Add 273's, 340's & 360's to the "318 Race" ?

yes, i would enter AND post a pass with...

  • Total voters
    29
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Weight Heads cam gear and stall id would think would be the major factors. Not so much cubic inch. 400 hp 273 vs a 400 hp 360 really should be a tie if weight and hook up is similar and geared and stalled proper.
 
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Wish my 66 was set up for abuse to the 833. I wouldn't mind running it through the 1/4. It's not fast but it feels like it is! Lol
 
273 said:
Weight Heads cam gear and stall id would think would be the major factors. Not so much cubic inch. 400 hp 273 vs a 400 hp 360 really should be a tie if weight gears stall and hook up is similar.
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Thanks, and the penalty box pretty much takes care of the weight, heads, cams, stalls, gears etc etc. For the 318 race, if you look at the penalty box in the link I posted, it even gave back some E.T. for wind resistance for Vans/Pickups. Will it ever be perfect? NO WAY. But I hope to get it close enough that all would have a chance. J par, last year, was the best example of having the penalty box work against him... LOL but he and we all had a blast with it.
  • I bet most folks that play would be normal street cars. Just typical stuff. Most have never had their car on a dyno, and have no facts of actual horsepower. So this year, a stock 273 with an aftermarket 4bbl wouldn't have to run the same E.T. as a 360 with an aftermarket 4bbl. It's just this year, we'll have to figure out what to allow for deductions for the added small blocks.
 
toolmanmike said:
Wish my 66 was set up for abuse to the 833. I wouldn't mind running it through the 1/4. It's not fast but it feels like it is! Lol
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Look, I know you are pretty close to Earlville, and you have a nice 4 lane highway to get there... :D Don't have to be fast, not in this race. A 273 2bbl just may be the winner..
 
318willrun said:
My thought was this......
If it's a 3.31 stroke, it shouldn't have a bigger bore than 4.10 (340 bored .060 over). And, if it's ANY bore over the stock 4.04 bore of a factory 340, then it automatically gets a .4 tenths deduction. So, my question is this: Is there a gain in performance using the X block IF it's, per say, a 340 cubic inch?? IF so, we can equalize the gain with a deduction of E.T. index...???
  • Keep in mind, this isn't about the money, because those that spend it on high end performance are taking hits in the penalty box. Truly, a factory stock 318 2bbl in a pickup truck can be the winner. That's what makes this fun, honesty and a chance that every participant could be the winner! (Remember, it's all in fun :) )
Open to thoughts...... from all ?????
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I don't even have 4 bolt caps on my X block. Bore is 4.040 so the only advantage is I can spin it up and still have ring seal and not worry about the block being weak.
 
I believe my 318 will be even better than last year, with a smaller carb and lighter wheels. And now is posing as a 340 car. I went 7.56 in the 1/8 mile on January 1

Duster 318.jpg
 
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And Folks, I present you Last Years 318 Race Winner! Mr. 65Vsignet ! Ran a 12.2 on a 12.2 index :)
duster-318-jpg.jpg
 
318willrun said:
Look, I know you are pretty close to Earlville, and you have a nice 4 lane highway to get there... :D Don't have to be fast, not in this race. A 273 2bbl just may be the winner..
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I am about 4 miles from Cedar Falls Motorsports park. My 4 speed and clutch doesn't like to be abused.
 
toolmanmike said:
I am about 4 miles from Cedar Falls Motorsports park. My 4 speed and clutch doesn't like to be abused.
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You must have something.... (I don't think you'd hurt your 4 speed...). ????
Looks like there are a lot of interest, and we may have a race for 2018. IF so, I'll probably enter about 5 vehicles with small block mopars.... 4 360's and 1 318 :D LOL.....

Durango? Ram? Ram Van???? We all have someth'n... LOL...
 
Well, as for the X block reducing ET’s or making more power, it doesn’t. The block is actually heavier than stock blocks. The benefit of the X block is strength and bore sizes available.

The reasons I stated above for the X block are not to knock anybody out but to say it is not a inexpensive route and actual cid size.

Would anybody here cheat on the engines cid? :rolleyes:
I would hope not....

Making use of the X block requires a lot of money just in its purchase. Then you need everything else. I’m sorry, but I can’t see running stock heads on a 3K-3.5K-ish block price. (New)
Unless NASCAR rules demand it.

I don’t want to squeeze yellow rose out of the competition just on this along. Nothing against him. I do like the idea that this whole entire idea is “cheap.“
 
273 said:
Weight Heads cam gear and stall id would think would be the major factors. Not so much cubic inch. 400 hp 273 vs a 400 hp 360 really should be a tie if weight and hook up is similar and geared and stalled proper.
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Incorrect, why, you forgot the torque advantage. :poke:
 
rumblefish360 said:
Well, as for the X block reducing ET’s or making more power, it doesn’t. The block is actually heavier than stock blocks. The benefit of the X block is strength and bore sizes available.

The reasons I stated above for the X block are not to knock anybody out but to say it is not a inexpensive route and actual cid size.

Would anybody here cheat on the engines cid? :rolleyes:
I would hope not....

Making use of the X block requires a lot of money just in its purchase. Then you need everything else. I’m sorry, but I can’t see running stock heads on a 3K-3.5K-ish block price. (New)
Unless NASCAR rules demand it.

I don’t want to squeeze yellow rose out of the competition just on this along. Nothing against him. I do like the idea that this whole entire idea is “cheap.“
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My thought too, rumble, and I agree, there really are no advantages IF they keep the cubic inches in compliance. That's why I did not have a problem with the X block being a part of it.
  • However, nowhere was the 318 race about "cheap" or "low dollar". It was about "cheap and low dollar" or even "pure stock" can compete, and win, as well as high dollar builds. Example: Eddy heads are welcome, but last year they had to deduct 8 tenths for having them.
  • A car like Yellow Rose (which I know nothing about his car), may very well have a 11.60 Dial Index, and if he only goes 12.2 he is negative 6 tenths, and a guy with a 318 2bbl pickup may have a 17.2 Dial Index, and run a 17.3, he is only negative 1 tenth, and he would be ahead of Yellow Rose in the Standings.
 
Last note, do not include all engines into one but keep displacements to there own group. Everybody will see how well they perform once posted.
 
rumblefish360 said:
Last note, do not include all engines into one but keep displacements to there own group. Everybody will see how well they perform once posted.
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Please explain. Do you mean 360's against 360's, 340's against 340's, 273's against 273's? I have a full time job, ya know... LOL :D Seriously, that would be a lot of penalty boxes and brackets to keep track. I would rather keep them all under one chart, and see J par's "more purposeful 4x4 truck" be ahead of Yellow Roses 340 X block Dart Sport in the standings LOL hahahaaaha
 
I always wanted to take the cuda to the track but new it wouldn't do well lol.
Hopefully get the new build done in time.
1/4 mile only or 1/8 too?
 
4spdragtop said:
I always wanted to take the cuda to the track but new it wouldn't do well lol.
Hopefully get the new build done in time.
1/4 mile only or 1/8 too?
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1/4 mile. Really don't want to break the penalty box down for 1/8 runs, I hope you understand.
 
Just read the penalty box.

So you thinking of something like .2 or .3 for a 340 short block over 318 and another .2 or .3 for 360 ?
 
273 said:
Just read the penalty box.

So you thinking of something like .2 or .3 for a 340 short block over 318 and another .2 or .3 for 360 ?
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LOL... you must have something other than a 318??? :poke: I was thinking something of deducting about .4 for a 340, and .5 for a 360. But, a lot of guys think a 340 is better than a 360, so maybe .5 for both?? I do know all else being equal, especially in street cars, I'd expect a 360 to at least have a half a second over a 318 (all else being equal). Along this line, I was thinking on giving about .5 to the 273's..??? Just my thought, but I'm open for suggestions.
  • Just got to make sure the 360 guys aren't building the penalty box :D LOL...
 
318willrun said:
LOL... you must have something other than a 318??? :poke: I was thinking something of deducting about .4 for a 340, and .5 for a 360. But, a lot of guys think a 340 is better than a 360, so maybe .5 for both?? I do know all else being equal, especially in street cars, I'd expect a 360 to at least have a half a second over a 318 (all else being equal). Along this line, I was thinking on giving about .5 to the 273's..??? Just my thought, but I'm open for suggestions.
  • Just got to make the 360 guys aren't building the penalty box :D LOL...
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I was just guessing the numbers a point a .5 would put me at 12.80 I think with a 68 Valiant 380hp create engine 727 2800 stall and manual shift body and 2.96 gears.
Not sure of weight and altitude

I would give the 340 a slight break over the 360.
 
This all for fun? What if we each bought a "trinket" from the track we ran at and threw it in a pot for prizes? Limit the $$ value
 
4spdragtop said:
This all for fun? What if we each bought a "trinket" from the track we ran at and threw it in a pot for prizes? Limit the $$ value
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I'm listening.... :D However, to promote honesty (how do we know everyone's build, motor, gears?... just trust), last year we offered nothing but a round of applause... :) All prizes, or anything of value, even for fun, could cause me a lot of grief on how they are cheated on the penalty box, and how it's wrong.. LOL. I heard some of that last year. Then, there is "who will handle the prizes"? And the "so and so is cheating"....

Just be careful when you think of prizes, I really think a round of applause will keep it honest, and FUN! ...... but I'm listening
 
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318willrun said:
Good topic, and thanks for bringing it up. Is there an advantage if the cubes are no larger than a 340 +.030 or .060? Should there be an "extra" deduction for the X block? Without arguing, let's let others chime in....
And rumble, let's us know why?
And Yellow rose, let us know why?
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If someone is running an X block or a stock block way overbore instead of the .020-.040 clean up. Should be judged on a case by case. But a .040 and under is like 5-7 cid difference. A 360 42 cubes over 318 and is worth .5 wouldnt that make 5-7 cid about .06 ? Could round it to 1 or none.
 
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