yet another exhaust manifold query

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R3dplanet

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Okay, I'm in the process of getting a rebuilt and beautiful 360 prepped for installation into my '65 Barracuda.

The exhaust question needs to be answered. I'm going to need a set of manifolds and I'm open to suggestion whether to use (and refurbish) an old set or acquire new set. I have the newer style reduction gear starter, and that opens things up a bit. But I also have power steering and I don't want to ditch it. It seems as though every trick I see (Dakota manifolds, headers, coveted-yet-overpriced 68-70 340 manifolds) won't work with the power steering box in the way.

Surely I'm not the only early-A owner with power steering and newer LA motor. How have others solved this?
 
The only manifolds that I found to work with power steering are the originals. Or if you want to cut fenderwell headers.
 
Hot Rod just did a test of all the manifolds and headers on a 300 HP crate motor and there was a thread posted in the last couple days on FABO. The difference between a stock set of 69 318 manifolds and a set of high dollar 340' was 11 HP (305 vs. 316). I know the 69 318's are a little bit better than the stock 65 273's your car came with and are probably an easy swap with no clearance issues. They used a 2 1/4 pipe off the manifold in the test.

By the way, most of the headers tested had no gain and even a loss on a 300 HP motor. Headers are really going to be a pain on your year car and with no real power advantage it's a waste of headaches.

Do a search for the thread on here, there is a link to the Hot Rod page with all the dyno results and I think you'll agree with what I just wrote.
 
I'm in the same boat with my 66 GT 360, p.s., 904 column shift , a/c

I can use Sanderson shorty on the Passenger side.

Its the drivers side is the problem !

TTI headers work with mini starter, floor shifter, p/s, and a/c.

The drivers side require the above items and threading the t bar and steering shaft through the tubes also adding a bearing and seal at the lower end of the steering column.

But the Passenger side requires 90* oil filter adapter or remote filter.

From the pictures I've seen they fill up all the available real estate.

I'm thinking about a shorty header that mimics the factory cast header for the drivers side and the Sanderson for the pass. side.
 
Right. I never really wanted to go with headers unless I had to. I've never found headers to all they're cracked up to be. I read the Hot Rod article and I'm not a bit surprised by the findings. Just for kicks I looked at the TTI headers, but I don't like the idea of buying a $250 starter on top of $800 for the headers themselves. I'm perfectly happy with whatever manifold will work, but clearly when I hold up my 273 manifolds to the 360 heads I can see that the ports are way off.

So perhaps the '69 318 manifold will work better.

If it helps at all to mention, I do have a manual transmission with four on the floor and I removed the z-bar in favor of a hydraulic clutch PEDAL kit.

Thanks for the responses, everyone.
 
welcome to the frustation of owning an Early Abody Mopar.

The engine bay is small.

You want easier, buy a 1967 and newer Abody or a Bbody.

Are you going to be street driving the car?

If your going to Drag race it in Superstock etc class,
then go for the headers.

Otherwise save your self a lot of headaches,
use the 273 manifolds.

A small newer style starter will help a lot,
I am using one, less weight, and spins the engine faster,
with less amperage draw. :) :)

Drivers side I suggest use a copper exhaust gasket.

Lots of info on this site, use Search function.
Please, Look at, and read this thread, linked.

http://www.forabodiesonly.com/mopar/showthread.php?t=46702

My 318 with cast # 302 heads had a minor exhaust leak with the 273 manifold, the copper exhaust gasket helped a ton.

Just a few suggestions, there is no easy way on the small Early Abody.

Take photos and share with us, of your car as you work on it. 8)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ud8mci4rjFU
 
I dont believe the 67 up 318 manifold will work either with p/s. It looks to be cast the same as a 340 for the outlet and thats where I had the trouble with my p/s gear.
 
It seems I will have to agree with most of you. When I did my slant to v8 swap I tried all kinds of manifolds on the hopes of getting one that would fit. The only one that will fit without problems is the 64-66 273 manifold. I couldnt even get the Dakota manifold to fit, with out some major firewall mods, I even tried a set Dakota headers, with no luck. They are getting hard to find but its definately worth finding a drivers side 273 manifold, if its just going to be a cruiser. My little 318 seems to run plenty strong with the manifolds. I had thought about it for awhile but $800 for headers is a lot of money for 11hp. Anyway......thats my 2 cents.
 
I talked to Sanderson last year about making a driver side shorty header for a 360 in a 64-66 A body.

They said bring in a car with all the stuff installed except the exhaust and they could build one for about $500.

So I asked if they would consider adding it to their line and what would the price be for a set (Their pass.side shorty and the new drivers side shorty).

They said if there was enough of a demand they would produce it and the price would be around $500 for the set.

What we need to do is take a poll for demand and a poll to split the cost of the prototype.

So is anyone in the S.F. Bay area with a 64-66 A body with a 318,340,360 , P/S , 904 col. shift or 833 floor shift, duel master cylinder, Mini starter willing to drop it off at Sanderson for the Prototyping.
 
Sanderson headers would be Awesome.8)

I have seen their Cast Headers and WOW. :)


Their website is a little odd, but their catalog shows that they have Block Huggers for small block Mopar,
too bad they are center dump, and don't fit Abody Cars.



http://www.sandersonheaders.com/custom_built_headers.php


GGs66GT said:
I talked to Sanderson last year about making a driver side shorty header for a 360 in a 64-66 A body.

They said bring in a car with all the stuff installed except the exhaust and they could build one for about $500.

So I asked if they would consider adding it to their line and what would the price be for a set (Their pass.side shorty and the new drivers side shorty).

They said if there was enough of a demand they would produce it and the price would be around $500 for the set.

What we need to do is take a poll for demand and a poll to split the cost of the prototype.

So is anyone in the S.F. Bay area with a 64-66 A body with a 318,340,360 , P/S , 904 col. shift or 833 floor shift, duel master cylinder, Mini starter willing to drop it off at Sanderson for the Prototyping.
Click to expand...


Need a special, one-of-a-kind header design?

Here's how to make it happen!
In addition to the styles you see in the catalog, we fabricate many unique headers for custom performance and appearance applications. The same high quality materials and careful craftsmanship that distinguishes our in-stock headers will go into your design. Accurate measurements are critical to successful results. To build your custom headers we need a detailed drawing or blueprint with precise dimensions and an exhaust port gasket (for accurate header plate).

You should send us front and side photos of the chassis, engine compartment and the car itself. We suggest that you use the diagrams on this page as a starting point. Make some enlarged photocopies to aid you in working up the final design. We can fabricate your headers in mild or stainless steel, and offer chrome or ceramic coated finishes.




DD1.jpg
 
Those are pretty. But unless they ever materialize I guess I'm stuck using my stock 273 manifolds. If this is the case, where on earth am I going to find a suitable copper self-sealing gasket for misaligned ports?
 
spankmeister7 said:
Okay, I'm in the process of getting a rebuilt and beautiful 360 prepped for installation into my '65 Barracuda.

The exhaust question needs to be answered. I'm going to need a set of manifolds and I'm open to suggestion whether to use (and refurbish) an old set or acquire new set. I have the newer style reduction gear starter, and that opens things up a bit. But I also have power steering and I don't want to ditch it. It seems as though every trick I see (Dakota manifolds, headers, coveted-yet-overpriced 68-70 340 manifolds) won't work with the power steering box in the way.

Surely I'm not the only early-A owner with power steering and newer LA motor. How have others solved this?
Click to expand...

I have headers on my race only '65 Dart. They would be a pain to use on the street, and forget power steering. Have you given any thought to using stock manifolds and having them ported by sending them to "Extrude Hone"? It may work out for your purposed on the 360.
 
Caution!!!!! on the drivers side ....when using the early a body manifolds and later style heads the downpipe will hit the cylinder head!!!! you will need to a tiny bit of grinding and use two header gaskets and a heat shield to get clearance...if you do not do this you will have a leak or break the exhaust manifold.we tryed this on a 65 valiant with 302 heads and it hit the pad below the exhaust port,that pad is very thin so dont grind a lot off of it ..maybe just a lil' bit off the edge and some off the manifold but the double gaskets get the clearance you will need so try them first and see how much grinding to do...Good Luck and hope this was helpful...wagg's
 
waggin said:
Caution!!!!! on the drivers side ....when using the early a body manifolds and later style heads the downpipe will hit the cylinder head!!!! you will need to a tiny bit of grinding and use two header gaskets and a heat shield to get clearance...if you do not do this you will have a leak or break the exhaust manifold.we tryed this on a 65 valiant with 302 heads and it hit the pad below the exhaust port,that pad is very thin so dont grind a lot off of it ..maybe just a lil' bit off the edge and some off the manifold but the double gaskets get the clearance you will need so try them first and see how much grinding to do...Good Luck and hope this was helpful...wagg's
Click to expand...


Heed his warning I ground a little too much off the pad on the head and she began spraying coolant at me. It was not a good day.
 
you can braze it up,but I imagine was no fun doing it in the car.I have a broken manifold in the shed I got from a buddie that will need to be repaired,I luckily had one for him and we tacled it together and solved the problem
 
I Installed TTI's on my 65. A newer mini starter will work. Just use a remote oil filter. It makes life so much easier. Installation is not so bad. Add a torque strap to your list. The headers sit real close to frame rails. Im not sure about the power steering. I have manual steering in my car.
HKeller
 
I'm a little stupefied at the lack of options for our early As. However, I'm thankful for all the responses.

It certainly looks like an easier application without power steering. But I'd like to repeat that I can't really do without power steering because I'm what you might call weak due to a pretty serious illness. I'm not whining - I just really need my p/s and p/b. I originally had the car with standard brakes and standard steering but it was just way too difficult and little unsafe on the road. So I spent a ton of money getting nice parts and having them rebuilt. I'd hate to do away with all that work.

I'm a bit worried about the prospect of cutting into the head or manifold with a grinder. Also, I have every intention of keeping the 273 whole and rebuilding it. If I modify the manifold too much I fear it will come back to haunt me. The heads I found are currently with the machinist. They are J-type heads. The engine is out of the bay and that will help to make sure its as safe as possible. If I do go with the 273 manifolds and grinding a bit, does anyone have a line on exactly which gaskets to use?
 
spankmeister7 said:
I'm a little stupefied at the lack of options for our early As. However, I'm thankful for all the responses.

It certainly looks like an easier application without power steering. But I'd like to repeat that I can't really do without power steering because I'm what you might call weak due to a pretty serious illness. I'm not whining - I just really need my p/s and p/b. I originally had the car with standard brakes and standard steering but it was just way too difficult and little unsafe on the road. So I spent a ton of money getting nice parts and having them rebuilt. I'd hate to do away with all that work.

I'm a bit worried about the prospect of cutting into the head or manifold with a grinder. Also, I have every intention of keeping the 273 whole and rebuilding it. If I modify the manifold too much I fear it will come back to haunt me. The heads I found are currently with the machinist. They are J-type heads. The engine is out of the bay and that will help to make sure its as safe as possible. If I do go with the 273 manifolds and grinding a bit, does anyone have a line on exactly which gaskets to use?
Click to expand...


If you are using the J heads no grinding will be needed the manifold will bolt up ok. It is just on the 360 and newer 318 head that grinding is needed as the boss for the polution hits the manifold and will break the back ear off when you tighten it up. So basically you will be ok with those heads.
 
http://www.summitracing.com/parts/SUM-111420/

Exhaust Gaskets, Header, Copper, Stock Port, Mopar, Small Block, Pair
$19.95

sum-111420.jpg


spankmeister7 said:
I'm a little stupefied at the lack of options for our early As. However, I'm thankful for all the responses.

It certainly looks like an easier application without power steering. But I'd like to repeat that I can't really do without power steering because I'm what you might call weak due to a pretty serious illness. I'm not whining - I just really need my p/s and p/b. I originally had the car with standard brakes and standard steering but it was just way too difficult and little unsafe on the road. So I spent a ton of money getting nice parts and having them rebuilt. I'd hate to do away with all that work.

I'm a bit worried about the prospect of cutting into the head or manifold with a grinder. Also, I have every intention of keeping the 273 whole and rebuilding it. If I modify the manifold too much I fear it will come back to haunt me. The heads I found are currently with the machinist. They are J-type heads. The engine is out of the bay and that will help to make sure its as safe as possible. If I do go with the 273 manifolds and grinding a bit, does anyone have a line on exactly which gaskets to use?
Click to expand...
 
Just bolt the manifold to the head and check for clearance issues beforehand and everything will be ok my post earlier was a warning about heads with the polution pad's on them but look things over to be on the safe side,Wagg's
 
Instead of grinding the head I made a spacer out of a piece of 1/4 x 3" strap, for my 302 heads. It turned out a whole lot better than I thought it would too. I used the ports as a template and cut holes and made it the shape of the gasket. You cant tell its there unless your really looking for it. Before doing this I learned the hard way about the fit on the 302 heads, needless to say I have an extra broken manifold.
 
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