318 for 1965 Barracuda

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GreyWizard

GreyWizard

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Hi all:

The original 273 came out of Ruby this weekend. I ordered a remanufactured 318 (1967-1974) today to replace it.

The engine builder suggested the possibility of a fitment issue and encouraged me to stick with a 273. This is not something I had heard before.

Any thoughts from the experts?

TIA

David
 
might need to switch torque converter /or adapter to fit rear of engine also you are talking about a la 318 not the a 318 wide block right.
 
dibbons said:
If you have a Torqueflite automatic transmission, depending on the year of crankshaft and torque convertor (If they are not the same production year), sometimes a bushing/spacer should be used.

Slant 6 Torque Converter Bushing
Click to expand...

I knew of the need for a tranny adapter bushing. The builder was suggesting the possibility of a difference in the blocks.
 
An LA 318 to replace a 273 is about as easy a swap as there is. Use the timing cover, water pump and pulleys from your 273 and the current radiator works. For the torque converter the spacer can be acquired through Pat Blais Transmissions (Torqueflite Patty), Seattle, Washington 98125,(206) 365-1966
 
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grimreaper said:
An LA 318 to replace a 273 is about as easy a swap as there is. Use the timing cover, water pump and pulleys from your 273 and the current radiator works.
Click to expand...

I thought that to be the case.

Thank you to everyone who replied.

David
 
Also,IIRC, the intake bolt holes are at a different angle on the early 273s than on the 66 and ups; but Ima thinking you're gonna run a later 4bbl intake anyway,so this would be a non-issue.
If you're going from a 2bbl to a 4bbl, you're gonna run into an issue with the Kickdown system and the carb hook up. But there are solutions for these
If you're gonna run a block-heater or two, be sure to install them BEFORE the engine goes home, it is so much easier to do it now.
 
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AJ/FormS said:
Also,IIRC, the intake bolt holes are at a different angle on the early 273s than on the 66 and ups; but Ima thinking you're gonna run a later 4bbl intake anyway,so this would be a non-issue.
If you're going from a 2bbl to a 4bbl, you're gonna run into an issue with the Kickdown system and the carb hook up. But there are solutions for these
Click to expand...

Good catch and you guest correctly. I plan on purchasing an Edelbrock Performer manifold and carburetor. I would be very interested in available solutions to the throttle / kick down issue as that is exactly what I am doing.
 
I used a 1971 318 in my 1965 Barracuda.It bolted right in and there were no issues at all.It had an A833 4 speed behind it. My friend did the same to a 65 Valiant with a 904 automatic .We had a new convertor made that used the newer style front to mate with the crank and the older rear half to mate with the 65 trans.This was in the late 90's .The convertor cost around 100 dollars to have made by this place called Biltron . Another friend used the 35 dollar spacer on the front of his convertor to mate it with the crank .It worked great as well.Good luck with your swap
 
valiantwagonguy said:
I used a 1971 318 in my 1965 Barracuda.It bolted right in and there were no issues at all.It had an A833 4 speed behind it. My friend did the same to a 65 Valiant with a 904 automatic .We had a new convertor made that used the newer style front to mate with the crank and the older rear half to mate with the 65 trans.This was in the late 90's .The convertor cost around 100 dollars to have made by this place called Biltron . Another friend used the 35 dollar spacer on the front of his convertor to mate it with the crank .It worked great as well.Good luck with your swap
Click to expand...

Thank you for the information and well wishes.

David
 
GreyWizard said:
Good catch and you guest correctly. I plan on purchasing an Edelbrock Performer manifold and carburetor. I would be very interested in available solutions to the throttle / kick down issue as that is exactly what I am doing.
Click to expand...
You have a couple of choices; the first is to find the oem parts, and the second is Lokar; they have the cable conversion for the KD system.
The 4bbl intake bracket is now available after-market, and
as to the gas pedal,you'll probably want to convert to the cable-pull style from the later cars,and
if the intake you choose is a high-rise, that takes a different aftermarket bracket. that is adjustable for height.
Some guys here on FABO have cut the 2bbl bracket up and spliced in a piece to make it work. You'll have to search it out. It has to come forward and up, and be synchronized to your pedal system, so if you swap the floor-mounted pedal out for a suspended pedal,you'll need to do that first. The aftermarket brackets have the math worked out already
 
Bouchillion Performance makes a cable kickdown also. Since you have a V8 in your car, 66 Barracuda?, you are good to go with a 340 throttle bracket. Your pedal and cable should be fine.
 
AJ/FormS said:
You have a couple of choices; the first is to find the oem parts, and the second is Lokar; they have the cable conversion for the KD system.
The 4bbl intake bracket is now available after-market, and
as to the gas pedal,you'll probably want to convert to the cable-pull style from the later cars,and
if the intake you choose is a high-rise, that takes a different aftermarket bracket. that is adjustable for height.
Some guys here on FABO have cut the 2bbl bracket up and spliced in a piece to make it work. You'll have to search it out. It has to come forward and up, and be synchronized to your pedal system, so if you swap the floor-mounted pedal out for a suspended pedal,you'll need to do that first. The aftermarket brackets have the math worked out already
Click to expand...

I think the Edelbrock Performer manifold is close to stock height. I would like to keep this as simple and inexpensive as possible.

Are you suggesting the Lokar solution would allow me to keep rest of the existing hardware? If so, that would be appealing.

Does this part help the cause?

You mention an after-mkt intake bracket. I have not come cross this (anyone have a link)?

I will search for threads on modifying the 2bbl bracket.

Thank you for jumping in to help. As I am certain you have ascertained, I am a novice.

David
 
I only ever did one swap 340 into 65 V-100 wagon. That was over 40 years ago,so I'm not up on the full deal. Others like 66fs will chime in soon.
My wagon had the pedal bolted to the floor and was a /6 so it had a funky throttle system which I had to get rid of. It also had a separate parking cable, which was cool. And a rear pump in the trans, which made bump-starting possible.
 
You can use the stock 3 piece kickdown linkage to replace the old style with the flapper that bolts to the rear of the drivers side head, if that's what you currently have! A bonus would be to get the 4 bbl top Rod from a 340 car! Yes, the annular ring for the converter snout is a must, and you can't simply change to a later converter, they have a different spline count on the input shaft!
 
The only block difference I am aware of would be the indent around the area the power steering box might occupy. Possibly clearance issues with areas of the driver's side head too, depending on the exhaust manifolding choice. Otherwise as they all said - the crank hub on the 273 is smaller. and the input shaft splines are different than the later LA engines so you can't just swap convertors. But - I think there are options to have a hybrid convertor made or located too.
 
You could consider using the 273 exh man. yes they are somewhat restrictive, but fit just like if attached to the 273 same thing. Left side 318 truck man is something to heck out. Check out posts from Triblig on exh man too. Losts of discussion to b found.
 
GreyWizard said:
Good catch and you guest correctly. I plan on purchasing an Edelbrock Performer manifold and carburetor. I would be very interested in available solutions to the throttle / kick down issue as that is exactly what I am doing.
Click to expand...

You will want to use the stock 340 4 bbl throttle cable bracket:

Mancini Racing Throttle Cable Mounting Bracket


The stock throttle cable will work...

Then you will need to lengthen the kickdown rod about 1 - 1 1/2"... Get some hex stock and thread it for 5/16 fine thread... Then get 5/16" find thread threaded rod and cut a length off to use on the front for the slotted part of the rod...
 
As far as engine swaps, the 273 and 318 are completely interchangeable... even the motor mounts are the same...
 
I admit I have forgot half what I did know. Maybe already mentioned? but the early 273 had different angle to intake hole. People no doubt fix with a grinding bur. 273 are strong running little engines when built as Ma Mopar intended, but you can be very happy with a well designed any SB mopar. Remember TC and rear gears will make the difference in happy.
 
moper said:
The only block difference I am aware of would be the indent around the area the power steering box might occupy.
Click to expand...

I believe this is the difference the builder was concerned about. I have manual steering. May I assume this is a non-issue?

Will the engine swap prevent me from installing power steering in the future?
 
GreyWizard said:
So if I order the BPE TorqueFlite Kickdown Cable Kit and the
Mancini Racing Throttle Cable Mounting Bracket I am good to go?
Click to expand...

Yes, I’m not sure what moper is talking about, there is a “dish” on the top of an early block, but I always thought it was for clearance for the DS exhaust manifold. There is one problem, and that is if you get later smog heads with the EGR ports. The head will actually hit the DS exhaust manifold and break it if you are not careful. You can grind the head and exhaust manifold to clear. Just enough or you can break into the water jacket of the head. Had to do this on “J” heads on the 273 also.
 
66fs said:
Yes, I’m not sure what moper is talking about, there is a “dish” on the top of an early block, but I always thought it was for clearance for the DS exhaust manifold. There is one problem, and that is if you get later smog heads with the EGR ports. The head will actually hit the DS exhaust manifold and break it if you are not careful. You can grind the head and exhaust manifold to clear. Just enough or you can break into the water jacket of the head. Had to do this on “J” heads on the 273 also.
Click to expand...

Good information. I specifically requested a 67-74 318 engine. Unless they toss newer heads on it, I should not need to deal with the EGR ports.

Thank you again!
 
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