amp meter

[cannucky]

took the car for a short trip to the gas station after a tuneup and the amp meter started spiking when I rev the car , it tops out at like 1800 rpm so I am thinking the 8 year old alternator or the 7 year old battery has gone bad whatr do you guys think ? 69 upgraded to electronic ignition - black box , super coil etc... car starts and runs fine but the guage is acting like a tach and I am afraid of burning the harness or worse .

 

[67Dart273]

Could be battery, or regulator, or wiring. Unlikely to be the alternator

Do you have the old style single wire field, or the newer isolated field (two field connections?)

Make absolutely certain that the regulator is GROUNDED

If the regulator IGN terminal is suffering voltage drop it will overcharge.

 

[cannucky]

Could be battery, or regulator, or wiring. Unlikely to be the alternator

Do you have the old style single wire field, or the newer isolated field (two field connections?)

Make absolutely certain that the regulator is GROUNDED

If the regulator IGN terminal is suffering voltage drop it will overcharge.

Not sure which alternator it is it has 2 wires to spade connectors and 1 heavier black to a stud on the back , I have been starting the car and running it for only a minute or 2 quite a bit along with bumping the starer with a trigger switch while running the valves , the car normally parks the needle on the bottom edge of the wide mid bar on the guage when it is shut off and jumps to about the 3/4 mark when I start the car and eases back to the dead center of the wide mid bar in about 10 seconds of running , I got in and started it after filling up and noticed it moving and gingerly drove it home trying to only rev it up to speed then idle where it holds at 3/4 now after spiking to top when I press the pedal , I checked and cleaned the 2 engine grounds and both the battery terminals as well as inspecting the connections on the alternator .

 

[67Dart273]

One thing you can do to run it a bit for moving it or whatever is to disconnect the blue field wire. That should stop it from charging.


Do some quick checks. First your regulator should look like this, a 70/ later?

Below is simplified diagram

Check that when you pull the green field wire off from the alternator that it STOPS charging. Pull ONLY the green, leave the blue hooked up. If it stops charging, make absolutely sure the regulator is grounded. Clean and scrape the mounting and retighten the bolts.

With the green hooked back up, if it still overcharges, check battery voltage. If it's over 14v with the engine revved, IE way high, 15-16 volts, replace the regulator

 

[cannucky]

yeah it's not black like that bvut it has that shape and blue and green wire's , I'm not at home right now but I will go try those tests and I don't have a meter but I assume the amp meter will suffice for seeing if it is charging or not , my regulator is that goldish pot metal if that tells you anything .

 

[Beatnik]

Put a multi on it and verify voltage with a buddy while he revs it! Check all the usual suspects...should be easy enough to find where/why its spiking!

 

[BillGrissom]

... my regulator is that goldish pot metal ....

You lost me on that, maybe Canada slang. The Vreg case should be formed sheet metal.

First thing to try is clean the ground connection to the Vreg. I always run a dedicated ground wire and coat connections with silicone grease. I don't like the way the factory relied on a rusty sheet-metal screw connections. Maybe run 2 ground wires in your wet region. Usually when you see over-charging it is because the Vreg senses less than true battery voltage, due to drops thru the bulkhead connector and terminals.

 

[cannucky]

well I threw a new Vreg on it and no change so I threw a new alternator on it and voila it's working the way it should , good thing I grabbed the new unit when In picked up the vreg on my way home { damn vreg was a dollar more than the new alternator go figure } as a precaution , I'll probably throw a new battery at it as well just to be safe I'd rather be safe than sorry when driving cross country eh ! As for the slang well it's that goldish anodized stamped metal that isn't what I would call good steel if that makes more sense lol . I like the idea of a dedicated ground tho and I will probably add 1 to the through bolt setup it is using now .

 

[cannucky]

Update talk about crappy chinese parts man 6months and the Voltage Regulator crapped out again , this time it was twitching a little up and down at idle , tried the easy stuff ie checked all grounds and connection but no go , swapped the Standard brand VR for a new Wilsons brand unit and rock steady again , 6 1/2 months old talk aboout a piece of crap , The Wilsons was cheaper too so I guess I better grab a spare , also going to grab a new battery since I didn't get one last time I swapped the VR .

 

[dusterglenn]

Success!

 

[cannucky]

Success!

yeah shes got a tiny little jiggle at idle but rock solid when it's not so we're calling it a succes , unless it craps out in 6 months again then not so much eh lol , still looking to make a deal on those heads and cam with ya there Glenn , I will take parts instead of cash , and will split the intake and carb if you don't want one or the other .

 

[dusterglenn]

Re-remind me what all you have. Shoot me a PM or drop by the store during the week. I'm pretty sure I'll take some of it off your hands. Anything you're looking for in trade?

 

[cannucky]

I have the heads with the comp springs in them , the 268XE cam , lifters , wiend stealth intake , eddy 600 w/electric choke . I call it the Peter Wanker Power pack LOL , I'll be in for some more tranny fluid , Thought I had more at home but one of the 5l jugs was full of used motor oil Doh , the new deep pan ups capacity to like 10 litres so I'm going to be short about 3l . As for what I'm looking for well a pair of shocks , a pinion snubber , trans cooler ,another 904 so I can sell my Willie Wanker probuilt 727 , I don't know what else we can probably figure something out .

 

[klingon]

Mine did the same thing a guy told me run a wire from positive from the alternator right to the positive of the battery use a heavy guage wire mine does not spike anymore he told me that all dodges have to much power going to dash that way you can less power going there

 

[cannucky]

Mine did the same thing a guy told me run a wire from positive from the alternator right to the positive of the battery use a heavy guage wire mine does not spike anymore he told me that all dodges have to much power going to dash that way you can less power going there

Jumping the voltage regulator is not the answer , these systems work the way they do for a reason and need to be maintained properly but hey if you want to cobble your ride then have at her buddy . I'll keep an eye out for the thread where your overcharging battery goes boom .

 

[67Dart273]

Mine did the same thing a guy told me run a wire from positive from the alternator right to the positive of the battery use a heavy guage wire mine does not spike anymore he told me that all dodges have to much power going to dash that way you can less power going there

Jumping the voltage regulator is not the answer , these systems work the way they do for a reason and need to be maintained properly but hey if you want to cobble your ride then have at her buddy . I'll keep an eye out for the thread where your overcharging battery goes boom .

Actually Klingon is partly correct and here is why:

http://www.madelectrical.com/electricaltech/amp-gauges.shtml

But he's not jumpering around the regulator, he's jumpering around the ammeter. There IS however a lot more to it than that. S' why I'm always preaching "voltage drop" a 'thang of which these old girls have plenty of.

 

[cannucky]

Well I always differ to you and Fishy in these matters however reading the article the problems laid out seem to be in relation to modern accessories and the heavier loads they place on the factory system , since I don't use any modern accessories on my cars I prefer to stick with what worked for 45 years now and replace faulty parts instead of cobbling my car even if the result is partially correct as you state .

 

[67Dart273]

instead of cobbling ................ even if the result is partially correct as you state .

Well I guess we are just gonna hafta disagree

First, this is not "cobbling." To put this in perspective let's examine a few real world situations.

1............My 70 440-6 car burned up the ammeter bulkhead terminals and damaged the ammeter in the mostly plastic cluster, way way WAY back in the '70s

Of course we didn't have the www yet and I had no idea (then) that a V code car would some day be worth more than it's weight in gold.

SO I tore apart the dash and sort of rebuilt the ammeter, drilled out the bulkhead connector, and ran larger gauge wiring through there

2............During my time (4 years) at NAS Miramar, helping out other guys, I found OTHER Mopars with similar problems

3............Ma KNEW this circuit strategy was a problem because so called "fleet wiring" EXISTS. This is documented right in the service manuals. Google it up. "Fleet" wiring was done on vehicles with optional 60-65 amp alternators and basically ran larger gauge wiring in through separate grommet in the bulkhead. This did NOTHING for the ammeter, but even Ma started using external shunt ammeters on the "big" cars around 71--72 or so.

4...........If you actually read the MAD article you can find a photo there of a burned up ammeter which appears to be on a pickup truck. "Up here" where people actually USE pickup trucks, I've been into at least 6 Dodge pickups over the years to repair melted (plastic) ammeters. PLEASE BEAR IN MIND that I was never a "pro" fessional mechanic. These were people that asked me about this when I was selling auto parts.

Having spent some years maintaining HVAC, I ran into a LOT of electric furnaces, which use the same 1//4" wide quick connectors as in the bulkhead. In an electric furnace, these only carry nominally 20A and they STILL fail. What this tells me, is that these terminals are GREATLY overloaded in these bulkhead connectors

Not a pretty sight, is it?

http://www.madelectrical.com/electricaltech/amp-gauges.shtml

Here's the thing. I will concede that some old simple stocker of a Mopar, on which a guy has cleaned up wiring problems, and which has a 40? A alternator and no added new headlights, no pumps, fans, big stereos, might just get by with factory wiring.

But if anything was "cobbled" it is the original design, which is lacking right out of the box.

 

[cannucky]

I'll just leave this one with the first line of your response lol , I do respect your knowledge and ability in this field and don't want to drive a wedge between us over this eh , I will certainly keep this thread book marked for future reference .