I understand. I think we're both adult enough to agree to disagree, right? If everybody had the same experiences, what a dull world we'd be livin in.
340 Gets Terrible Gas Mileage
- Thread starter Sport340
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When i said champion plugs are garbage, i meant it. Im not screwing in a couple dozen plugs a year, its over 100
And if a couple times in a year, 1 of 8 plugs fail i see it as a problem.
Not one failure until that first champion plug failed. Then twice more after that. Champion is no longer the go to plug it used to be.
Fool me once, shame on you, fool me twice, shame on me.
Liked em better when they were made in Mexico
Dan the man
Well-Known Member
Your are correct sir. I hope that the OP gets his problem resolved. Even at 62 I'm still learning new things and I truly appreciate all the help that you and others have given me here. I thank everyone
I learn somethin new everyday. I might have learned today that Champion ain't what they used to be. I'm big enough to admit I couldda been wrong. They've still worked well for me so far, though.
harrisonm
Well-Known Member
The way I understand it, we still don't know what cam is in the engine, how high compression ratio is, what gears he has, etc. Given all that, 6 MPG in town may not be all that unreasonable. I know that I get 'about' 8 MPG in town and about 15 on the road. But 1) My 340 is at about 370HP, 2) I do know what my gear ratio is 3.55, 3) I know exactly how accurate my speedometer is (it is very easy to check - call your local police department and they will be happy to hook you up with a radar gun test), and 4) I don't care what my MPG is. I love driving my car. Now if it was running really poorly, and I was getting 3 or 4 I might be upset, but if it is running well and getting 6 MPG, that is OK.
Oldiron440
Well-Known Member
That's 2 or 300 percent better than my Plymouth.....
lemondana
BlackDart
Many years ago, I started buying Champion plugs at swap meets. I've never had a failure from these made in USA plugs. As long as I have boxes of these, I will continue to use them.
Yeah I said **** it a long time ago helpin the guy. Gettin tired of pullin information outta people like pullin teeth. I say we just keep "conversatin", yo. LOL
And you may WELL have hit on the issue.
I wouldnt think twice about some old stock plugs.
Right. What yall gotta understand is, it's been years since I was on the line, so I'm not seein some of the stuff yall are since I don't do it on a daily basis any longer. I'm gettin ready to re-plug Vixen's slant 6. What do you think would be good? NGK?
Rat Bastid
Dunamis Metron
I’ve been using Champions for years. You want me to tune up your junk? It gets a Champion plug that I pick. I promise you Dan the Man I can tune. I didn’t just fall off the turnip truck.
A plug is a plug is a plug. If YOU can’t make a plug works that’s on you.
A plug is a plug is a plug. If YOU can’t make a plug works that’s on you.
S'what I've always said.
AJ/FormS
68 Formua-S fastback clone 367/A833/GVod/3.55s
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My 367 runs a square-top, Accell Supercoil, that you can practically weld with. Best coil I ever bought.The ignition system runs off a relay triggered by the key-on, so as not to pull that load thru all the usual trouble-spots.
My charging system runs at a tic over 15 volts. The Optima battery doesn't seem to mind.
Champion coppers are the bees-knees.
I worked in small-engine world for a few decades.
Here NGKs were the plug of choice. They worked ok. As long as they continued working. If they got gas-fouled, you couldn't save them. Two-stroke Snowmobilers always carried spare sets.
Champions were standard in marine engines during those years, cuz when you're fishing miles from shore...... it better run. No worse feeling than when the engine will not restart, and you've pulled yur arm off. Unless maybe if you didn't pack an oar.......
I'm with;
I think it was Smoky Yunich who once said something like;
after 6500 the plug is just there... that's over 50 sparks per second........
I suppose that's why my 367 spends a generous amount of time up there..... lol.
My charging system runs at a tic over 15 volts. The Optima battery doesn't seem to mind.
Champion coppers are the bees-knees.
I worked in small-engine world for a few decades.
Here NGKs were the plug of choice. They worked ok. As long as they continued working. If they got gas-fouled, you couldn't save them. Two-stroke Snowmobilers always carried spare sets.
Champions were standard in marine engines during those years, cuz when you're fishing miles from shore...... it better run. No worse feeling than when the engine will not restart, and you've pulled yur arm off. Unless maybe if you didn't pack an oar.......
I'm with;
I think it was Smoky Yunich who once said something like;
after 6500 the plug is just there... that's over 50 sparks per second........
I suppose that's why my 367 spends a generous amount of time up there..... lol.
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512Stroker
We are all here because we are not all there.
Dan you are dead on regarding Champion plugs
I was a Product Director for Tecumseh Engines, we used Champion plugs in every engine that went out the door 5-6 million a year. Becuse they were the cheapest $ plug available. When our Engineering lab needed to perform performance testing for Hp, emissons, etc they would use NGK plugs.
I have tried to use Champion plugs in several performance engines with the same results, I always end up going to a differant brand. They just dont seem to read or perform consistently. Its obvious that others have positive results and thats cool.
AJ/FormS
68 Formua-S fastback clone 367/A833/GVod/3.55s
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>I think NGKs have a slightly broader heat-range which seems to work better in air-cooled stuff. Liquid-cooled Sportbikes like the NGKs too.
>Marine two-strokes with a good stat, once working, run a pretty steady temperature. Plus they mostly have just two modes of operation , namely idle and WOT; (sorta like my Plymouth,lol) plus the props govern their rpm to something like 3200-4000 rpm; (unlike my Plymouth which bounces of the limiter at 7500).
>But my SBM engine, in a streeter, after it warms up, she runs at 205 to 207, no more no less.
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MopaR&D
Nerd Member
I put NGK copper-core in everything. In my experience wrenching (as a hobby) for about 14 years now I've never had a single one fail, and every one I pull out of the box looks perfectly made. And I've installed total probably about 20-30 sets in various engines, mostly cars and trucks. Super consistent and quality manufactured, they're made in Japan after all and NGK is a long-time sponsor of Formula 1 racing and supplies spark plugs and ignition parts to most (if not all) of those teams. I ran a set of NGKs for well over 10k miles (not really intentionally) in a warmed-over carb'd 360 and no failures or foul-outs. I only ever have to replace them as a time/mileage thing as part of usual maintenance. I'm sure in other conditions it might be different and I haven't yet tried them in a 2-stroke, aside from I think my parents' weed trimmer lol.
I ran a set of Autolite coppers in the 4.0L I-6 in my old Jeep, after about 2 years they had a bunch of surface rust on the steel hex section and the center electrodes had all seriously eroded to being almost non-existent. That brand is owned by FRAM which is all I need to know...
I ran a set of Autolite coppers in the 4.0L I-6 in my old Jeep, after about 2 years they had a bunch of surface rust on the steel hex section and the center electrodes had all seriously eroded to being almost non-existent. That brand is owned by FRAM which is all I need to know...
Rapid Robert
Well-Known Member
On an open diff don't you go 2 turns? or am I wrong there. RR EDIT I see someone addressed this further back
I appreciate everyone's input. Trying to sort it all out. In terms of what cam is in it I don't know. The place I bought it from did not know which one was in it. Is the only way to find out is to tear it apart? I bypassed that OSAC valve and it seemed to run better. I will keep it like that and see if it has any impact on mpg. Again I appreciate everyone's comments.
Not that invasive.
It's also not essential. You can do some systematic trial and error testng as I outlined back in post 67. One you get idle sorted, then measure the timing to figure out the advance curve it has. Then you can work on the full throttle, cruise and acceleration tuning, depending on far you want to go before you're satisfied. Described in more detail here and here.
However , if you want to get a pretty good idea of what cam duration and lift, its not that difficult.
Remove the valve cover, remove the rockers, ideally remove intake and substitute solid lifters on one intake and exhaust pair. #1 is easiest.
Then mount a dial indicator
With a degree wheel or timing tape on the damper, manally rotate the crank. Now you can measure the degrees when the valves open and close at .004 or .006 and certainly .050" lift. Also measure max lift.
RRR or someone can fill in or link to a better description.
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Thanks, but no thanks.
take rockers off put indicator at pushrod tip. remove all spark plugs.
two man job. minimal disassembly. you don't need spot on, you need an idea of the installed cam
two man job. minimal disassembly. you don't need spot on, you need an idea of the installed cam
Mattax thanks and especially post #67. I'm not a mechanic, just a guy who can do a few things on a car if needed. So I would need to get comfortable with doing what you suggest with the rockers before I would tackle. Again thanks.
RRR thanks for your previous posts (at least most of them). If you don't want to reply then just don't. Its as simple as that.
RRR thanks for your previous posts (at least most of them). If you don't want to reply then just don't. Its as simple as that.
Well as crackedback wrote, pulling the intake is not needed for your goal of learning what sort of cam is in there. Find a buddy with a dial indicator. Buy timing tape and stick it on the damper. Remove one valve cover, and the rockers on that side. You/he will need a socket and long enough ratchet or strong arm to turn the crank. Maybe you'll have to take off a fan shroud if its in the way. But really nothing too difficult.
I would like to find one that will stay on the damper. Two have flown off my new damper....
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