What the......

[69signetv8]

Hi guys, This is a long story but I wanted to ensure the information was here. I'm also not up on trans and think my problem is within and not electrical.

I was out for a drive and came to a red light and the engine died like never before when heated up. I cranked it over for about min until it flashed, however I could tell something was wrong..IE bad idle like out of timing, shortage of fuel and bad RPM's.
I was only about a mile from home. The car would only let me go about 45 MPH about 2000 RPM (with 391 gears) NO more then that without stalling. If I tried she would die.
Backing down the driveway in reverse she did die and would not start up.
I first figured it was my electrical. I check all the following with swap outs: coil, modulator, B Resistor. (All are fine). Next I check my fuel system..OK.
When everything was back together, she reflashed and my idle was at 900 RPM and I could rev up to 4000 with just a little stumble, HOWEVER..every time I put her into "any" gear (not moving) including reverse she die's and I can't restart her for about four min. (like a pressure problem).
After about seven trys, I'm thinking somethings up with the (904) trans?? The trans itself is not making any strange noises (that I can tell). With the 391s I at times crouse about 65 MPH @ 3000 RPM and like to give her hell at times. Anyone have any ideas for me? Thanks, Jim

 

[69signetv8]

18 readers and NOT-TA- Taker. I did read on line that something like a Clutch Solnoid could be stuck open/closed?? I don't know where to start looking :sad2:

 

[Mrmopartech]

Can you please tell us what car we are talking about here? Is it your signet or the family mini van.You can mention all the normal stuff,stlye of tranny and the motor,car,year and make.If you post your number I can even call you and help you,Mrmoaprtech

 

[7172 duster]

Maybe if you have an ome timing chain it could have skipped timing ,They have been known to do this on occasion.

 

[fishy68]

Jim do this first. Check your ignition timing and see where it's at. If it's where you set it at last your timing chain is probably ok. If it is way off your timing chain probably jumped. It may have just jumped a tooth (seen it happen alot on small blocks) and that can cause what your describing.

BTW: Exactly what did you mean when you said after you put it in gear and it dies you can't start it for about 4 minutes. Are you saying it won't crank over or are you saying it cranks but just don't start?

And there is no such thing as a clutch/solenoid in a torqueflite whether it's a 904 or 727. I have read stuff in other forums that is just plain silly.

 

[69signetv8]

Thanks for the reply guys. It's my Signet. 69, 273 with a 904. The engine itself was rebuilt a few years back. I really don't thing it's the chain, because I was driving...nicely to the store.

More info..When she's cold, she flashes up (no problem) and idles fine. Just keep stalling in gear with a shudder. When dies have to wait for a while...like for pressure to drop.

e-mail: rjohnston318@shaw.ca

 

[69signetv8]

Jim do this first. Check your ignition timing and see where it's at. If it's where you set it at last your timing chain is probably ok. If it is way off your timing chain probably jumped. It may have just jumped a tooth (seen it happen alot on small blocks) and that can cause what your describing.

BTW: Exactly what did you mean when you said after you put it in gear and it dies you can't start it for about 4 minutes. Are you saying it won't crank over or are you saying it cranks but just don't start?

And there is no such thing as a clutch/solenoid in a torqueflite whether it's a 904 or 727. I have read stuff in other forums that is just plain silly.

Well fishy, If I went out "now" it would start and idle fine. I can even rev it up and she will nicely idle again. It's just when I put it into gear that it stalls, then I can't restart. PS It turning over and there's spark..she just won't keep going right after she die's?

 

[fishy68]

Well if it's running that good until you put it in gear it does sound like a trans problem. I've heard of converters taking a dump like that but never seen one myself. The only thing is if you put the car in neutral or park it should disengage it so even if the converter is bad it should start ok.

Jim even though you say it starts and revs good if you have a timing light check it anyway just to make sure it's not the timing chain. I've seen so many of them jump a tooth and cause a problem like this it really makes me wonder. It's an easy check to rule out.

 

[fishy68]

BTW I just caught your comment about you didn't think it was the chain because you were driving nicely to the store. Hate to say it but that don't mean squat on small blocks. I too was puttering up to a stop sign at 15 mph when mine jumped 3 teeth. A buddy of mine was running down the road at a steady 55 mph and let off the gas without applying the brakes and his jumped a tooth. Don't know how to explain it but they just have a nasty habbit of doing it.

 

[69signetv8]

BTW I just caught your comment about you didn't think it was the chain because you were driving nicely to the store. Hate to say it but that don't mean squat on small blocks. I too was puttering up to a stop sign at 15 mph when mine jumped 3 teeth. A buddy of mine was running down the road at a steady 55 mph and let off the gas without applying the brakes and his jumped a tooth. Don't know how to explain it but they just have a nasty habbit of doing it.

I will check it out fishy, I have nothing to loose at doing so. I'm just alittle lost and if timing chains the case...why will she start no problem after 4-5 min and idle nicely, rev nicely then put in gear...dies, then won't restart? If it was the timing, wouldn't I have problems starting "all" the time? not just after abit?

 

[fishy68]

I have to admit it's a longshot only because you say it starts and revs good. But it's an easy check to do. The only explanation I have is when the cam timing is off a engine will run hotter than normal which will cause hard starting.

Jim when it's cool and you start it can you put it in gear then and it stay running? Or does it die any time you put it in gear?

 

[69signetv8]

I have to admit it's a longshot only because you say it starts and revs good. But it's an easy check to do. The only explanation I have is when the cam timing is off a engine will run hotter than normal which will cause hard starting.

Jim when it's cool and you start it can you put it in gear then and it stay running? Or does it die any time you put it in gear?

When it's "cool" and starts up right away the rpm's are about 1500 until I snap the throttle to 900. If I don't snap the throttle it won't die "right away" until the RPMs drop. My RPM for idle (park) is set at 900 and she drops to about 550 in gear fishy. I kinda thought it was something to do with a stuck valve not allowing the "stall" to work correctly?

 

[fishy68]

There's no valve for the stall. The stall is regulated by the angle or pitch of the fins in the converter.

Do you have a bigger than stock cam in your engine? 900 in neutral is a very high idle. Dropping to 550 is a very large drop. My Cuda has a pretty darn big cam and it only idles at 800 in neutral.

 

[69signetv8]

There's no valve for the stall. The stall is regulated by the angle or pitch of the fins in the converter.

Do you have a bigger than stock cam in your engine? 900 in neutral is a very high idle. Dropping to 550 is a very large drop. My Cuda has a pretty darn big cam and it only idles at 800 in neutral.

Man "I" have a lot to learn about torqueflites :notworth: Stock cam Tracy, I was running last week at 700 until someone told me to up it by 200 due to my "older" style streetmaster intake that's not a good balance.

 

[fishy68]

Man "I" have a lot to learn about torqueflites :notworth: Stock cam Tracy, I was running last week at 700 until someone told me to up it by 200 due to my "older" style streetmaster intake that's not a good balance.

Oh well Jim I've been working on them for yrs. and do too.
If I remember right the streetmaster is a single plane (correct me if I'm wrong) but it was a small plenum single plane intake. A dual plane would be better for you but it's not the worst intake you could run by any means. I can't see how raising the idle rpm would help anything though. It would just make u-joint life shorter.

 

[69signetv8]

Oh well Jim I've been working on them for yrs. and do too.
If I remember right the streetmaster is a single plane (correct me if I'm wrong) but it was a small plenum single plane intake. A dual plane would be better for you but it's not the worst intake you could run by any means. I can't see how raising the idle rpm would help anything though. It would just make u-joint life shorter.

Your 100% right about the streetmaster. If I ever get the car rolling correctly I plan on getting the duel plane and I will drop my idle RPM back to 700 :thumblef:

 

[nick69]

Hey Jim,
Sorry to hear your having Trans problems too.

 

[69signetv8]

Hey Jim,
Sorry to hear your having Trans problems too.

Thanks man, It really "Sucks"...getting good help though.