Anybody using marine trip resettable circuit breakers

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moparmat2000

moparmat2000

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Anybody concider using marine grade trip resettable circuit breakers when doing their headlamp relay mod? Typically if theres an issue with a short they will not let you close them until the problem is fixed.

I think this may be a better idea than fuses as you dont have to replace burnt fuses, just fix the circuit, and reset the breaker. They look really clean in a panel install too. I was thinking of using these for my headlamp relay mod.

I was looking and even saw these with a water resistant cover boot. They are typically panel mount with a round hole. Some even have a raised lip on the breaker button so you can pull and trip them yourself when isolating a circuit to work on it.

At about $8 each they arent cheap as compared to an inline fuse, but they are designed for a marine environment, and need to work every time.

Matt
 
Using them but not for headlights.
 

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I would think auto reset is what you want.........just like the factory

Think about how much fun it'll be if one of those trips.......doing 70......on a dark night......on a two lane......with brights coming at ya........
 
67Dart273 said:
I would think auto reset is what you want.........just like the factory

Think about how much fun it'll be if one of those trips.......doing 70......on a dark night......on a two lane......with brights coming at ya........
Click to expand...

Wouldn't the other case be a burnt wire? I'm not getting smart, just asking.
 
Well you have to make "adjustments." Let's say a wire shorts. The breaker trips. Well, you are screwed. So you are no worse off in this case with a manual reset, because "you are done."

But if say, a wire "touches" you know, scrapes/ abraids off the insulation and sparks for a bit, and trips the breaker. MAYbe you'll get lucky, the wire will vibrate off the short from wind, bumps, road vibration, etc, and when the thing resets, MAYbe you'll have enough lights to get safely stopped as in blinck...ka...bli........BLINCK etc

But in this case if the thing trips, (manual) you are done, you have no lights, and it ain't comin back

If the auto breaker is sized correctly, it won't cause the wire to melt, it will just sit there and click, like a flasher
 
Definitely worth looking into. What is the highest auto breaker amperage you've seen come on a chrysler? And in what circuit was it?
 
Run redundant circuits for low and high beam. Lows go out, click to high and hopefully they work to get slowed up/pulled over
 
Those circuit breakers will cycle only a limited number of times before failing completely. Circuit protection is meant to prevent fires. Resetting circuit breakers equal striking match after match in my opinion.
 
RedFish said:
Those circuit breakers will cycle only a limited number of times before failing completely. Circuit protection is meant to prevent fires. Resetting circuit breakers equal striking match after match in my opinion.
Click to expand...

Hi Redfish,

The ones i was looking at are a manual reset. If you ran your lights with relays and a fuse, when the fuse pops its like a manual reset breaker popping anyway, except you need to carry spare fuses. Either way your headlamps are gonna go out if theres a problem.

Yes, you want to wire the circuits with seperate circuit breakers for high and low beam. Thats the smart thing to do. I am just thinking about the issue of being out in the middle of nowhere, and not having spare fuses. Or burning em all up trying to figure out the problem while on the side of the road.

But you bring up a good point, is there a cycle life on them, and what is it? Does that depend on the brand? Obviously chinese ***** gonna prob fail faster, but at what rate? If your wiring is routed properly, and wrapped, how often is this issue really going to come up. I have seen some awful wiring jobs myself tho, so i guess it does.

Matt
 
Any amperage reccommendations?
I believe crackedback mentioned 10A going into the relays from the headlamp and high beam output legs, and 20A protecting the circuits going out.
 
moparmat2000 said:
Hi Redfish,

The ones i was looking at are a manual reset. If you ran your lights with relays and a fuse, when the fuse pops its like a manual reset breaker popping anyway, except you need to carry spare fuses. Either way your headlamps are gonna go out if theres a problem.

Yes, you want to wire the circuits with seperate circuit breakers for high and low beam. Thats the smart thing to do. I am just thinking about the issue of being out in the middle of nowhere, and not having spare fuses. Or burning em all up trying to figure out the problem while on the side of the road.

But you bring up a good point, is there a cycle life on them, and what is it? Does that depend on the brand? Obviously chinese ***** gonna prob fail faster, but at what rate? If your wiring is routed properly, and wrapped, how often is this issue really going to come up. I have seen some awful wiring jobs myself tho, so i guess it does.

Matt
Click to expand...
Too many factors to state a number of cycles. Same applies to those manual reset breakers in your home panel.
Here's the thing... The headlight circuit itself wasn't fused at all from OEM. A serious fault should open the fusible link and stop the entire vehicle. Beyond that, The original headlight switch does have thermal protection built in. When those got weak from age or for whatever reason, you would be riding along and BAM lights out. There's a moment of panic, WTF, and the lights come on again. Those too would go total failure after some number of cycles. So... Add another similar devise to the circuit if you want. Which will open first ? How will you know which is the fault ?
 
Aaah gotcha. If the lamp switch has a thermal protector, then running with relays i am sure would help keep the load off the switch. The 12V battery hot going to the headlight relays should probably have their own circuit protection i would imagine. 20A im thinking.
 
Used them on my motorcycle. Only place to mount circuit breakers was tucked behind the oil tank, can't even see them never mind reach them.
 
My plan is to mount the breakers and relays in a water resistant project box mounted upside down under the battery tray. The lid will hinge open with everything surface mounted to it, but not acessable until the lid is opened and use 1/4 turn fasteners. In this way its hidden, and accessable, and helps keep moisture out.
 
I run self resetting breakers for the entire main electrical system and then the cabin is also on fuses for the details. (stereo, interior lights, dash lights and such)
I also installed a headlight relay set, but used 4 separate relays (one for each bulb filament) so if I loose a relay it will only affect one function of one bulb.
It wont shut down both bulbs on high or low beam either one.

The self resetting relay handles the heavier loads like the starting and charging system, electric fan, ignition and headlights
(You know, the important stuff) just fine.

Del feels I should have the main relay for the entire system capable of handling the same amperage as the alternator can put out in case the alternator needs to charge wide open at some point, but the 30 amp in there has never tripped yet in two years so I figure if everything can run through it under normal max load conditions then the lower the trip amps the better.

I have run everything you can think of in the car all at the same time without ever having it trip.

The headlights relays are connected directly to the downstream side of the breaker with 8ga wire run directly to the headlight relays with 8ga grounds from the bulb sockets right to the radiator support as is the electric fan, so those are both live all the time.
The fan is completely automatic no matter if the ignition is on or not, and the headlights, markers, tail and brake lights. (like original) they can come on without the ignition needing to be on.
 
moparmat2000 said:
Any amperage reccommendations?
I believe crackedback mentioned 10A going into the relays from the headlamp and high beam output legs, and 20A protecting the circuits going out.
Click to expand...

Not me...

I use a 30A fuse in my stuff in each circuit.
 
inkjunkie said:
Hey Matt

Busy. Working on my smoker project. Seems like I make 4 steps forward and 4.5 steps back. Learning a ton.
How's tricks?
Click to expand...

Smoker project sounds like fun. Our big deal out here is beef brisket. As far as me, I'm just working in the blasted Texas heat. Yesterday i got off work, the digital in dash air temp gage in my DD read 110° at 3:30pm. Needless to say, i stay indoors after i get off work. I am rounding up parts for my project. When temps start getting down into the high 80s i will get back out there again.

We currently have a heat advisory till next wednesday. I have a 5 gallon water barrel i fill with ice every day for the guys who work for me. I am on them about making sure they drink enough, i brief em daily about this and about if they feel dizzy or weak to go sit down w a cup of water in the office or break room and take a break. I dont need anybody getting heatstroke.
 
Heres another question when sizing fuses or circuit breakers. If you are lets say using halogens on a relay circuit w 12 gage wire, that are 70W high beam per lamp × 2 lamps in the circuit, and you divide the 140W total by input voltage @ 13.5V , that should give you 10.37 Amp draw under normal conditions. So wouldent a 15A fuse, or circuit breaker be sufficient for this circuit?

If low beams were lets say 55W x 2 lamps divided by 13.5V = 8.15A , then wouldent a 10A or 15A fuse or breaker be sufficient in this circuit as well.

If these amp draw numbers above are for normal operation of the hypothetical wattage in the circuits i just described figuring in amps going up a bit with heat soak from the engine compartment then wouldent the fuse or breaker amperage numbers i listed be sufficient for normal operation without any issues?

The point of the fuse or breaker is to blow quickly before a dead ahort in the wiring over amps to the point that the covering is melting. Too high of a fuse or breaker and damage to the wiring starts before it pops.

Matt
 
Your thinking is OK in some ways but you don't want to get the fuses "too close." Fuses can blow unexpectedly, which is why I think you should stick with auto reset breakers on important stuff like lights. You just don't want them to blow unless it IS a serious failure.

No 12 ga wire is going to melt with a 20A fuse.
 
Hi 67dart273,

I am looking at circuit breakers instead of fuses. I like that idea better. Will prob go with the weather resistant boat type. They are manual reset, however if i have an issue where the lows go out while driving, i will just kick the high beams on until i can get to where i can look at it. My numbers did work out based on hypothetical. I am thinking now like you were saying to bump the amp rating on the fuse a bit as a 20A rated one per circuit with a short to ground will pop before any wire damage on a 12 ga wire. Ir maybe a 20A for highs, 15A for lows..
 
Doing as crackedback suggested, IE having a relay for hi, and one for low, AND SUPPLYING EACH relay separate is a tremendously great idea. If you DO suffer a failure, you can likely punch the dimmer switch, and still have the "other" set of beams
 
Thats my game plan. Was originally from the get go. 2 relays each fused seperately and attached to an accessory buss bar. One relay and circuit for hi beams, one relay and circuit for low beams.
 
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