600 CFM Holley on 273

[baucco]

Susanne's Barracuda has the 273,auto,and she has put on the aluminum Wieand intake and a 4bbl Holley and now her mechanic says the 600 will not work. I bought the carb and intake set-up from someone here who was also running it on a 273,65 Barracuda S. what do I need to do to make this work? Can the Holley 600 be dialed down to work well? What's the worst that could happen if she runs this? Thanks,Dan

 

[Longgone]

Why does the mechanic say it will not work? CFM, linkage, air cleaner opening size, intake bolt angle?

 

[alan627b]

600 cfm ought to be fine on a 273. Does the wrench say why it won't work? Too rich/lean, clashes with the interior?
Unless it won't physically fit the intake, which an adapter would fix, what is the problem? Holleys usually require a throttle lever extension to hook to the kickdown linkage on automatic cars, but that isn't expensive.
Hell, 80's 318 4V cars used an 800 cfm Thermoquad, it's just a matter of tuning the secondaries. The engine will only use what it needs, the rest is a jet change away...
Let us know what the nature of the problem is, I'll bet we get you through it!
Alan627B

 

[C130 Chief]

An 1850 (or electric choke equivalent) should be about perfect out of the box. At least your mechanic has the integrity to admit he is dumber than a carburetor. Most don't.

 

[rumblefish360]

The only thing I can say for the carb is that the mechanic thinks it is too large CFM wise. It is alot for a small engine and if it is a regular 273, I see his point. Something like a Edel. 500 would be more fitting CFM wise. If the engine is hopped up, the 600 would be better than the 500 cfm carb.

A note on the adapter plate is the additional height and hood clearance. The linkage adapter is a cheap part and easy to do.

No matter the size of the carb, tuning the carb to deliver the correct amount of fuel is a crital issue. The actual air flow isn't, but has a play in the driveabilty and throttle response of the engine.

You mechanic is probably concerned with those two issues if anything.
It can be done.

 

[baucco]

Hi Guys, Thanks for all responses. Here's the thing,He's not MY mechanic. I did all of the heavy lifting on this car last year.Worked on it night and day for 3 months,sometimes 12 hrs at a time. It had sat for 9 years without moving.I got it running,rewired the whole thing,suspension,body,paint etc. I had some help from a great mechanic on the fine tuning issues,but for this being only my second project,it looked really good and was on the way to being great. Then we found out that the major problem was the carb that we had on it was missing the lifter spring and gasket for the jet. We replaced it with another,same problem,this one,bought from AAAA Carbs in TX. Supposedly,professionally rebuilt. I bought the holley 4bbl/600 with the matched intake,cam and lifters from a member here who had been running it on his 65 Commando S Barracuda. Jump forward a few months and this guy comes along and tells Susanne that he is The Second rated mechanic in the country! He works for Mopar Top Fuel racing team,Antron Brown's Matco car. He looks at the car and tells her she should put on the Holley and Weiand intake and also that she needs to switch to electronic ignition.No argument there,that's why I bought the set up,and the ignition was on our list when money allowed.At he time I was trying to stay within a very tight budget. He then proceeds to tear out wiring,cutting off the new wires and leads that I had put in,so he could set it up for"race wiring". Cuts off the oil pressure line to the new gauge I had installed. Took the Holley to clean and rebuild,which he never did,and installs the new intake,but not the matching cam and lifters that were nearly brand new. Now after all of that ,he tells her that the carb won't work,and she has to buy a 390 cfm,which I understand is a good size for this engine,but she is out of money and is frustrated that she has only driven this car once and he has been working on it off and on for months.As it sits now,he has installed the electronic ignition and one of the chrome valve covers we bought for it,the othe he has taken home to grind out a spot where the coil is too close,since he moved it.He won't be back for a least a month or two,so there the car sits and she won't be driving it at all this year.He didn't say specifically why the carb wouldn't work,only that it would blow up the engine. He also didn't notice it was a 600 the entire 2 months that he had the thing,waiting until the new intake was on to realize that,oh,this won't work. Susanne is freaking out now and just wants to be rid of the car because her budget simply won't allow her to spend any more money. Sorry for the long rant guys but this has got me pretty well steamed and I know the set-up should be fine,I just need to know what I can do here. Thanks for leting me vent and any advice would be most appreciated. Dan

 

[Longgone]

The electronic ignition is a good swap for the point type distributor. To incorporate it a lead has to be cut (or adapted) so a plug can be spliced into the wiring harness. I don`t know why your mechanic would cut the oil pressure gauge wire unless again the plug was incompatible. Many replacement intakes do not provide a place to mount factory coils so it`s up to the user to find a convenient place to put them. I would think an Edelbrock 500 cfm would work well on your 273 without any great modifications. I have one on mine and it works without a hitch. The one thing that many customers of auto mechanics seem to overlook is to get a written estimate of the work to be performed, the price, and the time it`ll take for the job to be completed. With those things worked out in advance there are fewer surprises later.

 

[toolmanmike]

Too bad this guy thinks he's a mechanic. He doesn't have a clue. What is the
original drivability complaint. If you have a car that's been setting for years
just tune up what you have and make it run again. Don't change everything
and expect the best results. And if this guy is just cutting and snipping stuff under the hood I'd slam the hood on his head!! toolmanmike

 

[rumblefish360]

Well, I'd shoot this guy first, second, pick up a wrench and a few good books.

Where are you located? Maybe there is a member in the area that wouldn't mind helping.

 

[grimreaper]

I ran a 1850AAS Holley on a basically stock 273 for 30 years with no issues. The only modification the car had was the carb, an Offenhauser 360 degree Dual Port intake manifold and a chrome air filter. I also had a slightly larger exhaust pipe made to replace the original and a long glasspack when the original pipe/muffler rusted out. It took a few jet changes and spark plug checks to get the carb dialed in but once that was accomplished it ran well with absolutely no driveability issues. Your mechanic may need a drug test.........

 

[furz4]

I agree with all the others a 600 holley is a bit large for a 273 but it's a vacume secondary carb those secondaries are only going to open as far as the air flow demands anyway. A holley is the easiest carb to tune there is, like grimreaper said a couple of jet changes and you should be dialed in pretty easily. I have ran 750's with vacume secondaries on 318's with no drivability issues at all. In fact the 318 4BBL during the early 80's used 800 CFM thermoquads. Where are you located, am sure we would have a member here who could help get the car going and running just fine. Get your parts back from the super mechanic and don't let him touch the car again. He is clueless. If you can put the car together you can read up on the tuning process and do it yourself. I did my first distributor re-curve and carb tune when i was 16 and my 70 roadruner was supertuned to go 10 mph slower in the quarter.

 

[baucco]

Hey guys,thanks again for all of your help and encouragement. I knew from the start that it could be done. The problem is that since Susanne and I are no longer "in a relationship" I can't get near the car to finish it. Super mechanic just showed up on the scene and decided it was his project.I'm confident that I could have had this car on the road months ago,but he had already started in on it,undoing the work I had in it. I just need to convince Susanne that it can be done without this guys help. I'm sure he had ulterior motives for volunteering and now that he realizes that he won't be seeing any fringe benefits from doing the work he will be very scarce. So,my question is,where should I look for info on the throttle cable modification and brackets? What else should I be looking into as far as making this thing work? I'm in S. Indiana and if any members with this sort of knowledge want to come down and help make this happen quicker I'd be glad for the help.Dan

 

[baucco]

Pictures of the linkage set up and proper brackets would be a huge help if anyone else happens to be running this same set up. To answer Toolmanmike's question'the original driveability problem with the old 2bbl was that it was missing the jet lifter spring and cup,so it was bogging and dying uphill and when you put your foot in it. Thanks again guys!