Weirdest herky jerkey clutch

[ValiantOne]

Hey all,

Just did an auto to 4 speed conversion in my 68 Val. I'm planning a 5.9 efi, (hopefully Passon) o/d combo in the future. For now it is just a standard 833 o/d. I will have to swap out the flywheel for the efi upgrade and will go with a higher quality clutch at that point too. In the interim I just went for budget (read cheap!) For a temporary solution. The flywheel was a new iron $100 piece from ebay, and the cluch kit is just a $100 kit from Advance Auto.

Anyhow I went through 3 kits to get one that was right. The first was from ORiley and was missing the t/o bearing. Sent it back and got one from Autozone. Installed it and it wouldn't disengage. Got a whole seperate thread on that debacle. Pulled it out and got another kit from Advance Auto. This one works but the finger adjustment is crappy, and I cannot depress the clutch all the way to the floor or else something statrts to make contact inside. I assume this is the fingers hitting the clutch plate springs.

Anyhow all three of these kits are made by the same outfit and just packed in different boxes for the different retailers. And I mean they were identical down to the font of the part numbers etched on them. Now that I have one in operation, I am not too surprised that it has some weirdness to it. It is the jerkeyist clutch I've ever had. You cant really ease it out or the whole process just gets noisy and jerky. You've got to gass her and be agressive on the clutch release to get a smooth engagement.

I thought it may smooth out, but not so far. Then I've only got 100-200 miles on it so far.

Has anyone else had this result? Just curious. And just bitchin' a little too.....

Thanks

CE

 

[toolmanmike]

Complain away. Sounds like you've been through a lot of work and still don't have what you want. Lots of the clutches built now are not very good quality. You have changed absolutely everything and any one component you installed could cause problems. My first thought is you have a bad pressure plate. The fingers are un even and or set incorrectly. Usually when you have a jumpy or chattering clutch it's because the flywheel or pressure plate surface is heat checked or you have a leak that causes some slipping. It will be interesting to hear others responses. Is their a Clutch Masters in your area?

 

[AJ/FormS]

This one is junk too!
Either the finger-height is off, (which should always be checked before the install), or one of the friction surfaces has hard spots, or the disc is warped/bent.

Personally, I have never bought a bad clutch. But I don't buy in that lower price range. In 45 years, I've only bought about 5 or 6 units; Mopar, Zoom?,McLeod, Scheifer,CenterForce,and one other I cannot recall.Everyone worked as expected. And I still have one or two of them on the shelf and the CF has been in my car since about 2002. Yeah it/I have destroyed a few discs, put the pp is working just fine.

FWIW
there is no reason to push the pedal down to the floor if halfway is enough to disengage it. About 2 to 2.5 inches plus the freeplay is all my CF needs at speed and at a stoplight only a bit more. So I imagine my CF diaphragm-type might use 60% or 70% of it's total travel.The three-finger B&B types need a bit more, but my linkage has never needed 100%. Some guys install a block on the floor to limit travel.I only put enough freeplay in it to keep the TObearing off the fingers.

 

[toolmanmike]

The first one I bought off the net. I had issues from the start. Couldn't get it adjusted, (free play) and the t/o bearing was riding in the fingers until it failed and ruined 2 of the 3 fingers. Think the fingers weren't right from the get go? The second and last one I bought from Brewers and I had it checked out at Clutch Masters b/4 installing. It has been good!

 

[ValiantOne]

The first one I bought off the net. I had issues from the start. Couldn't get it adjusted, (free play) and the t/o bearing was riding in the fingers until it failed and ruined 2 of the 3 fingers. Think the fingers weren't right from the get go? The second and last one I bought from Brewers and I had it checked out at Clutch Masters b/4 installing. It has been good!

That sounds exactly like my problem. I adjusted the pedal as described in the fsm. But one (or more) fingers was still touching the t/o bearing b/c it was still spinning. Had to adjust the pedal to over 1 inch of freeplay to get th t/o bearing to stop spinning.

It didn't occur to me that this could cause jerky engagement, but that makes perfect sense.

Not aware of a clutchmasters around here, but it sounds like good insurance. When I do the engine upgrade I was planning on a high quality McLeod or the like. I didn't want to buy it now b/c if I go w/ Passon's o/d, it is an 18 spline, yadda yadda......

 

[AJ/FormS]

You can still use a high quality pp; only the disc changes. I like the Mopar factory 340 discs for street duty. They are smooth,take a licking, and they are relatively cheap. Mine survive a year to three behind 420hp/street with a 10.97 starter gear and 3600pounds, with 295s. Ima guessing 25,000 miles. I found the CFII disc too harsh for street. Plus it broke everything behind it until I upgraded; Trannys, yokes,joints, and ring-gears. And all that on the street, with cheapo 295s, that everybody poo-poos as having no bite. Well, they are right. Mostly. They only bite when brand new, and only for a few thousand miles. Then they are good for 2.2, 60 fts. lol. But they make a great howling sound for a few thousand miles, and then by 40/50%worn off they go silent. And then the lack of bite becomes very consistent, making sliding very predictable.
But I digress.....

 

[Daves69]

IMO some possibilities for clutch grab.....
Fat spot on disc
Burnt flywheel (hard/soft spots)
Uneven plate departure (finger height adjustment, stretched eyebolt, worn clutch fork tip(s), bent/worn fork pivot, cracked bearing retainer)
Twisted clutch cover (throwing the clutch plate off center)
Loose or bottomed mounting bolts (allowing trans to ****)

 

[ValiantOne]

You can still use a high quality pp. only the disc changes. I like the Mopar factory 340 discs for street duty. They are smooth,take a licking, and they are relatively cheap. Mine survive a year to three behind 420hp/street with a 10.97 starter gear and 3600pounds, with 295s. Ima guessing 25,000 miles. I found the CFII disc too harsh for street. Plus it broke everything behind it until I upgraded; Trannys, yokes,joints, and ring-gears. And all that on the street, with cheapo 295s, that everybody poo-poos as having no bite. Well, they are right. Mostly. They only bite when brand new, and only for a few thousand miles. Then they are good for 2.2, 60 fts. lol. But they make a great howling sound for a few thousand miles, and then by 40/50%worn off they go silent. And then the lack of bite becomes very consistent, making sliding very predictable.
But I digress.....

Again, hadn't considered that the pp could be reused with the 18 or 23 spline unit. Where do you buy a factory 340 unit? I just may do that.

 

[AJ/FormS]

dealer
HD disc #P4876911 or Std disc #P4529136 either should work behind a 5.9
I like my CF diaphragm pressure plate, but it is probably more than I need. To it's credit it has well over 100,000 miles and is as solid and smooth today as the day I installed it. So it is down to about less than $50Cad per year. Or half that in USD