318's thicker ?

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ateam

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Same sand cores as 340/360's, but smaller bores ? Building a Magnum 5.2 with mech. roller cam , "Eddy's"and steel crank. Sports car, 2,400 lbs, Dakota V6 bh. and Turbo Supra 5 spd., direct fit. Try not to chirp. Will need 7k + rpm. Ideas ? Thanks, Art.:snakeman:
 
Im with you moper...It's like another language...
 
I am truely an old fart because I don't have a clue either.
 
You guys hear of texting ? This is text posting, lol

I think he is asking if any 318 have thicker walls, maybe but only the very early ones, 1970-71, etc. No magnum motors, those are thin, thin, thin wall.

But with only 2,400lbs to push and eddy heads, I think you have gobs of power with 3.94 bores.

How your going to hook up the 5 speed trans, last I knew its not a direct fit. Hope you can get a strong enough clutch for it.
 
dont much understand either. {try not to chirp? ...WTF does that mean}
any way, no...318's were not made from 340/360 sand cores.
some, and I do mean some percentage around 25% maybe of the EARLY 67-68 318 block can be bored out to 4.00 inches and that is it. 7000 rpm?? Just get a 340 replacement block or an R-3 block. Better yet would be the 48 degree block if your really serious about spinnin some rpm's. best bet for low $ would be an early 360 block which really was made from a 340 sand core.
 
Imho,I would bore no more than .060 on any 318 block. Not because you cant,but because the motor starts running into cooling issues with heavy overbores.
 
Thicker wall, sand cast, new liner, bore equaled thickness
all realitive

All comes to, big moves, low inertia, down elephants

Give skip rope to V6bh

Turbo nice, supra nice, oil mod equals big drill down the moutain for upgraded river flow going upstream, clear all fish & chips from path

Don't chrip, wastes time on street, track and forum.
 
rumblefish360 said:
Thicker wall, sand cast, new liner, bore equaled thickness
all realitive

All comes to, big moves, low inertia, down elephants

Give skip rope to V6bh

Turbo nice, supra nice, oil mod equals big drill down the moutain for upgraded river flow going upstream, clear all fish & chips from path

Don't chrip, wastes time on street, track and forum.
Click to expand...

HAAAAAAAahahahahahaha!!!! Rumble you funny bastard!!!!! This seriously made me burst out laughing!!!!! I love the "clear all fish & chips from path" part!!!!!! hahahahaha
 
LOL, glad ya like it.

But lets be fair to the fella when he comes back.

I'll be honest, I have no idea what a v6 bh is though.
 
He is thinking all small blocks are cast the same and then machined.
 
Sorree Dudes, I thought it was an honest question, do 318's have thicker cylinder walls because of their std.3.9" bores, instead of 4"/4.04" ? True story, Dodge Dakota V6, 5.7-6.2L hemi, and our "A" motors, all have same bell housing bolt pattern. Since "certain" years of V6, stick Dakotas used asian warner trans, also direct fits the Turbo Supra 5 spd,(stong trans with good ratios).Easy to peep this layout ,on British V8 forum, eng./trans section. "No chirp", as in don't get sick over my build. LOL's all around, Art.
 
Hey Art. Glad you have agood sense of humor there. The OE message was a bit weird.

In short, no. The 318 doesn't have ticker bores. The cylinders are sleaves that are installed after it is cast. The race blocks have thicker sleaves but do start out as a ruff bore @ 3.91. They can be bored to 4.1 I beileve.

I have not seen the Supra swap in threads but have heard of this. Can you provide a link?

Also, theres little need to go to 7000 rpm since most builds, unless your installing a big cam, will quit making power by 6500 in most cases. Whatcha building?
 
If you are wondering if a 318 block can be bored out to 340, the answer is NO. Sand cores for the internal block coolant passages were not the same, nor was the external block mold, although there were many similarities.

The factory recommended maximum overbore for all production LA blocks is .030-.040. Although this may seem conservative, due to production core shift tolerances, such an overbore is considered "safe" without sonic checking cylinder thickness. Yes, in many cases you can go larger, but a point of diminishing returns id soon met.

There was a Mopar Performance "race" block sold in the late 80's which could be bored to 4.100 safely, although it was shipped bored to 3.91. The outer casting numbers on the block were even 318 production. So why was this? Simple, the blocs were cast simultaneously with 318 production blocks, and used 318 outer casting molds. However, the internal core mold was different and therefore the thicker cylinder walls. Absolutely none of these blocks were factory installed in production cars or trucks. Beware, I've seen people trying to sell production blocks as race blocks. If somebody tries to tell you that they have "one of the good blocks" out of a 88 Fifth Avenue or something like that, run away.

I don't know if my reply counts as a "chirp." I don't have a beak, although I am widely regarded as a pecker. BUT please do try to compose questions in at least passable English. You will be far more likely to receive a direct and intelligent answer if you do not insult readers with your inquiry. Furthermore, in the future people searching these forums will have a far easier time if they are not forced to wade through "web speak" or other gobbledygook.
 
Art-

Gotta agree with everyone else so far, 318's do not have thicker walls to support a 340/360 bores, you're stuck with at most a .060" overbore, and for high hp you should sonic check if you go that big.

As for the bolt pattern info its fairly well known. The Dakota V6's are just 318's minus the front 2 cylinders, and the modern hemi's are all LA block based (at least on the external dimensions). Pretty cool.

The Supra 5 speed (R154) I didn't know about. Very cool. Although I'm guessing the shifter location is pretty far from that of an A833, so it probably doesn't do much good for a Mopar application.

273 + R154 using a 3.9 bellhousing

201-0152_IMG.jpg


Here's some links about the R154 for the curious...

http://forum.britishv8.org/read.php?6,15981

http://www.slantsix.org/forum/viewt...start=15&sid=999cf2a580e0582897e4700e211a506a


This is all going in a Jensen-Healey? Even without getting to 7k it'll be a monster. My old man used to run an Austin Healey resto shop, saw a few with 289's or SBC's. It's amazing what 300-400 hp will do in an sub 2,500 lb ride. A customer had a fairly mild 289 in a 100-4, that thing would flat out fly. Hard to drive actually, it would break the rear loose and spin 'em up if you looked at it funny. Have yet to see one with a LA smallblock in it, dimensionally they're a little bigger than the Ford's or Chevy's, so it may be a tight fit.

Good luck with the project! :-D
 
could you take pics or measurments of the supra trans patern? like what holes and where i will need in a bell to make this work? i got a bell and hydro clutch set up from a early 90's truck and it is drilled for a few different trans so maby i got kinda a universal one. i havent found any 5 speeds to try to match it to tho
 
I havent seen anyone here do the supra trans swap unless I missed it? I have heard this trans is very strong,maybe even good enough to hold up to big blocks.By the looks of the pic it is reasonably small as well. Shifter might be fun to locate and hook up. Looks like some custom work would be needed.

72blunblu a friend of mine dropped a sbc in a Datsun B210 back in hischool. It was the craziest car. That short wheelbase made it fun to drive and you had to have very fast reactions or it wound up spinning etc. I would imagine a Dodge Colt to be about the same.
 
Art, THANKS FOR USING WORDS WE CAN RELATE TO...lol.

I kind of thought that's where you were going on the blocks deal. But just need to give more detail so we "get" what you're asking. Mopar blocks have some myths. One is that early 360s and 318s are inherantly thicker and therefore better. Some say you could weigh them and tell that. Well, I bought a sonic tester and that makes myth out of anything I've read. Because the guys working the foundry were either handicapable or blind. The core shift in most blocks is crazy bad and that is why some bores that according to what was designed in (like the cold weather 400 blocks and early 360s) shoudl be thicker. but when the designs were executed poorly at the foundry the cores shifted so bad many bores are thin. Test some blocks and you'll see what I mean. The shops that do bore way out sonic test first. There is no hard an fast rule as to limits. Some will barely make .020 over, some can go .120" over. I also own the Dakota bell. I still need the jeep input bearing retainer and the tranny tho. For those that don't know... That trans is a virtual bolt in 5sp unit that can take some high horsepower. I'm looking for the tranny (quietly) now. The bell was $25.
 
ateam said:
...stick Dakotas used asian warner trans...
Click to expand...
:toothy8:Sorry, I can't help myself. It's Asin-Warner, although you are not far off. Asin is Japanese manufacturer which originally produced sewing machines in the mid 1940's.
 
72bluNblu said:
Art-

Gotta agree with everyone else so far, 318's do not have thicker walls to support a 340/360 bores, you're stuck with at most a .060" overbore, and for high hp you should sonic check if you go that big.

As for the bolt pattern info its fairly well known. The Dakota V6's are just 318's minus the front 2 cylinders, and the modern hemi's are all LA block based (at least on the external dimensions). Pretty cool.

The Supra 5 speed (R154) I didn't know about. Very cool. Although I'm guessing the shifter location is pretty far from that of an A833, so it probably doesn't do much good for a Mopar application.
> . Yes presmog, 74" Jensen Healy. With 3.31" stroke steel crank, I suspect over 6,500 rpm. will tend to be limited by dual plane vs. a M1 single plane ? Motor will be dyno'd prior to install.I suspect,Jeg's 1 5/8" od. primaries, hedders may tend to limit over 6,500. Car will have a 26" tire and .78/1 in 5th., so I'm lookin for rpm. Thanks All, Art.:glasses9:
273 + R154 using a 3.9 bellhousing

201-0152_IMG.jpg


Here's some links about the R154 for the curious...

http://forum.britishv8.org/read.php?6,15981

http://www.slantsix.org/forum/viewt...start=15&sid=999cf2a580e0582897e4700e211a506a


This is all going in a Jensen-Healey? Even without getting to 7k it'll be a monster. My old man used to run an Austin Healey resto shop, saw a few with 289's or SBC's. It's amazing what 300-400 hp will do in an sub 2,500 lb ride. A customer had a fairly mild 289 in a 100-4, that thing would flat out fly. Hard to drive actually, it would break the rear loose and spin 'em up if you looked at it funny. Have yet to see one with a LA smallblock in it, dimensionally they're a little bigger than the Ford's or Chevy's, so it may be a tight fit.

Good luck with the project! :-D
Click to expand...
> Yes Jensen Healey, please see above, Art.:glasses9:
 
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