A Holley-Edelbrock debate

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gliderider06

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Curiosity has me...
A debate between a Holley 80457-8 (600 cfm) vs. Edelbrock 1406 (600 cfm) carbs. Box stock carbs on a nearly stock small block engine. Both aluminum bodies, electric choke and somewhat economy calibration from the manufacturer.
Would there be any advantage/disadvantage using one or the other? Drivability, fuel mileage, performance etc... or just a moot point of a personal preference?
 
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Curiosity has me...
A debate between a Holley 18457-8 (600 cfm) vs. Edelbrock 1406 (600 cfm) carbs. Box stock carbs on a nearly stock small block engine. Both aluminum bodies, electric choke and somewhat economy calibration from the manufacturer.
Would there be any advantage/disadvantage using one or the other? Drivability, fuel mileage, performance etc... or just a moot point of a personal preference?
:popcorn::lol:

I think Edelbrock carbs are easier to tune but Holley has more options. (which can be a bit overwhelming to most people)
 
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More a matter of which better matches the intake manifold.
As far as calibration and economy, both may need to be tuned to actually achieve that.
 
This is my 2 cents and my own personal general rule as to what has worked well for me over the years:
Street driven car- go with Edelbrock. Why? reliable and very easy to tune.
Drag Racing - go with Holley Why? they make more power than Eddy's but I never liked how they acted around town.

Just my experience.
 
Back when I understood less about carb tuning using an edelbrock was easier to get an engine running.
 
Carbs I have had on my 340 are. 750 dp, 750 vs, eddy 750 and holley 600 vs. The best for 1/4 was 750dp. The best for mileage and drivability was the holley 600. The 600 was also second fastest. Less than a 10th slower.
 
Curiosity has me...
A debate between a Holley 18457-8 (600 cfm) vs. Edelbrock 1406 (600 cfm) carbs. Box stock carbs on a nearly stock small block engine. Both aluminum bodies, electric choke and somewhat economy calibration from the manufacturer.
Would there be any advantage/disadvantage using one or the other? Drivability, fuel mileage, performance etc... or just a moot point of a personal preference?

For Street and your parameters: Edelbrock for easy metering Rod/spring changes, only need to pull the top for jet changes, vs. draining bowls of the Holley, going through gaskets regardless of using the blue non-stick ones as Eventually you’ll tear one or they delaminate, residual fuel spilling onto intake all to change jets, or power valve. Of course once you have both dialed in then as far as maintenance
cleaning issues I’d take the Edelbrock again.
Less Sources of possible leaks? Edelbrock.
Ability to modify or upgrade the actual carb? Holley: Add a Metering block for secondaries, metering block mods for bleeds, restrictors etc. Just more that can be done with the Holley if desired. For a streeter, new carb, I like the composite body Street Demon but the quality is not as good as the Edelbrocks, but of those two (Holley or Edelbrock) I’d grab an Edelbrock AVS
 
If I had to buy a new carb, I'd be looking at a Edelbrock AVS 2 or a Street Demon, TQ knock off. I never liked Holleys on the street. Did a search on that Holley, list number and nothing came up.
 
I dispute the part about Eddies being easy to tune . Maybe if your engine is really close to stock and pulls 18+ inches of vacuum at idle . But they are a PITA if you have any kind of cam . I would rather pull the bowls off a Holley than jack around with all the little screws and micro-clips on the Eddie. Then there is the parts availability... try to buy any part other than a metering rod or jet for an Eddie.
That being said I run an AVS-2 800 on my Barracuda because I like the annular boosters . Took me forever to get sorted out though .
And I run a Pro Systems Holley on the 408 in the Swinger .
 
If I had to buy a new carb, I'd be looking at a Edelbrock AVS 2 or a Street Demon, TQ knock off. I never liked Holleys on the street. Did a search on that Holley, list number and nothing came up.
Oops... 80457-8. I fixed the post. Had a 5yr old chatterbox next to me as I was typing.
 
I dispute the part about Eddies being easy to tune .
Just to be clear: I’m talking easy to “change”. Tuning is in ones ability “typically” but once straying from stock (or near) as you mention there’s enough consensus that I’ve see. to confirm what you say about the Edelbrocks. I run a Holley on my strip/street ride ( modified AED 750 DP) no Edelbrock for me!
 
My Ramcharger currently has a 1406 eddy on it. Been great actually. First one I have used and pleased thus far in the 10,000 miles that I have on it. Just came across the new Holley 80457 and was thinking about switching just to see and for something to do. My only complaint on the Edelbrock is the choke when I first start when cold. It needs a mid step from high idle to low idle. This is where the Holley may have the advantage.
Maybe I will go change it today and then again I should just leave well enough alone...
 
Automatic chokes are one of the trickiest systems to set up.
 
I wish Eddie would sell components like boosters and various weights individually. I think a 1405 or 1406 with annular boosters would be the cats meow for a daily driver .
 
Automatic chokes are one of the trickiest systems to set up.
They are a little tricky. I wish the electric chokes has a primary pull off. Crack that butterfly open as soon as the engine runs.
 
Agreed ... The choke on my AVS-2 is all wacked no matter where I adjust it . Is there a secret procedure to setting one ?
Not that I know of!
@toolmanmike mentioned one of the critical parts of the puzzle. If it doesn't pull open to a 'qualifying' position when the engine starts running, that's a major design failing. The best we can do then is set the choke close to where it runs well after starting. The give it some extra pump shots before starting - how much or how little depends on how cold the engine is.
Manual chokes on these aftermarket carbs aren't so great either. The linkage to the fast idle is hard to get them where we think is right. End up using our foot to control the throttle.
 
I wonder why people continue to use the Edelbrock Performer series when the AVS2 series is obviously an updated improved version.
 
Here's what I've learned about how an automatic choke is supposed to work. You'll have to investigate whether the carbs you've got has all the features.

Initial Choke position: This is where the plate sits when the engine off. Its the maximum restriction to the carb entry.
Qualified Choke position: Plate position immediately upon starting.
* It's opened by manifold vacuum.
* The amount it opens is usually adjusted by increasing or decreasing the spring force on a vacuum diaphram.
* Usually the linkage is such that the qualified position is based on the initial position, not independent.
* It does not effect the throttle fast idle position.

Fast idle cam has two or three steps. In warmer weather the cam's linkage to the choke should rotate it off the upper step(s) pretty quick.
* There may be a way to have the choke 80% open and still have the cam rotated so the throttle is on the second step.

Some carbs have internal vacuum source connection to the choke. They may or may not have a means of adjustment if its internally connected. Some carbs don't have any vacuum source. I think the only solution for them is set the choke for the running position and use pump shot from working the throttle to get it rich enough to fire off.

My own preference is for the choke bimetal to be getting heat from the intake since the intake's temperature is what matters. But that's too complicated for aftermarket carbs so that's not a realistic choice in most cases.

So the thing usually missing from an aftermarket carb choke is a means to directly relate to the temperature of the engine and intake manifold. This a factroy Motorcraft 2150 for an AMC 360 but the concepts are the same.
upload_2022-1-23_21-31-1-png.png

Instead of piping heat up to the choke bimetal, Chrysler usually linked to the bimetal coil, which was placed in the intake manifold.
from the Chrysler Tech pamphlets.
upload_2022-1-23_21-47-2-png.png


upload_2022-1-23_21-44-14-png.png


pamphlet here: More About Carburetors (Session 223) from the Master Technician's Service Conference
 
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I don't normally run chokes, and if I do its manual choke anyways. Both carbs can be set up to work just fine. "Box-Stock" carburation is for the birds... every carb will need some tuning/adjusting for the engine. I own both eddies and holleys now, and have a bunch in the past as well.
 
Curiosity has me...
A debate between a Holley 80457-8 (600 cfm) vs. Edelbrock 1406 (600 cfm) carbs. Box stock carbs on a nearly stock small block engine. Both aluminum bodies, electric choke and somewhat economy calibration from the manufacturer.
Would there be any advantage/disadvantage using one or the other? Drivability, fuel mileage, performance etc... or just a moot point of a personal preference?
A bit may also be what the engine is lacking in terms of hot rod parts and the power it makes. I have had a 600-1860 and a Edelbrock 600 on a LD4B/318-904-3.21 set up and both performed exactly the same. Zero difference. Same mileage. No track time.
 
I think they're both so lean it's pathetic. You either have something bone stock or real close under um if you're think about either one.
 
I think they're both so lean it's pathetic. You either have something bone stock or real close under um if you're think about either one.
I can attest to that with a 650 AVS2 on a street dominator with headers. I never did get the secondary side richened up to where it needed to be before I decided to go with a spread bore double pumper. The primary side responded well to one size up on jetting and then next smaller size metering rod, which is more than a little increase. I did have to put stiffer springs in from the tuning kit for the high idle vacuum (around 16 inches, leftover stock vacuum and lift rule limited oval track cam).
 
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