cranks but no spark at coil

-
Something like a #8 gauge insulated butt connector should work. It is not easy to guess gauge in photo. Heat Shrink Butt Connector Red 8 Gauge - Bt-8hs - Heat Shrink Butt Connectors - Butt Connectors
If you need #6 Ace 6 AWG Insulated Butt Connector - Wire Clips & Connectors - Ace Hardware
You will also need decent large crimp tool.
I would cut back the crap soldered ends, clean copper with clean 3m green pad, crimp lower 2 in one end, the upper 3 in other. Slip additional heat sink first, use it as secondary insulation and seal.
 
Thanks KC. Amazing how expensive heat shrink connectors are!
There is actually a total of 6 red wires. 2 bottom ones (need replacing) and 4 in the top. Im thinking of one of these. Got this pic from Mad Electrical website.
Looks sturdy and simple. Any experience with these?
Thanks for chiming in.
KitCarlson said:
Something like a #8 gauge insulated butt connector should work. It is not easy to guess gauge in photo. Heat Shrink Butt Connector Red 8 Gauge - Bt-8hs - Heat Shrink Butt Connectors - Butt Connectors
If you need #6 Ace 6 AWG Insulated Butt Connector - Wire Clips & Connectors - Ace Hardware
You will also need decent large crimp tool.
I would cut back the crap soldered ends, clean copper with clean 3m green pad, crimp lower 2 in one end, the upper 3 in other. Slip additional heat sink first, use it as secondary insulation and seal.
Click to expand...

cn-1_s15.jpeg
 
4spdragtop said:
Sorry for the translation Del.
#4. When I run a wire and connect coil -ve to battery -ve and try for spark from coil tower wire to ground, I get nothing. Thats with everything hooked up and key on.
I repeat above test with ecu unplugged and I get spark BUT its coming from the coil -ve to battery -ve . Nothing from coil tower wire.
Fn intermittent ****.
You can see in pics the wires are a little shabby but none are broken, the plastic is brittle and falling off but wires show continuity.
#2. Coil -ve to ground 1.4V key on
#3 Coil +ve to ground 7.4 V(key on)
Click to expand...

??

What means "When I run a wire and connect coil -ve to battery -ve"

The coil NEG terminal connects only to the ECU. You don't hook it to battery or ground or anything else. The only other thing hooked to coil NEG besides the factory ECU wire is a tach if you have one, and IF you do, I would unhook that
 
"When I run a wire" means a jumper wire. I ran a jumper wire from coil -ve to ground to spark test (as per manual)
67Dart273 said:
??

What means "When I run a wire and connect coil -ve to battery -ve"

The coil NEG terminal connects only to the ECU. You don't hook it to battery or ground or anything else. The only other thing hooked to coil NEG besides the factory ECU wire is a tach if you have one, and IF you do, I would unhook that
Click to expand...
But my coil -ve does have 3 wires connected to it and 1 to coil +ve.
 
OK so you are grounding coil NEG terminal? All that does is simulate points closing "as if you have points" and it really does not prove very much

If the coil is getting power through the key/ ballast/ wiring, AND IF the ECU is not shorting that to ground....as in ....the ECU has a problem, than grounding that terminal should indeed make a spark.

BUT if there is a problem in the ECU and you leave it connected, it might be that it will lead you down the wrong road

IMPORTANT!!!! If you have no tach, there should be only ONE WIRE hooked to coil NEG. If you have three there, it MIGHT be that you have the coil terminals REVERSED, and that meals grounding that terminal in a test is INDEED leading you wrong.

I see you bought a new harness? What I'd do is rig this up on the bench with the coil, ballast, and distributor and a battery and make sure everything works there

If you have a few alligator clip leads, you don't even need the harness
 
No spark from coil???

67Dart273 said:
Here's a post I made about the simplest way I know to get across testing the ECU/ ignition parts

You need a coil, the ECU and the distributor

Lay it out on the bench. Follow the diagram. Find the two distributor pickup terminals on the ECU. Hook them to the distributor

Hook the ECU case to battery NEG

Coil does NOT need grounded

Distributor does NOT need grounded.

Hook coil + to the power lead terminal on the ECU. Get a clip lead hooked there and let dangle. This is your battery "hot" when you are ready

Hook something from coil "case" to a probe for testing spark.

Hook up your power clip lead. Twist the distributor shaft while holding the test probe near the coil tower. The thing should make sparks

If not, unhook distributor. Take first one, then the other pickup clip leads, and "tap tap" ground them at the battery connection. Coil should make 1 spark each time you do so.

If not, try another coil. If that does not fix it replace the ECU

IF you hook it all up and it WORKS, then there is something AFU in the car harness. SUSPECT a bad ECU connector OR a bad DISTRIBUTOR connector
=============================================
This is all you need to test the basics of the ignition. You can easily test the ballast separate. A battery, the ECU, distributor and a coil, and of course some test leads

2ai0wsj.jpg


Below, the basic diagram for a 4 pin ECU

166lmj7.jpg


Below, the wire for testing spark. I use my 12V test light. No, LOL the spark won't blow up the bulb

166lmj7.jpg


Below, the ground connection. ALL you need is one wire from batt NEG to the ECU case

xawjl.jpg


Below, the two distributor connections. In the car these are polarity sensitive, but for testing does not matter

b3opvm.jpg


Below, the coil NEG connection

6jfywp.jpg


Below, battery PLUS connection, one wire to this terminal of ECU and jumpered over to + side of coil


11lqu5l.jpg


Below, all hooked up and ready to test (except for battery ground). Should produce sparks at least 3/8" and typically 1/2" long

1zzoya0.jpg


Below, distributor "one wire" test. I have removed the other distributor wire for simplicity. Take the bare connector end or this clip lead (the yellow) and with everything hooked up, ground it repeatedly. Each grounding should result in a spark (In this photo you need to hook up the ECU ground wire, I left it off for the photo)

vgitld.jpg
Click to expand...
 
See if this works. GAWD I "love" the "new improved" software

Here's a post I made about the simplest way I know to get across testing the ECU/ ignition parts

You need a coil, the ECU and the distributor

Lay it out on the bench. Follow the diagram. Find the two distributor pickup terminals on the ECU. Hook them to the distributor

Hook the ECU case to battery NEG

Coil does NOT need grounded

Distributor does NOT need grounded.

Hook coil + to the power lead terminal on the ECU. Get a clip lead hooked there and let dangle. This is your battery "hot" when you are ready

Hook something from coil "case" to a probe for testing spark.

Hook up your power clip lead. Twist the distributor shaft while holding the test probe near the coil tower. The thing should make sparks

If not, unhook distributor. Take first one, then the other pickup clip leads, and "tap tap" ground them at the battery connection. Coil should make 1 spark each time you do so.

If not, try another coil. If that does not fix it replace the ECU

IF you hook it all up and it WORKS, then there is something AFU in the car harness. SUSPECT a bad ECU connector OR a bad DISTRIBUTOR connector
=============================================
This is all you need to test the basics of the ignition. You can easily test the ballast separate. A battery, the ECU, distributor and a coil, and of course some test leads

2ai0wsj.jpg


Below, the basic diagram for a 4 pin ECU

166lmj7.jpg


Below, the wire for testing spark. I use my 12V test light. No, LOL the spark won't blow up the bulb

166lmj7.jpg


Below, the ground connection. ALL you need is one wire from batt NEG to the ECU case

xawjl.jpg


Below, the two distributor connections. In the car these are polarity sensitive, but for testing does not matter

b3opvm.jpg


Below, the coil NEG connection

6jfywp.jpg


Below, battery PLUS connection, one wire to this terminal of ECU and jumpered over to + side of coil


11lqu5l.jpg


Below, all hooked up and ready to test (except for battery ground). Should produce sparks at least 3/8" and typically 1/2" long

1zzoya0.jpg


Below, distributor "one wire" test. I have removed the other distributor wire for simplicity. Take the bare connector end or this clip lead (the yellow) and with everything hooked up, ground it repeatedly. Each grounding should result in a spark (In this photo you need to hook up the ECU ground wire, I left it off for the photo)

vgitld.jpg
 
Thanks Del, yes 3 wires in total to coil -ve. And there is an aftermarket tach, so that accounts for one of the "extra" wires running to coil -ve.
Damn, I was "positive" I had all coil wires hooked back up correctly.
Ok , so I just dbl checked wires to coil -ve. They are all correct. The "extra" wire is a light green one that runs from coil -ve to "electronic speed switch" part # 4111925 (see pics). Tach wire is going to stay unhooked for now until I got problem(s) resolved.
I feel like I keep moving backwards with this, the cuda is so much easier to work on. I think Ive got bruised ribs from leaning over the front of this damned truck.
On the hunt for a 6 wire "block" to connect the 6 red wires.
Thanks Del.

20170928_084329.jpg


20170928_085146.jpg
 
Steve until you get it running I would unhook ANYTHING not directly associated with ignition at the coil
 
I was wondering whether I should turn this into a for sale ad( and I still might lol). But I got it running. I got the new ECU harness "wired in" temporarily. Nothing in town here at hardware store, or parts store for a "bulk terminal", so I Macgyvered/cobbled the 6 red together to at least try to start again. Ring terminals on all 6 and threaded together with nut/bolt/washer. I will get a proper junction asap. At least its running and now I can try to get it running decent. And make a run or 2 to the dump....might just leave it there....
Looks horrific under the hood! My goal is to eventually pull the 360(needs regasketing at the very least) and clean up under the hood A LOT!
I got looking and quite a few wires under the hood need replacing. (split jackets)
Thanks for everyones patience. I can only imagine how difficult it is to relay good sound advice/info to us/me thick headed electrically challenged members.
Any good sources for repop harness? I tried M&H, Rock Auto, JC Whitney, and have come up empty.

20170928_132525.jpg


20170928_132534.jpg


20170928_132538.jpg
 
Well Del, whatever the "fix" it was temporary. It loses spark from coil after running a bit(5 min).
I had it running tonight. Hood up, idle up a bit and I was watching under the hood. Then it just quit.
I unplugged coil wire at dist cap, had Lori turn it over. ..no spark.
Wiggled wire in coil and saw a spark from coil tower.
Key off and r and r the wire from coil. Had Lori turn it over again and sparked from coil wire properly.
Hooked to distributor and fired right up. Lasted less than a minute then quit again.
Batt V static 12.75
Ballast resistance 1.7 ( was 0.7 before)???
Red ballast wire(unhooked)12.25V key on
Dist leads harness side 8.7 Mega Ohm resistance? ? (With everthing hooked up)Wtf?? ECU cooked?
Resistance at ECU cavities 4&5, key off everything hooked up 278 Ohms.(fsm states between 150& 900) so good.

I thought I had it beat with the new harness. It needed it anyway so no loss, but frustrating as heck as "spark check" at coil wire is hit n miss.
Very limited time with helper to test anything in crank.
MP ECU is $50 and a day away if I order one.
Thanks again Del
67Dart273 said:
So what do you think was the problem?
Click to expand...
 
Well turns out to be the reluctor (see pic). I had another complete distributor here, so took it partially apart and cleaned and verified good. Connected dist leads to volt meter and spun the distributor. Measured approx1v ac. Also continuity test and beeped between signals while spinniing. So all good.
Getting the dist hold.down bolt in made me question my sanity.
Thanks to all, much appreciated!
Prospector lives for now.

20171006_173256.jpg


20171006_173305.jpg
 
I'm guessing that's a powder metal product and the RP has dried out allowing it to pickup water and rust. Normally the center of the part is a lower density (softer) area in a PM part. That might explain the deeper chipping around the center.
Just sayin'.
 
I shoulda listened earlier in this thread and looked at reluctor better. I know before I installed bad distributor that I set gap to .008. I shoulda noticed at that point im not sure what the reluctor is made out of??
I removed and wirewheeled the one that is currently in truck.
Ribs are bruised from leaning over the fender lol. The 2 oil sensors right by the distributor dont make it easy either.
What a difference from car vs truck.
Neighbor came out as soon as it fired. Lol and yelled hallelujah
Daves69 said:
I'm guessing that's a powder metal product and the RP has dried out allowing it to pickup water and rust. Normally the center of the part is a lower density (softer) area in a PM part. That might explain the deeper chipping around the center.
Just sayin'.
Click to expand...
.
 
67Dart273 said:
See if this works. GAWD I "love" the "new improved" software

Here's a post I made about the simplest way I know to get across testing the ECU/ ignition parts

You need a coil, the ECU and the distributor

Lay it out on the bench. Follow the diagram. Find the two distributor pickup terminals on the ECU. Hook them to the distributor

Hook the ECU case to battery NEG

Coil does NOT need grounded

Distributor does NOT need grounded.

Hook coil + to the power lead terminal on the ECU. Get a clip lead hooked there and let dangle. This is your battery "hot" when you are ready

Hook something from coil "case" to a probe for testing spark.

Hook up your power clip lead. Twist the distributor shaft while holding the test probe near the coil tower. The thing should make sparks

If not, unhook distributor. Take first one, then the other pickup clip leads, and "tap tap" ground them at the battery connection. Coil should make 1 spark each time you do so.

If not, try another coil. If that does not fix it replace the ECU

IF you hook it all up and it WORKS, then there is something AFU in the car harness. SUSPECT a bad ECU connector OR a bad DISTRIBUTOR connector
=============================================
This is all you need to test the basics of the ignition. You can easily test the ballast separate. A battery, the ECU, distributor and a coil, and of course some test leads

View attachment 1715095414

Below, the basic diagram for a 4 pin ECU

View attachment 1715095415

Below, the wire for testing spark. I use my 12V test light. No, LOL the spark won't blow up the bulb

View attachment 1715095416

Below, the ground connection. ALL you need is one wire from batt NEG to the ECU case

View attachment 1715095417

Below, the two distributor connections. In the car these are polarity sensitive, but for testing does not matter

View attachment 1715095418

Below, the coil NEG connection

View attachment 1715095419

Below, battery PLUS connection, one wire to this terminal of ECU and jumpered over to + side of coil


View attachment 1715095420

Below, all hooked up and ready to test (except for battery ground). Should produce sparks at least 3/8" and typically 1/2" long

View attachment 1715095421

Below, distributor "one wire" test. I have removed the other distributor wire for simplicity. Take the bare connector end or this clip lead (the yellow) and with everything hooked up, ground it repeatedly. Each grounding should result in a spark (In this photo you need to hook up the ECU ground wire, I left it off for the photo)

View attachment 1715095422
Click to expand...

Testing.............trying to get this bloody god damn "improved software" to operate
 
Reviving your thread Steve!
Today I wanted to start my 76 dually. It's a 383 that drove to where it sits.......months ago though.
So I try to start it and low and behold, it acts like no spark. So I searched the forum and went through a few threads. I ended in this one. I thought I was chasing the same symptoms. Anyway, I pulled a plug and sure enough nothing. So as described here, I tested the coil + and - to ground and had power during both start and run. Then I thought OK poor ground on ECU. I removed it and cleaned and ensured there would be a ground. Install......nothing. But I had another ECU that I had dug out and did some tests on both of them prior to this. My "new" one had continuity to ground on the terminal Del has the red lead on in this pic. The old one did not. This must be the negative in the circuit. Installed the new ECU and varoom. It roared to life. I was wondering if the short could be repaired, but that goop in the back kinda says NO! I do have one of those Chrysler ignition testing boxes, but it doesn't work. No power upon hooking up to the battery. :(

Anyway, thanx guys. As usual, FABO solved another Mopar conundrum.

b3opvm.jpg
 
Digging these apart is a chore and likely to end in failure. I've done two and on both, either broke something like a resistor, or the epoxy "dragged" some of a capacitor encapsulation out with the potting material.
 
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