500ci stroker problems

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Halibut88

Halibut88

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Hey guys I am a new member and am looking for advise on a current situation I have gotten into.
I purchased a "crate motor" from a shop in North Vancouver called precision racing engines. And the motor they gave me has been suffering from valve train issues and presently broke a exhaust valve stem and kissed the piston.... it had a 1 and a half year warranty when it was purchased but this has been repaired previously for broken adjustors nut and bent push rods on the same bank. Also lots of oil has been coming out of the breather on the valve cover. Also earlier in its life we found that we were chasing valve lash and found the rocker shaft nuts to be finger tight.

The stroker kit was a 440 source product
440 source heads
440 source rocker
Solid roller motor
The current build I realize now is cheap and not ideal for street driving.


Made a bunch of power on the dyno but has been a unreliable motor.
Engine builder is now demanding the motor to be returned to his shop but I don't really think he knows what he is doing and I don't want his product anymore. Has anyone else had this experience?

Option 1
My motor is still under warranty with his shop I have that in the contract.
I just feel like I want my money back and especially now that the motor is broken needing serious repair.
I don't want his product any longer. Full refund. Lawyer can draw up a request for this. Small claim court draw out process for year.

Option 2

Fix it myself with a new engine builder and make it a hydraulic flat tappet motor
Replace damaged piston burn all 440 source products in the motor and replace with real components
Will cost me more money but may have exactly what I want to have at the end

Looking for a 600-700hp motor for built 73 challenger plum crazy for street driving on cruize night and occasionally beating on after work. Reliable,choppy idle, lay black marks at will lol

Any build suggestions or suggestions abouto how to deal with this problem please let me know.
 
What does the warranty contract actually say ? Normally you have to give the seller the opportunity to replace / repair their product . You run a car down the track and the warranty goes out the window .I was under the impression that motor was custom built to order I know the builder has been paying Grant to do the repair locally because it is easier and you didn't want to haul it back to the mainland.I would bet in a legal wrangle that will be used against you by the builder so at this point in my opinion you should drop it on the builders doorstep and say make it right . Of course that just my opinion others may vary.
 
I don't know how it is in Victoria but here you must give the company the first right of refusal to make it whole again and most warranty's are at the manufacturers discretion to repair or replace. So I don't think a refund is in your future but if you have them take care of it I would ask for a complete work order listing what was repaired or replaced and a new warranty starting from the time you get the engine back because whatever the problem is it has to be of there doing something has not been assembled correctly or not measured and set up with the proper clearances. Good Luck Whatever Happens
 
Hi guys thanks for taking the time to respond I see both your points
And agree that if I raced the motor no warranty the truth is that I haven't done anything like that. Full two year warranty or 10000 km warranty on parts and labour. That's all it says the builder wants to make it right but the problem is that it's costly to send the motor back or drive it over to his shop due to mechanical failure. It was his idea to have grant do the labour on the repair. We went along with it due to the cost of returning the motor to his shop.

The reason why all of this has happened is he didn't have enough pushrods to complete the build. As he was a year after the time of delivery he promissed. My car was finished so I told him that he has a week to finish it or I want my money back So he put in pushrods that he had on the shelf (different lengths) and color. To complete the build and take my money. Then ran it on the dyno a few times de tuned it crated it up and sent it off to me.

The different lengths of push rods loosened the rocker shaft due to vibration. So negligence is my out legally we have this documented that he put in parts that shouldn't of been there not having a full set of pushrods and just putting anything else in there damaging the motor catastrophically.
 
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Halibut88 said:
Hey guys I am a new member and am looking for advise on a current situation I have gotten into.
I purchased a "crate motor" from a shop in North Vancouver called precision racing engines. And the motor they gave me has been suffering from valve train issues and presently broke a exhaust valve stem and kissed the piston.... it had a 1 and a half year warranty when it was purchased but this has been repaired previously for broken adjustors nut and bent push rods on the same bank. Also lots of oil has been coming out of the breather on the valve cover. Also earlier in its life we found that we were chasing valve lash and found the rocker shaft nuts to be finger tight.

The stroker kit was a 440 source product
440 source heads
440 source rocker
Solid roller motor
The current build I realize now is cheap and not ideal for street driving.


Made a bunch of power on the dyno but has been a unreliable motor.
Engine builder is now demanding the motor to be returned to his shop but I don't really think he knows what he is doing and I don't want his product anymore. Has anyone else had this experience?

Option 1
My motor is still under warranty with his shop I have that in the contract.
I just feel like I want my money back and especially now that the motor is broken needing serious repair.
I don't want his product any longer. Full refund. Lawyer can draw up a request for this. Small claim court draw out process for year.

Option 2

Fix it myself with a new engine builder and make it a hydraulic flat tappet motor
Replace damaged piston burn all 440 source products in the motor and replace with real components
Will cost me more money but may have exactly what I want to have at the end

Looking for a 600-700hp motor for built 73 challenger plum crazy for street driving on cruize night and occasionally beating on after work. Reliable,choppy idle, lay black marks at will lol

Any build suggestions or suggestions abouto how to deal with this problem please let me know.
Click to expand...
Halibut88 said:
Hi guys thanks for taking the time to respond I see both your points
And agree that if I raced the motor no warranty the truth is that I haven't done anything like that. Full two year warranty or 10000 km warranty on parts and labour. That's all it says the builder wants to make it right but the problem is that it's costly to send the motor back or drive it over to his shop due to mechanical failure. It was his idea to have grant do the labour on the repair. We went along with it due to the cost of returning the motor to his shop.

The reason why all of this has happened is he didn't have enough pushrods to complete the build. As he was a year after the time of delivery he promissed. My car was finished so I told him that he has a week to finish it or I want my money back So he put in pushrods that he had on the shelf (different lengths) and color. To complete the build and take my money. Then ran it on the dyno a few times de tuned it crated it up and sent it off to me.

The different lengths of push rods loosened the rocker shaft due to vibration. So negligence is my out legally we have this documented that he put in parts that shouldn't of been there not having a full set of pushrods and just putting anything else in there damaging the motor catastrophically.
Click to expand...
after reading that,engine building is too fast on things or don't know what there doing
 
At this point I would take it back to the builder for warranty work and pay for upgrades to the parts you don't like that are in the engine. They deserve the opportunity to repair this mess in their shop. 440 Source rocker arms on a solid roller are not something I would recommend. 600-700 horsepower requires some really quality parts for survival. The 440 Source stroker kit should be no problem though.
 
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Hmm, well first off it is going to be really hard to build a reliable daily driver that makes 600-700 hp. You have to use some top dollar components especially in the valve train to make that kind of power and not require constant maintenance. If you dial your requirements back down to 500 hp or 550 hp then the task becomes much easier. And there is no reason why 440Source parts can't be used to make a 500 hp daily driver. I wouldn't use their rocker arms for that type of engine since I think the old school nodular iron rockers would be cheaper and more reliable but that is just one example. Not sure how to help you though since you have a specific problem with a specific engine and a specific engine builder. But in general, there really is no issue building a BB Mopar to crank out 500+ hp for daily driving. Just need to have the machine work and assembly correct and not get too stupid picking the cam or carb.
 
Just for reference I have a 470 inch low deck stroker sitting in my shop that makes a little over 700 hp on pump gas. This is a 10.5 compression engine with Trick Flow heads. I could drop it into my Duster and drive it around town for the next 10 years without any problem but I'd never sell it with a warranty. A lot of people would kill that engine within a few weeks if I sold it to them. All you have to do is drive down the freeway with the jetting wrong in the carb and you'll wash the cylinders and eat up the rings. Or, forget to check the lash and the valvetrain will eat itself in one 7500 rpm burnout at the burger joint.
 
AndyF hit the nail on the head we know you blasted on that motor while it had problems , don't forget I let Grant take you for a joyride in my car and I know how he is .My point to you was the warranty on a high performance motor is very limited and narrow in scope. Lets put this in terms of your business , A guy buys a new fridge , it has a bad part in it but the guy doesn't want to send it back to you so he gets you to send the parts to his buddy the repairman , next he calls you and says it's got more new problems do you offer a refund or a warranty repair for what happened or was discovered after a third party fixed it ? NFW ! The fact that he has even offered a full warranty repair in his shop by his guys on a motor of this type speaks volumes in itself , you should take advantage of his offer or you will probably find yourself in a long legal wrangle where the only winners are the lawyers.
 
I see it as you have two choices: write it all off and start with the accumulation of parts; or send it back and let him back at it. It sounds to me like he might be beyond his comfort zone with your request. So I would question his ability to meet the new goal too. But - you are connected to him via the dollars. IMO he used some parts I wouldn't have used. But everyone has their own recipe. You are asking a lot with that goal. 600 isn't to bad. 700 is harder to keep alive just as Andy said.
 
Hey guys so I spoke to the builder today and he is going to fix it I am going to let him try and straighten it out.

Andyf As I understand it you don't need to check lash everyday you drive your car. Yes more wear than hydraulic and if it was out of adjustment then I could see problems but we have been setting hot lash 5 times in 200km and always chasing on on the same valve train the same side that he put wrong pushrods into. Heavy shaft wear on the 2nd set of shafts after pushrods changed. I here your point but I am experiencing unusual amounts of wear localized to an area that he admittedly did something negligent in. So as a customer I think I am being pretty patient.

Canucky
I remember you letting me go for a ride in your car super fun car!!
And yes we may have squeaked the tires once lol. I am no saint and have had fun with the car but I strictly was nursing it. The engine builder was caught doing something wrong with the pushrods and at that time he said if I send you the correct parts can you put them in for me. To grant so as I see it he made his decision to fix it himself or sub contract the work right then. If I subbed work to somebody under my business name I am 100 percent responsible for there work. That's how it works. It's my name on the line. Anyways hopefully he does the right thing and stands behind his work. As grant didn't alter anything, he just changed component's that were send and spec from builder. Also Grant has done all this work no charge to help me so a testament to how great of a man he is.
 
moper said:
I see it as you have two choices: write it all off and start with the accumulation of parts; or send it back and let him back at it. It sounds to me like he might be beyond his comfort zone with your request. So I would question his ability to meet the new goal too. But - you are connected to him via the dollars. IMO he used some parts I wouldn't have used. But everyone has their own recipe. You are asking a lot with that goal. 600 isn't to bad. 700 is harder to keep alive just as Andy said.
Click to expand...


Hey appreciate response he is changing to pro comp magnum roller rockers
Should be a better fit in this roll. Supplier is going to send the 440nsource stuff back appearantly they have had a run of soft shafts cracking and wearing.
It dyno at 623 hp 643 trq super fun instant torque 1800 rpm like 550 ft pounds
 
Theres No question when it comes to Grants integrity and I have been hearing your story as it unfolded both with the engine and the bodyshop , it sucks you got caught up this way , I thank my lucky stars your body guy failed to get back to me in a timely fashion about doing my ICBC repair given the issues you had with them . Let the guy fix it don't try to push him just let it happen then if it goes sideways you will have the legal high ground but the fact that it was worked on outside his shop and he still is saying "bring it back I'll make it right " tells me he's not a bad guy , look at what happened to your dad with his trans did that guy say bring it back I'll make it right ? hell no Grant had to step up and redo that job as well didn't he ? I know the frustration you were feeling to get this car finished and I know you felt you had to push but sometimes things take more time than we like and we just have to ride the ride . Heck I paid for my motor in full in Feb-March and it didn't show up until 1 week before I needed to leave for Moparfest -not ideal but I got it done and made the first of 5 cross country adventure trips .

PS "squeaked the tires once" my hairy backside it had more than 1/2 a tank when I tossed him the keys and it ran out of gas in my driveway backing out of the garage the next morning LOL ! I knew exactly what to expect when I did it and I'd toss him the keys again any time he asked .
 
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