Well, I'm already $5,500 into my build in collecting parts, so I'm pretty well wiped cash-wise at the moment. But if you have contact info I'll shoot him a message. (PM)
A833 4-Speed on a 4-500hp 440: 18 or 23 Spline Necessary?
- Thread starter ToMang07
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j par
Well-hung Member
My message was clear in post # 11...
You are, not him. The caption with the picture should be read and understood that it took a lot it f power.
daliant
Befuddled
A soft-loc clutch will probably let any of those transmissions survive... but they are a little pricey.
weedburner
Well-Known Member
If your PP is a hi-clamp Borg & Beck with roller assist, it's going to hit pretty hard after a wot shift. Not the best thing for a 23 spl input.
An NA street/strip 440 probably puts out around 575ft/lbs. The 23 spl input should be good to 800ft/lbs +, but the torque output of the engine isn't a meaningful number for determining how much torque the transmission's input shaft will see in a wot drag race setting. The engine might have a 575ft/lb torque peak, but if the clutch has 800ft/lb capacity, the result of sidestepping the clutch is going to be 800ft/lbs being passed along to the transmission's input shaft. That's because even though the engine only makes a maximum of 575 ft/lbs of torque by itself, installing a clutch with 800ft/lbs of capacity behind it makes it possible for the clutch to borrow an additional 225ft/lbs of inertia energy from the rotating assy. Hitting the input shaft with an additional 225ft/lbs might sound like a good thing to get the car moving, but that borrowed inertia energy must then be paid back so the car doesn't actually gain anything from the extra hard hit.
Ideally, try to match your clutch's ultimate capacity as close to your engine's peak torque output as practically possible. Having a minimal amount of excess clutch capacity minimizes the hit on your transmission's input shaft, it also minimizes the amount of bog that you will see when you launch.
Grant
An NA street/strip 440 probably puts out around 575ft/lbs. The 23 spl input should be good to 800ft/lbs +, but the torque output of the engine isn't a meaningful number for determining how much torque the transmission's input shaft will see in a wot drag race setting. The engine might have a 575ft/lb torque peak, but if the clutch has 800ft/lb capacity, the result of sidestepping the clutch is going to be 800ft/lbs being passed along to the transmission's input shaft. That's because even though the engine only makes a maximum of 575 ft/lbs of torque by itself, installing a clutch with 800ft/lbs of capacity behind it makes it possible for the clutch to borrow an additional 225ft/lbs of inertia energy from the rotating assy. Hitting the input shaft with an additional 225ft/lbs might sound like a good thing to get the car moving, but that borrowed inertia energy must then be paid back so the car doesn't actually gain anything from the extra hard hit.
Ideally, try to match your clutch's ultimate capacity as close to your engine's peak torque output as practically possible. Having a minimal amount of excess clutch capacity minimizes the hit on your transmission's input shaft, it also minimizes the amount of bog that you will see when you launch.
Grant
my bud is a saltflat racer , not a member here . these were the one tranny's that would hold up to foot on the floor n grab'n gears behind a 800-1000hp hemi's . 392 with + 30 lbs boost from a 14-71 on that hemi 4spd mga with 18'' added to the length went 265+mph on 5 mile course on the salt . his twin turbo'd twin 500 caddy liner went better then 300 mph same course . could not back it up , do to a body fire from turbo heat . nearly took him before he got it wow'd up , benders only , parasute burnt off do to the flames trailing the car . new design on the new one .
any special reason the Hurst shift handle was put on backwards? just wondering...
AJ/FormS
68 Formua-S fastback clone 367/A833/GVod/3.55s
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Just don't sidestep the clutch at peak torque! How hard is that?They will take 450 ft lbs all day every day. When you get your dyno graph, just look at what rpm that occurs, and try to to not go much higher. I mean on the street this is,for me, a ridiculous thing to do . My engine torque peaks at a little north of 4000 maybe 4200. I have never yet sidestepped her there in 17 years,on the street.
Or build a little slip into the clutch below 3000say. That's not hard to do
Or put the 23 spl in, and put a 7290 joint in the back, and a driveshaft loop. The day you pop the joint is the day to move up to the 18spl, and to a 1350 U-joint.
Or buy a spare tranny.They are not a lot of money.
Or run a super low starter gear.
IDK maybe a Tremek, I heard they have huge torque handling capabilities.
Or build a little slip into the clutch below 3000say. That's not hard to do
Or put the 23 spl in, and put a 7290 joint in the back, and a driveshaft loop. The day you pop the joint is the day to move up to the 18spl, and to a 1350 U-joint.
Or buy a spare tranny.They are not a lot of money.
Or run a super low starter gear.
IDK maybe a Tremek, I heard they have huge torque handling capabilities.
well that handle was put on iy as he ran them in this cars , its a bolt on type with comp plus shifter linkage box . if thats an issue it can be unbolted . and your setup put on .
AJ/FormS
68 Formua-S fastback clone 367/A833/GVod/3.55s
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You got some great memories, and they make awesome stories. I'm always eager to hear them. I thought 140 was fast. I can't imagine 265, or 300, or even just 160
ajforms , butch as he called , is one gutt'zy racer , builds all his own stuff , chassis , brackety , mounts , finals on every part of anything from the engine or engines , he'll send out the basics for builds , blowers , turbos , lower ends , does all his own head porting n guides and valves . he used up a lot of old racers stuff from boat n digger guys some years back . he likes building stuff , never seen him , not just because on anything from a custom deck with drawers , all metal frome and slides clad over with oak then stained n cleared , bookselfes the same way . from floor tom ceiling . he's just finishing up a 46 ford ton n half . modified from grille to custom bumpers . build it into a p/u 10'' bed , got a 500 cad tb400 with a gv od 3:54 r/e dana 60 locker type diff . adapted ford f250 hd brakes , and dropped to down about 6'' i think . we'll see after its all there together again . he had a 300 ford 6 , put three side draft webers on it build a header . we did a top stick ford gear box , cj jeep stick n top plate with forks mounts on the ford top loader three speed . and then dropped that package into a 37 chev biz couple , and again his builds are trick from bumper to bumper . got a few pics of a 38 ford he built with stuff he had lying around his shop . just to sell this car , what a barn find build he did . you tell me , take a gander at these . oh and i can't wait for him to get back on his twin hd twin turbo'd liner bike . ya more to come !
hey aj/forms , there is a couple pics in the chrysler magazine ''performance for the chrysler car enthuslast'' july-august 1991 the feature is called ''kings of the salt''on page 49 . there are a couple pics and a description of the mga with the blown 354 in it , went 222.233 mph on gas set a record . but he don't stop at that , kept on it , plant'd a blown 392 in it to get passed 260 mph on gas . and the next pages 51 , have my friends liner , charley markey of the market brothers . that a destroked 291 desoto to 260 ci blown on fuel made 1000hp , went over 300mph . one of my saltflats engines is a desoto 291 with the same head work and roller cam design n profiles . both butch and charley are great guys and a wealth of info n knowledge . just lucky i guess to meet up with these guys and be able to call them my friends .
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