand...

An 1/8 of an inch is a LOT....Sounds like you wiped a lobe, or 2....been there myself about 3 years ago. Take off your oil filter and cut it open, see how much metal pours out (hopefully none...for your sake).
 
Did you break the cam in with the double springs on the valves?
 
flyfish said:
Did you break the cam in with the double springs on the valves?
Click to expand...
x2 If you had both springs in there and it is a flat tappet cam, suposedly that will flatten the cam lobes, you are supposed to do the break-in with only the outer springs in there, unfortuantly it sounds like you might ave eaten your cam. but with the manifold off you should be able to see if the lobes are missing or damaged.....
 
Total side note....but I don't know why you would want/need double springs with small cam and .480 lift...just my 2 cents.
 
Well, with the intake off, I can visually inspect every lobe, and they all look fine. Of course, I suppose it would require a mic measurement on each to be sure. But considering that much slack in those 2 rockers, you'd think I would see something visually on the cam lobes. I looked at them very closely, and can't honestly say I see any wear.

The double springs were recommended by machine shop based on my cam specs. The second spring is not really a full second spring, more of a helper - I forget what they called it...
 
Might be a damper (looks like a double spring from the outside).
 
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