318 v 360

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72DartSwingerV8

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My Dart needs an engine but I am wondering if I should get a 318 or 360. I'm looking for around 450 hp if that's possible and I don;t have a lot of money to spend. There are a few 360s I'm looking at for around $500 only 1 of which runs but I still have the stock 318 in the car at the moment. If I buy the 360 will it take as much money to get to that hp range? I just want a good street motor that won't have me on the side of the road a lot. What are some suggestions? Remember that money is an issue. College can sure tighten the wallet.
 
It'll take a bit more cam and head work to get a 318 at that power level. his may make the engines performance not so desireable since it's smaller and will act more snotty with a required higher stall converter than a 360 would need.

IMO, it would be worth spending the $500 more on a 360 or stroke the 318 with a 4 inch arm for 390 cubes. (If stroking is out, do a 360. But stroking the 318 isn't to terribly expensive once you sift through all the prices compared to a standard 360.)
 
you'll need 225cfm on the intake side of the heads, 284*+ duration, .525-.540 lift, headers, 10.2 comp minimum, 650-700cfm carb.

I don't normally say this but go with 360 heads 1.88/1.60 valves and minor bowl work, don't touch the rest of the port if you can help it.
the other direction with mag heads would be a down grade in the sense of valve train parts and flexibility, but they do have a closer matched port volume, however if you have compression like 10.2 or better w/ 360 heads and a good tune, right manifold, timing and such..you'll be good with no sacrifice to low end in comparison to the mid range & upper rpm power.jmo

the more I think about it, the more ideas I have about this 318 450hp thing.
 
It took me roller cam, and X heads to get in the low 11's with a 318, a 360 can do it and run without the 3500+ stall speed.
 
If your really wanting to build a dependable 450 hp engine that takes quite a few bucks. I normally say go with a 360 because cubes = power but since you already have a 318 you might as well use the $500 you'd spend on a 360 core to help pay for a stroker kit for the 318. By the time you pay $500 for a 360 and totally rebuild it you could have done a stroked 318 but the stroked 318 is more cubes. The only disadvantage to your 318 is heads. Your 318 heads aren't going to cut it without major (can we say lots of bucks) work. Especially if you do a stroker because they need to breath. If your truly on a college budget you might want to set your goal lower (like 375-400 hp) but that's just my opinion. 375-400 hp is alot more doable on a budget than 450 hp is and it'll drive alot better and even get some resemblance of fuel mileage on 93 octane fuel. My Cuda has a 360 putting out about 375 hp and it's a nice thumpy sounding ride that runs low-mid 13's and still gets about 14-15 mpg on 93 octane. A stroked 318 would run even a little better, except maybe the fuel mileage might not be quite as good. If you use good closed chambered heads (stock re-worked magnum's, EQ's, or RHS X heads) with a tight quench you can make it run on 89 octane at 9.5 to 1 compression. That'll help you build power and still be somewhat economical to operate.
 
Thanks for all the info guys. I forgot to mention that the current 318 needs a rebuild so the running 360 is sounding good to me. I think I am aiming too high for my budget, I would be plenty happy with 375-400hp. Am I looking at a lot of money for a 360 that makes around 375-400hp? That's a good point fishy68 about the gas mileage. I don't want to be getting under 10 mpgs either. Thanks again.
 
If you can do the work yourself that'll save a bunch. I did mine for about $1600 but I already had the 360 block and some 340 X heads. If you shop the parts for sale section here and on Moparts and a few other boards you might find a good deal on an already built 360. Just check out the buyer to make sure it's done right.

Also don't forget the engine is only one part of the package. With the 360 in mine I run a 3000 stall and 3.55 gears. When you use a cam big enough to make 375-400 hp you definitely need a loose converter or it'll be a temperamental pig. You'll also need decent gears or it'll be a dog on take off. Another thing is to use a 360 you need to either use a properly weighted 360 converter or use a B&M flexplate balanced for a 360.
 
My two cents: take it from someone who has dropped out and into college several times >> stay focused on college!! Diversions are fun but get your education finished and out of the way. You have the rest of you life to build your 450+ HP monster.
 
Good advice Clifftt, I'm currently going to USD but I live at home so when I'm not studying I have a lot of down time but now I got a Mopar to work on. I think I'm going to be patient with the build so I don;t spend too much money.

What kind of gears and rear end should I run? I currently have a 7 1/4 which aren't worth a crap so atleast an 8 1/4 is 8 3/4 better or too much?
 
I seen it last night (Car Craft) and the build didn't state cam or (Alot of things actually) or have a dyno run.

Nice write up and idea on a 318 stroker build, but it is a incomplete write up.

(Imm is in there with a noteable mention. Why to go!)
 
Why do you need 450hp? (See above post about what your priorities need to be.) If you have very limited funds, leave the 318 as is for now. replace the rear w 8 3/4 and something like 3.55s or 3.23s and add a shift kit. Then get a decent dual exh system on it. Preferably with headers. When those are done, then think about a bigger engine. or more power.
 
I don't need 450hp. I was just asking if that was reasonable but it's too high for a budget. The reason I ask is because I am going to have to rebuild the 318 anyways as it needs a lot of work. So as I have to rebuild a engine soon would I rather go for a 360 for another $500 or kepp my 318 and rebuild that?
 
Befor this car turns into a dream with an inch of dust, just get the car back on the RD. Very few kids that are going to school have the mentality to handle such a larg project as well as complete school with good grades.

Buy a running 360 and drop it in, don't start monkieing around with the engine, or tranny or diff. Drop it in and drive it and enjoy it while you are in school.

If you do this, this car will give you plenty of things to tinker with such as Tune ups, and Ignition upgrades, Body work, Interior work, etc etc.

and while you are going to school and driving this car, and tinkering around with the things that you need to tinker with, save up and buy bigger parts that would be needed for your build...Cam, Intake, Carb, headers, Distrubuter, Rad

Most of these parts you can bolt on as you are currently driving it. If you run out of money...You still have a driver instead of a pile of parts in your driveway thatyour mom wants you to do something with.

And if you are really ambitious, save up and get all the HP parts you need for your build....but don't take it apart till you have all the parts.

These projects can be discouraging in the best of times, but to a student with no money and colledge tuition its even harder.

after all, after you graduate and get that dream job, you have a car that has been there for you the whole time, and then you can take it off the RD and pamper it with all the goodies you want.

Phil
\
It's long, but truthfull. I just seee too many kids taking apart cars with big dreams, and nothing happens
 
also check you options, between this site and craig's list I have found alot of parts that I need and some I didn't but it is good to have. The guys here give alot of advise with just about anything. just over the last month I have picked alot of parts just searching and being patient. It will come around enjoy it and your life too. Have fun
 
I like the life lessons guys. I think I'm going to get the 318 running and drive the car like its stolen. I going to get some ideas together for a good 318 build and have fun. Thanks for the advice. The more the better.
 
dodgetkboy78 said:
It took me roller cam, and X heads to get in the low 11's with a 318, a 360 can do it and run without the 3500+ stall speed.
Click to expand...

You must have had some money in that 318 or must be spraying,i've never seen a 318 run low 11's without it..or the car it was in weighted next to nothing..

As for the original question start with a 360....
 
72, Regardless of the engine, the rest of the system needs to be turned a little more "perforamncy". That was my point. You could drop in a 400hp 360 and proceed to wipe the tranny and blow the rear up...lol. Or you cang et the car ready a little at a time, taking note of how each change helps the existing 318's performance, and then upgrade the engine to whatever you can afford. When I was a teenager there were many weekends I was riding in other cars because I could build power, but kept breaking things "downstream".
 
as Moper said ...upgrade the rear end...install headers and dual exhaust on car...change out the ignition....you can change out the intake and carb...with the idea that the new parts can be re-used on the 360 engine later on.
 
I totally agree with Mopers plan. The rear is probably the first thing to be addressed as it is a very weak link. Then the trans. needs some upgrading. If you just install a better rearend such as a 8-1/4 (all you really need for 400 hp) with decent gears like 3.55 or 3.73's you'll be amazed at how much better the car will run. A rearend swap sure is alot less work and cheaper than a engine rebuild too.

Watch the for sale ads on this board as well as the Moparts, FEBO, FBBO, and Cuda-challenger boards and you'll be surprised the deals you can find. It's taken me about 2 yrs. but I'm finally putting the wraps on my 408 stroker that I bought 1 piece at a time off of the for sale sections and saved a bundle. Sometimes good things take time.
 
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