Big Block Strokers - How big should we go?

-
Dart Sport 360

Dart Sport 360

Wanna Race?
Joined
Oct 15, 2011
Messages
658
Reaction score
34
Location
Orangeville, Ontario
Hey,

We are thinking of building a stroker bottom end for our drag truck. Right now its a .060 over 440 with Indy SR heads, indy single plane and Pro Systems 1050. The cam is .690 lift.

We have a Mega Block with a window in the side.... I pushed a rod through it a while back and its damaged really low near pan flange. We have sent it to a place that welds blocks to see if it can be fixed.

We were thinking if it can be fixed we would buy a rotating assembly and then use the cam and heads we have now.

My questions is how big would you go? Its a drag race application in a 3800lb truck. 499, 511, 472 541, 572.....

Also would you suggest a kit? I was looking at the Ohio Crankshaft site and the eagle kits on JEGS. I know 440 source but I am not sure if the quality is on par with the others.

So there are pro/cons for each displacement.... Bigger may not be better. I'm curious what you think would work best with the cam and heads we have.

Thanks guys!

:burnout:
 
I'm pretty sure b0b is right. With those heads, the first three.

440 Source is on a par with Eagle for sure, I've used them both. I know nothing of Ohio.

Whoa, Indy makes a SR head for the hemi, are we talking wedge or hemi?
 
What it you target speed/times that you want to run?This is just for reference,, 65 Belvedere,451 (B) stroker,3500 stall,4.10 gears,full street dress with me in it 3825 lbs.Ran a 11.90 @ 110 mph.
I am interested in your post as I have a 499 (RB) Indy short block that is planned to go in a early B for N/SS class. Sounds like the combo is close to yours with the same aprox weight.
 
The combo now runs 11.0's @ 119 with 456's shifting @ 6200. Goes thru @ 6500... I think it has a bit more in it with some converter fine tuning...

Its a 440 wedge now, bored 0.060 over.

Target is Faster.... It would be nice to be around a 10.70 in the summer heat. Faster is better...

Our combo now made 565hp to the wheels with our old tunnel ram setup. Not sure how much we lost if any by going to the single.

Heres the video of the dyno pulls...

[ame="http://youtu.be/lAZDymvlKv0"]http://youtu.be/lAZDymvlKv0[/ame]

Thanks for the input, please keep it coming. I'll look into the 512 build more. I see the big strokes need external oil plumbing so I think I'll stay away from that.
 
I used an Eagle crank, Scat rods and KB pistons in my 500 low deck. If I had it to do over I would have ordered the package from 440 source. The crank was so heavy they had to machine the counterweights, and they ended up taking off too much and had to add mallory metal. The 440 source kits are sold as balanced assemblies, so they are pretty close right out of the box. With the raised deck I would go with a 4.25 stroke crank, and whatever bore size you want and the megablock will accept. With those heads you should have lots of flow to feed the extra cubes.
 
Can't help with the source for your parts but as far as cubic inches, i'd spend some time researching the rod ratios of those combos and also would lean towards the chevy journal size.
 
I had a 440 Source rotating assy and sold it cause I didn't like the crank quality. Now have a Eagle crank and rods, 4.250 / 7.100 with chebby journals. Went with 4.500 bore on the World block to unshroud the valves. Worked OK with 10.720 deck. Custom pistons, oil ring is not "in the hole".
 
inkjunkie said:
Go big or go home.....
Click to expand...

right? I only did the 512kit because I didn't want to deal with the oil pickup issues. little did I know I would be going with an external anyways! :banghead:

number 2 with the mega block it will handle all you can throw at it so might as well go big, more tq at a lower rpm is always good.

roccodart440 said:
Can't help with the source for your parts but as far as cubic inches, i'd spend some time researching the rod ratios of those combos and also would lean towards the chevy journal size.
Click to expand...

I think all the 440 source kits are chevy journal
 
we built a 540 for the satellite
440 source- lower end and heads
it has a internal oil pick-up

017.jpg


this is the first full pass it has made
got to work on the e-85
was still lean, on top end

left in 2nd gear, due to cold track (55*)
leaving in 1st, blows the tires off

[ame=http://i267.photobucket.com/albums/ii313/draginmopars/white%20dart%202/006-1.mp4]
th_006-1.jpg
[/ame]
 
First is to see if the block can be fixed.

I'm going to talk to our builder and see what he suggests also i want to talk to Pro Systems because I don't want to go bigger then what that carb can handle.

Thanks for the input.
 
It depends on what you want... you're trapping at 6500 and IMO the SRs will not support a bigger engine at that rpm. If this is a place holder - smaller would be better IMO. B wedge 470 or 451. If you are looking to invest in a real block and go from there I'd recommend a change in approach: Plan to re-gear (4.10-4.30s) and re-converotor and build the biggest you can afford. Plan to sell the top end (or place holder) and invest in something that has more ability like the -13s or B1s. the thought being as a bracket truck you want consistency and less maintenance and a big rpm engine just needs more and is less likely to be consistent in mixed weather. Might even want to consider E85 or methanol for it.

Edit for the entire top end re-use - another 440 would mean no new intake needed.
 
the sr's can flow some decent numbers mine flowed 355@700 with the 2.19 intake valves. that being said I still agree with bob on the 472,499 or 511
 
Thanks guys, I'm going to do more research on the 512. I think we are making pretty good numbers with our stock stroke. I don't want to end up going backwards. Most of the 512 builds on the net are street motors with 10:1 and smaller cams. I'd like to see some numbers with 12:1 and a cam closer to .690.

60 extra cubes don't seem like much but I guess there are big tq gains.
 
It's the torque from the longer stroke that creates that and it allows you to go milder in terms of wear and tear. I think you were doing great with the 440 too, but for a bracket type car I'd go as big as I could afford and plan to not open the hood much.
 
Dart Sport 360 said:
Thanks guys, I'm going to do more research on the 512. I think we are making pretty good numbers with our stock stroke. I don't want to end up going backwards. Most of the 512 builds on the net are street motors with 10:1 and smaller cams. I'd like to see some numbers with 12:1 and a cam closer to .690.

60 extra cubes don't seem like much but I guess there are big tq gains.
Click to expand...

granted these are hemi's but here is a 472 and a 528, cam was only bigger in the 528 to offset cubes (think + 5-10*)

the 472 made 700 and the 528 made 772hp, both around same area. I don't know where greg is hiding the dyno sheet for the 472 currently.
 

Attachments

  • SCAN0001.jpg
    144 KB · Views: 719
the 511/512(the math makes the difference) 4.250" stroke, 4.375 bore", aluminum(426) rods 7.230" long and a 1.30" deck height flat top pistons. mill the heads to get the compression up, way up, makes for a real torque monster because of the long rod. external oil systems are your friend.
 
Dart Sport 360 said:
Thanks guys, I'm going to do more research on the 512. I think we are making pretty good numbers with our stock stroke. I don't want to end up going backwards. Most of the 512 builds on the net are street motors with 10:1 and smaller cams. I'd like to see some numbers with 12:1 and a cam closer to .690.

60 extra cubes don't seem like much but I guess there are big tq gains.
Click to expand...

I'm running a 440source 512 kit in a lowdeck with 13.5:1 and OOTB Stealth heads. The cam is a .600 solid roller.

The 3400lb race weight car has run a best of 10.20 @ 130mph.

No complaints about the combo. I purposely choked it down with the OOTB heads to keep from blasting into the 9s, and all that entails for NHRA certification.
 
ab7fh said:
I'm running a 440source 512 kit in a lowdeck with 13.5:1 and OOTB Stealth heads. The cam is a .600 solid roller.

The 3400lb race weight car has run a best of 10.20 @ 130mph.

No complaints about the combo. I purposely choked it down with the OOTB heads to keep from blasting into the 9s, and all that entails for NHRA certification.
Click to expand...

I like that post right there! Thanks!

Getting the new found torque to the ground will be the next thing...

Fingers crossed that they can save our block!
 
.................I never build bigger than I think the rest of the package can support, after all u don't want to change ur whole combo..........bob is spot on..................kim........
 
Mopar 4.15 8 bolt crank.
Eagle H-beam rods.
Ross Pistons.
300 Pass's/
Freshened up 2 twice.

Wheels up.
 
Got bad new this week......... the mega block is officially a boat anchor. The block repair guy said it wasn't worth saving. 2k to fix and no guarantee on how strong it will be.

Sucks.

I guess we could use our stock block for its not in the cards for this winter. We are going to try a converter swap and see how that effects it.

Thanks for everyone input.
 
I'm really happy with my stroker build so far. It's a .040 over '76 440 block with a K1 4.150" Chevy rod pin (2.20") crank. Used Scat BBC 6.800" rods, and Diamond custom blower pistons that are a 1.85" compression height. Mocked everything up, and had zero clearance issues. There was better than .090" everywhere, even between the oil pump boss and connecting rod. The machine shop did take quite a bit of weight out of the counterweights on the crank, but it balanced very well. I chose to go with a Milodon single line external oiling system, however.... Personal choice.

I feel this will be a very solid build, when all said and done. I may have went a little overboard with some of it... But better more, than not enough imo.
 
The heads are simply going to make a big motor run strong at low rpms, a big advantage in torque. A 572 with SR heads will shift at about 6,000 rpm, and be very easy on valve train parts because of it. It also will have more torque and power on average due to the torque coming in so soon. You just can't beat cubes, given the same heads. I have run 535 cubes with ported 906 heads, 3400 lb car, 10.20s with a 4.10 gear and huge 33 inch tall tires. Shifting at 5700. this combo had a lot wrong with it as well. I could easily put it into the nines today, based on what I have learned since.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
-

Back
Top